Switchgrass

[chronic]

You guys really know how to hurt a guy. I broadcast switchgrass on my area in Jan/Feb? Had a little snow on it, very little rain, lots of hot wind and high temps. Long story short, it never came up, i'm sure it was never moist enough at the right time to sprout it. Area was sprayed with banvil and 24d sometime this summer, maybe June? Here is the question. If adequate moisture is available at the right time next year, what are the chances that those switchgrass seeds will grow?

[LoessHillsArcher]

We seeded areas in April of 2010. Nothing grew that year that we knew of besides a massive amount of foxtail and weeds. This spring, out of no-where, switchgrass was popping up! So there's a very very good chance it grew and you didn't notice it... how was your weed control in that area?

[chronic]

LoessHillArcher, I don't know how to put it, other than after the spraying of banvil and 24d, there was no moisture anywhere to be found so there was no need for further weed control. Nothing grew, we are in an exceptional drought area in extreme southwest kansas. I don't think it germinated. I wonder if it still has a chance to germinate in the spring of 2012?

[Scott]

If it wasn't cost prohibitive I would replant. Seed is probably still there but who knows for sure. It would drive me nuts to go two years and still not have switch.

[LoessHillsArcher]

Hmm, I'm with Scott. Perhaps reseeding might be a safe idea. I don't have any experience with the drought conditions like you mention. One thing is for sure, seeding native grasses takes tons of patience and our first fields we'd have sworn were failures but they came through a couple years down the road. I can't say we had the drought like you did though.

[dbltree]

LoessHillArcher, I don't know how to put it, other than after the spraying of banvil and 24d, there was no moisture anywhere to be found so there was no need for further weed control. Nothing grew, we are in an exceptional drought area in extreme southwest kansas. I don't think it germinated. I wonder if it still has a chance to germinate in the spring of 2012?

2-4D should not be applied until NWSG seedlings have 3-4 leaves so it's also possible you may have affected germination of the seed by applying herbicides too early. Hard to say but if nothing grew at all i might be inclined to add more seed although just for fun I would leave a marked area as is and see if anything comes up next year?

Sounds like a very difficult year in your area...;)

[Jbohn]

Ok last year I broadcasted my CIR in April , nothing came up I just sprayed the field with Round Up 24d to get a fall kill, OK I am planning on broadcasting more CIR this November, My issue is I have some johnsongrass in the field, My thoughts are to Fire burn all the trash off in April and Spray the field again the first of May with GLY to Kill the Johnson grass before the switch germinates I also hear I could spray with fusilade II that will kill the johnsongrass and not the CIR, what would you guys do, I had a pile of Johnson Grass 17 acre field the whole filed edge was fo foot wide and 8ft tall with the stuff. How can I control the johnson grass if it comes up n my stand

[dbltree]

Ok last year I broadcasted my CIR in April , nothing came up I just sprayed the field with Round Up 24d to get a fall kill, OK I am planning on broadcasting more CIR this November, My issue is I have some johnsongrass in the field, My thoughts are to Fire burn all the trash off in April and Spray the field again the first of May with GLY to Kill the Johnson grass before the switch germinates I also hear I could spray with fusilade II that will kill the johnsongrass and not the CIR, what would you guys do, I had a pile of Johnson Grass 17 acre field the whole filed edge was fo foot wide and 8ft tall with the stuff. How can I control the johnson grass if it comes up n my stand

April is too late to "frost seed"...best time frame is late January thru mid March but late November thru December will also work. Personally I would not bother seeding until I had the JG 100% killed off because it will be very difficult to kill while trying to establish switch at the same time.

Fulisade I think will kill all grasses including switch but I haven't tried that combination yet? Outrider can be used on JG but I would use glyphosate and Oust XP until the place was a desert and then frost seed switch the following winter. Another option is to plant RR soybeans the first year and keep spraying gly all summer long. JG is nasty stuff so concentrate on killing it first...;)

[Hardwood11]

In Minnesota the pheasant population is down 60%. Not on my farm. We have a great combination of switchgrass and tree rows along with restored wetlands and food plots.

The Switch and corn rows...along with rows of Cedar, Spruce, Plum, Chokecherry and other shrubs that border cattail sloughs and creeks, will help keep birds alive during the winter.

Photo of my youngest son on his first pheasant hunt, along with our new puppy on her fist hunt. It was priceless to see them both hunt together!!

[Qdmaer]

In Minnesota the pheasant population is down 60%. Not on my farm. We have a great combination of switchgrass and tree rows along with restored wetlands and food plots.

The Switch and corn rows...along with rows of Cedar, Spruce, Plum, Chokecherry and other shrubs that border cattail sloughs and creeks, will help keep birds alive during the winter.

Photo of my youngest son on his first pheasant hunt, along with our new puppy on her fist hunt. It was priceless to see them both hunt together!!


I am gonna post some switch pics that still to this day blow me away how thick and tall it is.

[Hardwood11]

Whoops how do you rotate that last picture?

[dbltree]

Whoops how do you rotate that last picture?

Note sure but we get the idea :D Great habitat...thanks for sharing that switch is not just fro deer! :way:

[Hardwood11]

Note sure but we get the idea :D Great habitat...thanks for sharing that switch is not just fro deer! :way:

That is for sure, on the last bowhunt I saw 35-40 pheasants, 400-500 ducks and 3 deer, including a nice buck. I felt like I was in the Dakotas.

This farm was all tillable and pasture in 2002!

[letemgrow]

That is for sure, on the last bowhunt I saw 35-40 pheasants, 400-500 ducks and 3 deer, including a nice buck. I felt like I was in the Dakotas.

This farm was all tillable and pasture in 2002!


I used to hunt a 40 acre switch grass field next to hedge rows with corn and beanfields. Jumped many pheasants out of that field, it was interesting to note that I never saw the quail out in the switch, they were always jumped on the edges of the hedge and pure switch.

[chronic]

I was just reading our local newspaper and thought I would pass it to you folks for the heck of it. For our county here in kansas we have gotten 6.5 inches of rain for 2011. Next lowest year is 12.2. 23 year average is 21 inches. I bet you guys can't imagine it.

[letemgrow]

I bet you guys can't imagine it.


Hope I never have to imagine something like that!!

[IQDM]

I was taking a walk today checking out some first year switchgrass, when I came across this guy...
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu38/pipping22/2011-12-26111518.jpg
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu38/pipping22/2011-12-26111446.jpg
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu38/pipping22/2011-12-26111457.jpg
I assume that he was shot on a neighboring property and bedded down on the edge of our first year switchgrass before dying. The good news is that the switchgrass looks good :)
http://i631.photobucket.com/albums/uu38/pipping22/2011-12-26111540.jpg

[huntyak]

I agree, great 1st year stand and buck, although an unfortunate ending.

Did you use atrazine on your switch, or can you go through your processs of planting as that is a GREAT stand?

Thanks!!

[IQDM]

We got it in late because our to do list was very long this spring... but we planted some time in May on a tilled surface that used to be reed canary grass. After planting, we waited a week and sprayed with Round up and Atrazine... Some RCG did come back in spots, but we will hit it again with RU and Atrazine this upcoming spring and that seems to work well, or at least it has in the past. :way: Herbicides make this stuff easy! Although having SOME forbs and weeds in your stands is a good thing, RCG is not a good thing because it is very invasive and holds very little benefit to wildlife. Most of the places that I have been trying to establish switch grass is in areas that used to be completely taken over by RCG. So I make sure that I am very diligent with my weed (RCG) control. :) A good sprayer is worth its weight in gold!

[huntyak]

Thanks! Going to be planting 10 acres on my place this spring in fields with brome and fescue. It is almost flat as a pancake now, so looking to add extra cover :)

[Maj]

I have a 5 acre fescue field that I burned with roundup three years ago. I never got to plant it so it ended up being converted to weeds. I mowed and sprayed it again in October and came back again in November and mowed it down again. I don't feel like the spray took. There is some bare dirt but also some fescue still there. Can I still frost seed it in early February or do I need to wait another year so I have the opportunity to kill everything again next fall? Can I spray something in the early spring before the CIR germinates that will give it a better chance? I would really like to get this field started this year so any advice would be appreciated. Thanks

[Sligh1]

If it were me... you say you have some bare dirt.... I think you'd be ok. I'd seed it down really thick. Like, PERSONALLY, I go a little over-board on smaller projects like that cause i might get a little crazy with seed and herbicide BUT it's only a smaller amount of acres and if you spend a little more, who cares, right?!?!

SO... If it were ME, i'd go like 10 lbs to the acre of Switchgrass and I'd seed that anytime, BEFORE mid-march. Ideally in February. Or I'd see if you could light it on fire at all (pry not but might be worth a try?) to burn anything off BUT not critical to success- try and burn and then seed if you thought about that. that would remove some trash on top. Whether you do that or not.... Early April I'd BLAST the stuff... I'd be hitting it with 2-3 quarts of Round-up and 4-ish quarts per acre of Atrazine (ok, if you live in Iowa or many other places, only 2.2 quarts of Atrazine since that's the law) and walk away. If you're somewhere that allows 4+ quarts to acre of atrazine, I think you'll be able to walk away (unless the trash on top was super bad). If you get foxtail- you can get some herbicides to kill foxtail in switchgrass and I'd watch foxtail growth VERY CAREFULLY and react very quickly if it does come in. Read earlier on foxtail herbicides. I think it's do-able. Sounds like you have some round-up kill and some bare soil so I think you can get it done. Just do it right and do it timely and don't cut corners. Good luck!

[dbltree]

Four year old Cave in Rock switchgrass that was frost seeded in late winter on sod killed the fall before

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7135.jpg

Always prepare for establishing switchgrass by mowing sod in early August, spraying with 2 quarts 41% glyphosate, 1 quart crop oil and 1-2 ounces of Oust XP (generic is Spyder) in early September. Re-spray in late October with 1 quart gly if any grasses survive

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7133.jpg

Frost seed 5-8#'s of switchgrass seed in late January thru mid March on bare ground or no more then a few inches of snow. Note the runway going thru this 6' tall switchgrass

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7134.jpg

Around May 1st spray again with 1 quart gly and 2-4 quarts atrazine or simazine (lower rates on sandy soils, higher on heavy soils. Atrazine is restricted use and requires a license but simazine doe not. Switchgrass grows in small clumps unless seeded extremely thick, perfect for wildlife large and small to move thru

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7137.jpg

If you have problems with foxtail, spray with Paramount/Drive 75 (Quinclorac) post emergence and 2-4D can be applied to kill broadleaves but wait until the switchgrass has 3-4 leaves. Switchgrass is often put down by misinformed NRCS personnel but it is superior to most other natives at winter standability and with decades of real life observation I see wildlife from quail and pheasants to turkeys and deer readily using and in fact, living in....switchgrass.

NWSG is not magic nor a guarantee of huge whitetails being drawn to your farm like a a magnet but it is an extremely useful tool for open fields where tree plantings can not be done.... ;)

**** Note....see the beginning of this thread for details and sources for herbicides

[Sligh1]

New seeding - spray may 1st. But existing u'd spray early april right? Since much sprouts up in late April.

[dbltree]

New seeding - spray may 1st. But existing u'd spray early april right? Since much sprouts up in late April.

Yes...that's correct Skip...;)

[dbltree]

My friend Fred sent me a couple pics of his first year frost seeded switchgrass and the profound difference between the brome CRP and where he is converting it to CIR switchgrass.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/Fredswitch2.jpg

Fred is doing an outstanding job of establishing great whitetail habitat with centralized feeding areas with year around food sources, converting cool season sod in CRP fields to NWSG and doing TSI/hinging within his timber.

You can see a little foxtail in the switch but this coming year the Cave In Rock switchgrass will dominate!

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/Fredswitch1.jpg

All of Fred's hard work has paid off with two mature bucks harvested this season and nearly 60 deer coming out to his feeding area recently. There is a recipe for success and Fred is utilizing all the ingredients required to have a top notch whitetail management program....year around cover and food = mature whitetails and tall, thick switchgrass is just one piece of the habitat pie....;)

[jmm46]

Can I frost seed switch grass onto a brassica field this winter? Or will it not work?

[jmm46]

what about frost seeding into a existing bean field?

[dbltree]

what about frost seeding into a existing bean field?

Sometimes the allelopathic effects from the brassicas can inhibit the NWSG from germinating but soybean stubble is ideal! :way:

[jmm46]

so if I was planning on rotating soybeans to where the wintergreens are for next yr, then to switchgrass the following year, should I not broadcast rye and radishes into the soybeans?

[dbltree]

so if I was planning on rotating soybeans to where the wintergreens are for next yr, then to switchgrass the following year, should I not broadcast rye and radishes into the soybeans?

The late planted radishes probably won't be a problem, more so for July planted brassicas that reach maturity.

[Jbohn]

What if I can not broadcast untill middle late march, can I stratify the seed then broadcast and let the weather work the seed in, I broadcasted 50LBS on 10 acres last week , worried I need a little more it came out a little fast when i first started..I am a long way from my farm in Illinois I live in Maryland it not like i can get back there with out driving 12 hours.

[Jbohn]

I am only 8,395 post behind you, look out.dbtree

[dbltree]

What if I can not broadcast untill middle late march, can I stratify the seed then broadcast and let the weather work the seed in, I broadcasted 50LBS on 10 acres last week , worried I need a little more it came out a little fast when i first started..I am a long way from my farm in Illinois I live in Maryland it not like i can get back there with out driving 12 hours.

Middle March would be fine and in some cases the seed is not as dormant as others so perhaps late March will still be fine. I prefer February when possible but you may have success all the way up to early April too.

Keep us posted! :way:

[Jbohn]

OK- So let me get this right


I sprayed my field in august good Kill
I broadcasted my seed in Jan.
I am going to burn off all thatch April 1st
3rd or 4th week April have field sprayed with Atrazine and Gly
sit back and rep the rewards.
Do I have it correct. I spent $1000.00 on CIR from osenbaughs so I need this to work not to say $500.00 I have in spraying the fields. Am I missing any thining I am in Illinois.

[LoessHillsArcher]

Burning after seeding sounds risky to me. :confused:

[SWBUCKHNTR]

OK- So let me get this right


I sprayed my field in august good Kill
I broadcasted my seed in Jan.
I am going to burn off all thatch April 1st
3rd or 4th week April have field sprayed with Atrazine and Gly
sit back and rep the rewards.
Do I have it correct. I spent $1000.00 on CIR from osenbaughs so I need this to work not to say $500.00 I have in spraying the fields. Am I missing any thining I am in Illinois.

I would skip step 3 and be patient on step 5. I frost seeded and sprayed switch last year and had flowing fields of foxtail most the year. Now that the foxtail is knocked down I can see the switch all through out. This coming year should be great.

[dbltree]

Burning after seeding sounds risky to me. :confused:

I agree...I don't have any facts on this so I could be wrong but I prefer to burn before seeding rather then after. Thatch won't hurt anything and I always leave it there and have never had any adverse affects other then atrazine is not as effective where there is a lot of surface trash.

You can use Paramount/Drive 75 in June if foxtail comes up (and it will)

[gatzow]

Ok, I have posted here are few times, but I need some more help.

I bought some additional land that I am going to start to work on for habitat this spring. about 8-10 acres of the land was tillable, but has not been worked for the past 10+ years, so lots of stuff has grown in. weeds, little trees, grass, etc. I want to plant Switch in that entire field.

My plan is to talk to a local farmer to see if he would be willing to help me out. I assume my first step needs to be spraying the field in spring to kill everything. Is it recommended to spray a couple of times? Over what length of time? I would then ask the farmer to disc the field and plant it with switch. I have been using "sunburst" switchgrass. Is it best to have him plant the seed or is broadcasting preferred?

Do you also mix the switch with other types of seed? Indian grass, etc?

Any other suggestions or steps that I am missing?

Thank you in advance for your help. Hardly any snow in wisconsin so I am heading out soon to mark the areas to plant!!

[letemgrow]

I agree...I don't have any facts on this so I could be wrong but I prefer to burn before seeding rather then after. Thatch won't hurt anything and I always leave it there and have never had any adverse affects other then atrazine is not as effective where there is a lot of surface trash.

You can use Paramount/Drive 75 in June if foxtail comes up (and it will)

Same here, I would not burn at that time after seeding. The thatch should not be a problem.

[letemgrow]

Any other suggestions or steps that I am missing?

Thank you in advance for your help. Hardly any snow in wisconsin so I am heading out soon to mark the areas to plant!!


How big are the small trees? They may be hard on equipment if not removed for the farmer if you guys decide to actually plant instead of broadcast the seeds.

[gatzow]

How big are the small trees? They may be hard on equipment if not removed for the farmer if you guys decide to actually plant instead of broadcast the seeds.

They are more brush than trees, but the plan is to try to clear all of that stuff up. We also have some HUGE ant hills that are in the field. Big enough that I rolled my 4 wheeler on one last year. I did not really see them because of the tall grass. I took a drive through the middle of it 2 weeks ago and there are at least 20-30 ant hills in there. Some up to 3 foot tall.

We were thinking of having a guy come in with a bull dozer to run over the whole field to make certain that it is smoothed out for the farmers. I don't want to risk their equipment.

[SWBUCKHNTR]

I figured I would take some pictures and post up my switchgrass plantings this year. I am curious to see what I find out. I have 2 areas that I am seeding into switch this year. The first one is at my house along my driveway(north central iowa). It is about an acre and has always been cropped until last year. I kept it mowed all summer and burned it off this fall. It is mid 70s csr ground. I frost seeded it feb 8th.
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc390/dectaywar/80054.jpg
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc390/dectaywar/80053.jpg

Now the next area is quite a bit bigger roughly 5 acres and it is in southern iowa. It has always been hay ground until last spring I planted beans for a food plot and left them standing all year. The ground is in the low 50's for csr has a few wet areas and has only seen a little bit of fertilizer in the last 10 years or so. This was frost seeded feb 9th.
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc390/dectaywar/80058.jpg
http://i1209.photobucket.com/albums/cc390/dectaywar/80060.jpg

Now my plan is to spray them late april with gly/atrazine. I am gonna try to do it within a day or 2 of eachother. I will take pics and post them up then. My goal with the whole thing is to see if better ground has any effect on how well the switch does or if it depends a lot on the time it is seeded and sprayed. I know there are all kinds of variables that could change how one does compared to the other but figured it would atleast be fun watching the 2 and seeing what I come up with.

[dbltree]

if better ground has any effect on how well the switch does

Switch will definitely do better on rich, moist soils high in OM but I'm looking forward to your updates! Thanks for posting! :way:

[dbltree]

Frost seeding switchgrass

I frost seeded some Cave In Rock switchgrass seed recently...easy for anyone to do with a $30 bag seeder or an ATV mounted broadcaster...the seed is very tiny not unlike clover seed.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7373.jpg

This was left over seed from last year stored safely in a 5 gallon bucket with a lid on it

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7374.jpg

Switchgrass seed can have a high degree of dormancy but both age and the cold wet chill of late winter can help stratify the seed which allows it to germinate when temps warm significantly in mid to late May in most of the Midwest. A little light snow can be helpful to see where you are going/have been but I often walk both ways to insure even coverage when sowing by hand. Open the gate on the bag seeder just enough to let the tiny seeds pass thru and lock it there...otherwise you'll be tempted to "dump" seed which is very expensive and having to order more because you ran out with the field half done can be an expensive lesson.

Ideally soybean or corn stubble is a great place to frost seed into where all sod grasses have been previously killed...look closely to see the tiny seeds on the soil surface where freezing/thawing action will help it make soil contact.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7375.jpg

but sod killed the fall before will work just fine as well and though better to have been mowed before spraying even taller killed sod can not keep the tiny seeds from making soil contact.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7376.jpg

Switchgrass is more attractive to whitetail bucks for bedding when in larger, hilly fields with low flat lands far less likely to be used for anything but travel. Very small areas are also less likely to be utilized and probably better bedding cover could be achieved by planting a mix of shrubs and conifers but on fields where trees are not an option....switchgrass is and it's relatively easy to establish with little or no equipment... :way:

[SoDakarcher]

Dbltee,

Is your favorite choice to rehab a 2 year old pure switch field overrun with cool seasons and broadleafs still Oust XP at 2 ounces tank mixed with roundup at 1qt. applied in early April?( maybe sooner this year) Thanks.

[dbltree]

Dbltee,

Is your favorite choice to rehab a 2 year old pure switch field overrun with cool seasons and broadleafs still Oust XP at 2 ounces tank mixed with roundup at 1qt. applied in early April?( maybe sooner this year) Thanks.

Yes....and sooner this year ;)

[rackhunter]

I was told from Osenbaughs last year to spray Atrazin around April 1 and then Round up between May 5-10. With the current temps when do I spray? What is the currnt ground temperature in Southeast Iowa?

[Sligh1]

For soil temps. Both me and dbltree put link under nwsg thread of his. I am on my phone so harder to copy/paste but look under that thread within last couple weeks. Se is I probably at 60 degrees. I personally will b spraying all new seedings next week. It may b slightly early But- I'd rather be early than late (late meaNs killing ur seeding). I am spraying atrazine and roundup at same time- saves half the work if I spray at once. Watch for 65 degree soil temps. New seedings will germinate later than existing seeding coming outta dormancy but I'll b killing most or all cool seasons an have a ton of residual with high levels of atrazine.

[Qdmaer]

What is a good post emergence spray if i am unable to get on my 2nd year stand of switch with gly and simizine? I was thinking drive75 and simizine? Any other ideas anyone? Thanks

[LoessHillsArcher]

What is a good post emergence spray if i am unable to get on my 2nd year stand of switch with gly and simizine? I was thinking drive75 and simizine? Any other ideas anyone? Thanks

What are you trying to kill? 2-4d is good for post emerge weed control. If you've got foxtail problems I had good luck with Quinstar (still have some if you're interested)

[Sligh1]

What is a good post emergence spray if i am unable to get on my 2nd year stand of switch with gly and simizine? I was thinking drive75 and simizine? Any other ideas anyone? Thanks

2nd year herbicide?... u really shouldn't need any. Did you get a good start on your 1st year seeding last year?
Get atrazine if possible to anyone spraying a pre-emergent. my 2 cents, not critical but a lot better

[dbltree]

Remember 2nd year switchgrass can be sprayed with Oust/Spyder (PRE-Emergence)to clean up problem grasses but as Jordan mentions, 2-4D is all that is needed for broadleaves once switch has 3-4 leaves.

[showstopper]

I realize that every soil demands a different fertilizer but is there a general number you guys have found that really helps a first year stand take off? I'm contemplating if it is worth the extra money to give my switchgrass a good boost this first year.

[pete]

What are you trying to kill? 2-4d is good for post emerge weed control. If you've got foxtail problems I had good luck with Quinstar (still have some if you're interested)

Drive 75 and Quinstar are the exact same chemical. I work for the company that manufactures it same thing different packaging.

[dbltree]

Drive 75 and Quinstar are the exact same chemical. I work for the company that manufactures it same thing different packaging.

Thanks Pete...it's also sold as Paramount but it's not sold in smaller qualities like Drive is.

Switchgrass will certainly respond to fertilizers so add P&K the seeding year can be helpful, with out a soil test I can only guess but it's not uncommon to need a 100#'s each of P&K on most soils.

Do not add nitrogen until the second year but being a grass, switchgrass will respond to nitrogen so you can add N by broadcasting urea just before a minimum 1/2 of rain in late May or early June.

[Qdmaer]

I can't remember who sprayed atrazine mixed with crop oil on switch that was already emerged and said it killed other weeds but didnt harm the switch.

[pete]

Thanks Pete...it's also sold as Paramount but it's not sold in smaller qualities like Drive is.

Switchgrass will certainly respond to fertilizers so add P&K the seeding year can be helpful, with out a soil test I can only guess but it's not uncommon to need a 100#'s each of P&K on most soils.

Do not add nitrogen until the second year but being a grass, switchgrass will respond to nitrogen so you can add N by broadcasting urea just before a minimum 1/2 of rain in late May or early June.

Also called Accord, Facet, and Quinclorac 75. Yep mostly in 7.5lb jugs except Drive 1lb.

[dbltree]

March 25th, 2012

Abnormally warm temps this March have me mowing the lawn already....unheard of in my lifetime! Obviously the cool seasons are growing but what about the warm season grasses? Is it to late to spray 2nd year switchgrass with gly and Oust/Spyder??

I checked on established switchgrass here and nothing is emerging yet

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7557.jpg

Look closely around the base of the established plants...emerging switchgrass will come up right thru the clump and in this case...none yet exist

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7558.jpg

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7559.jpg

This is Indiangrass

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7560.jpg

and no sign of life yet here either.

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e288/dbltree/Switchgrass/IMG_7561.jpg

Soil temps have actually dropped a bit and in my area remain well below 60

4 Inch Soil Temperature Maps (http://extension.agron.iastate.edu/NPKnowledge/soiltemphistory.html)

New switch seedings will germinate well behind established switchgrass and will require at least 5 days of 65 degree soil temps. If the cool seasons are up and growing in your area and the established switch has not you can spray glyphosate and Oust in this window of time to clean up cool seasons and allow the switchgrass to dominate.

If you have a new seeding you have a little more time yet to spray gly and a residual like atrazine or simazine but be aware that the time to germination date may be moved up by 2-4 weeks from the historical May 10th (in SE Iowa) ;)

[huntyak]

Great info Paul.

[spltbrow]

I'm getting ready re plant an old switchgrass field about 6 acres. Last year I started out with gly and oust then sprayed gly again in late summer. Cool season grass is starting to pop up in 50% of the field. My plan is to spray with gly this weekend and then disc and plant the fallowing weekend, then spray with atrazine. The reason I am going to disc and broadcast rather than drill is to clean up the dead grass/weeds from last year that way I get good soil contact with the atrazine. What I am thinking about planting is switch, big blue, and Indian grass.

Am I on the right track with my plan and type of grass? Any suggestions and direction will be helpful. Thanks

[huntyak]

I have heard discing may 'wake up' some grasses and cause them to grow, and I think can use plateau on BB or Indian but not atrazine . And vice versa for switch.

[dbltree]

Atrazine is safe on switch and BB but not Indiangrass....discing will cause a flush of annual weeds and grasses like foxtail so you will be opening up a Pandora's Box of problems there I am afraid....;)

[LoessHillsArcher]

I checked a couple switch grass plots we seeded last year and sure enough we've got some sprouting going on in western IA! I did notice a difference from field to field - the bottom, wet area field was sprouted more than the hillsides (north facing). But I went ahead and sprayed a mix of Oust XP and Gly now. Crazy stuff to see this sprouting already!?

The bottom field / creek buffer. This was the most sprouted area, about 1" of growth but I went ahead and sprayed anyway since it hadn't opened up.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v461/iowadeerhunter/Number%20two/IMG_2984.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v461/iowadeerhunter/Number%20two/IMG_2983.jpg

This was the growth we were seeing on the rest of the plants. Jusssssttt peaking out!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v461/iowadeerhunter/Number%20two/IMG_2992.jpg

[huntyak]

So we can use Roundup even though they are coming up on a switch stand? Or is it relative to how much they are coming up etc?

[LoessHillsArcher]

So we can use Roundup even though they are coming up on a switch stand? Or is it relative to how much they are coming up etc?

I used round-up on the above switch stands - as long as the shoots aren't opened up you should be ok. I believe Paul would agree with me on that... I feel like he's told me that in the past. Hope so anyway! :D

[showstopper]

OK, one final question. I had sprayed my frost seeded switch with a strong dose of atrizine and accuquest (ammonia sulfate). Should I go back here this next weekend and spray it with roundup powermax or do you think this will suffice? I noticed quite a bit of new clover growth on the exposed soil and some grass regeneration.

[LoessHillsArcher]

Sounds like safe insurance to me, you could even wait a bit longer if you wanted... just my $0.02! :D I see no problem in doing a dose of round-up.

[huntyak]

Good info guys. Thanks.

[spltbrow]

Ordered seed from prairie seed farms today. There went $800. They recommended 8 lb cave in rock and 2 lb canlow per acre for deer bedding. Cave in rock for the height and can low for the shorter grass and to also help hold the cave in rock up during the winter. Hopefully I made a good choice with that mix. They did recommend me to disc it maybe 3 time and then hit it with 2 lb atrazine and 1.67 pints of dual II magnum per acre and then plant. (also make sure rain is in forecast to activate the atrazine before planting seed)

Still a little confused if I should disc or not. He said by discing multiple times on different days would help kill the new seed generated by discing. then hit with herbicides to keep weeds at bay. That process would give me the quickest results for growth. Also said get seed in ground by April 15th.

[rackhunter]

Ive been told the CIR is shorter then the Canlow and it will hold the Canlow up. From my understanding discing brings out alot of weeds do to stiring the ground. Also your seed might end up to deep in the disc up ground.
Last year around the first of April i mowed an area and then seeded with CIR and ran a packer over it to get good seed to soil contact. I then sprayed with 2 qts Atrazine and 3 weeks later sprayed with Roundup. I was concerned because there was alot of duff (trash on the soil) but for the most part it came in really good.

[dbltree]

Ordered seed from prairie seed farms today. There went $800. They recommended 8 lb cave in rock and 2 lb canlow per acre for deer bedding. Cave in rock for the height and can low for the shorter grass and to also help hold the cave in rock up during the winter. Hopefully I made a good choice with that mix. They did recommend me to disc it maybe 3 time and then hit it with 2 lb atrazine and 1.67 pints of dual II magnum per acre and then plant. (also make sure rain is in forecast to activate the atrazine before planting seed)

Still a little confused if I should disc or not. He said by discing multiple times on different days would help kill the new seed generated by discing. then hit with herbicides to keep weeds at bay. That process would give me the quickest results for growth. Also said get seed in ground by April 15th.

Multiple discing would help destroy new germinating weed seeds but you;ll struggle to actually do that in only two weeks. I know John recommends Dual but every test I have read says that switch seedings were severely reduced by using Dual. Atrazine is very safe on switchgrass but you may have to add 2 quarts of simazine to it to increase effectiveness.

If you have problems with weeds just be prepared to clip 8-12" high as needed or spray with Drive 75 and 2-4D when switch has 3-4 leaves. That combo will clean things up quickly!

[LoessHillsArcher]

I've seen pictures being share of some switchgrass fields that already have 4"+ switch grass... make sure to check those fields well before spraying any herbicides! Hate to destroy a field of switch...

[Hardwood11]

Paul: I missed your seminar in Parkers the other day, planned on attending but just couldn't make it due to a conflict...anyway, I have a farm in Warren County and it has a 7.9 acre field that was at one time tillable, right now it is basically weeds, it is not being tilled or hayed.

I have two options: Seed it down to alfalfa/hay mix and have the neighboring farmer hay it (provide some income) secondary food plot.

-or-

I could plant switchgrass all most of it, possibly leave 2-3 acres for a food plot, or even plant fruit trees/oak trees on part of it.

The field is tucked away from any roads, nice location next to some great bedding cover...Your thoughts? Also, what programs would I use to help pay for the seed and planting (WHIP?)

[dbltree]

Assuming you already have other food sources on the farm I would opt for switchgrass...it's my understanding that they are not funding WHIP right now but you might try EQIP. If the land is in Iowa you can apply for Conservation Cover cost share thru REAP so check with your local NRCS office regarding that :way:

[Nontypcl1]

I've seen pictures being share of some switchgrass fields that already have 4"+ switch grass... make sure to check those fields well before spraying any herbicides! Hate to destroy a field of switch...

Here's pics of my switch from yesterday frost seeded last year. Definitely getting an early start this year!

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f71/stepcol/1776b84f.jpg

http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f71/stepcol/993fd334.jpg

[Daver]

Wow, that is about 5-6 weeks ahead of schedule! Crazy year!!

[bwese]

All of my cir switch patches were greening up by the end of March. I missed the window to glyphosate them. Looks like it will be a next year project.

[rackhunter]

It seems the ground temps have came back down in S. Iowa so a person will still have sometime to spray gly on recent planted or frost seeded CIR

[Jbohn]

Ok, headed out this week end to put down my Atrazine at 4lbs a acre, upon arival I had a few patches of clover coming up in one of the corners of the field, I didnt spray 2-4d because of the residual effects but I nuked the hell out of it with round up put it on heavy , anybody had this issue before , what are the chances I set the clover back enough to get my switch going the clover was thick in a few spots , the field was bare no growth so I got a good spray last fall. Im in west central Illinois. what should I do if the switch doesnt emerge in these areas. Last question I was heavy on the atraxine should that help keep the grasses back as well. I live 800 miles away so trying to make sure everyhting is right..

Thanks

[dbltree]

Ok, headed out this week end to put down my Atrazine at 4lbs a acre, upon arival I had a few patches of clover coming up in one of the corners of the field, I didnt spray 2-4d because of the residual effects but I nuked the hell out of it with round up put it on heavy , anybody had this issue before , what are the chances I set the clover back enough to get my switch going the clover was thick in a few spots , the field was bare no growth so I got a good spray last fall. Im in west central Illinois. what should I do if the switch doesnt emerge in these areas. Last question I was heavy on the atraxine should that help keep the grasses back as well. I live 800 miles away so trying to make sure everyhting is right..

Thanks

Atrazine won't control the clover more then likely but if you can, use 2-4D later this summer when switch has 3-4 leaves (probably mid to late June) to kill the clover and then next spring you can use Oust and gly before switch comes up in the spring....this year that happened very early!

[12 point]

Paul--I have a field of LB,BB,Indian & switch that i burned a few weeks ago.The grass is about 8" tall in the field now.If i spray Plateau on it with crop oil ,will it kill my switchgrass.This grass is three years old now.Thank's.

[Sligh1]

Dt can chime in BUT Plateau does NOT kill established switchgrass.

[rackhunter]

With ground temperatures rising quickly in Southern Iowa in late March I sprayed my winter frost seeded CIR with 2Quarts Atrazine and added some gly. I dont think i added enough gly to be effective enough. So I resprayed with Gly a week ago and my question is since ground temps are back down and I sprayed the Atrazine almost a month ago can/should i spray Atrazine again? Thanks

[dbltree]

If i spray Plateau on it with crop oil ,will it kill my switchgrass

as Skip mentions Plateau/Panoramic wil not harm established switchgrass BUT...adding crop oil to the mix on emerged NWSG may cause injury...read the label on that first....

I sprayed the Atrazine almost a month ago can/should i spray Atrazine again?

spray it all summer long and it won't harm switchgrass at any point ;)

(don't spray gly of course...:eek::D )

[Central Iowa]

Made fire this week burned about 20 acres between a blown hose on the tractor and electrical problems on the Ranger it ended up being a long day and had to burn late into the night because of time constraints. I have never burned at night it really made for a dramatic viewing.

[dbltree]

Good stuff Travis and I think night time is usually the safest time to burn as winds diminish :way: