PHP:
Di-calcium phosphateWhere can I find this stuff. I have looked around here in sioux falls some and haven't had any luck. Any other names for it. I would like to try mAking my own sites this year, used commercial name brands last year and they get quite expensive. Thanks, BryanFleet Farm carries 2:1 for about $18 50lb
- If you are out planting trees or putting in plots, now is the time to be putting out some salt too, some folks wait until fall, when it's least needed (see attached).
- Fleet Farm or your local Coop will carry 50 lbs of loose salt (right next to all the salt blocks in the farm/live-stock department, not in the hunting department where all the over priced stuff is marketed) for around $5.00. If the budget's tight, that will do or you can decide if you want to add in other minerals like 2 to 1 (calcium/phosphorus), just keep the mix 50-75% salt to keep them coming.
From link:
"Could the use of salt/mineral mixes simply be due to an increased need for salt? According to research, yes. During the spring and summer, deer operate at a sodium deficiency due to the high potassium and water content of the forage. This interferes with efficient sodium conversion in the body and increases the need for sodium. This makes deer actively seek out concentrated sources of sodium such as natural or man–made licks. Almost all soils more than 25–50 miles from a seacoast are low in sodium. Therefore, in these areas, salt may be just as necessary as calcium and phosphorus to whitetails during the spring and summer."<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
fficeffice" /><o></o>
linked information on salt:
http://www.qdma.com/what-we-do/articles/deer-biologymanagement/whitetail-science-minerals/
- Fleet Farm or your local Coop will carry 50 lbs of loose salt (right next to all the salt blocks in the farm/live-stock department, not in the hunting department where all the over priced stuff is marketed) for around $5.00. If the budget's tight, that will do or you can decide if you want to add in other minerals like 2 to 1 (calcium/phosphorus), just keep the mix 50-75% salt to keep them coming.
From link:
"Could the use of salt/mineral mixes simply be due to an increased need for salt? According to research, yes. During the spring and summer, deer operate at a sodium deficiency due to the high potassium and water content of the forage. This interferes with efficient sodium conversion in the body and increases the need for sodium. This makes deer actively seek out concentrated sources of sodium such as natural or man–made licks. Almost all soils more than 25–50 miles from a seacoast are low in sodium. Therefore, in these areas, salt may be just as necessary as calcium and phosphorus to whitetails during the spring and summer."<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com
fficeffice" /><o></o>linked information on salt:
http://www.qdma.com/what-we-do/articles/deer-biologymanagement/whitetail-science-minerals/
dbltree
Super Moderator
Salt and Minerals
Where legal, salt and minerals are easy and relatively inexpensive to put out for whitetails and are one of the best ways to get fairly accurate trail cam surveys. Deer love salt and hate minerals so will only eat minerals when they are "disguised" with salt so even a bag of mineral is in large part....salt.
Trace Mineral salt is by far the most the most economical yet most effective way to attract whitetails and when people ask me what to put out for a cam survey, this is what I recommend. 50#'s will last the season and deer typically dig huge craters, eating the soil/salt mixture over time. This of course allows them to get some minerals naturally but I usually add a bag of mineral to the mix.
When it comes to minerals it is important to remember that despite all the hype, university studies have shown absolutely zero benefits in regards to antler growth. Many people believe it is helpful but without cloning to whitetail bucks and feeding them identical rations...it is impossible to prove. Just be realistic about expectations and avoid spending your habitat budget dollars on expensive and ineffective commercial products.
Trace mineral salt will almost always provide rapid results in regards to attracting deer to a cam site and will generally be more effective if put out in mid to late winter but a friend of mine decided to try a bag in early summer and shared the results with me. A simple bag of TM salt for a round $7 produced 415 pics in 19 days, 329 of which were buck pics...
The lick was placed near a pond where deer normally travel to drink
and in this case apparently in a summer buck bedding area where bachelor groups live
Using the cam survey he can begin to identify bucks by age structure and begin to come up with a management plan
For 7 bucks...he is gaining a tremendous amount of information about the whitetails on his farm and if he continues to maintain this lick in subsequent years it will be even more heavily used and the information he gains invaluable for his management goals.
I have a client where i Have put out salt and minerals but he felt he might see more activity if we added some commercial salt/mineral mix....which I did but I doubted we would see any significant results. In the meantime I thought it would be fun test various commercial mixes against my own TM salt/livestock mineral
I have a lick that I have used for nearly 15 years now and it varies from 500-1500 pics per card pull so I decided to record the # of pics and note the dates, start and stop...such as shown here
6-28-2012 Start
7-10-12 Stop...660 pics
I picked up some commercial mixes
Noted the high concentration of salt in each....
along with various other ingredients
In each one
Keep in mind that each one of these weighs only a few pounds and cost as much or more then 50#'s of salt, most of course contained some minerals but a 50# bag of minerals is roughly $18-25
I placed marker flags in the existing lick
and emptied the contents of each bag by the appropriate flag
noting the heavy activity by deer digging the rock hard bone dry soil/salt in the lick
and deer currently using it
Noted the start 7-10-12
and stop 7-23-2012 973 pics (keep in mind that before I kept records some pulls were in 1200-1500 range)
I was curious if there was a commercial mix that was more attractive to deer then...salt, something I felt I already knew the answer too but as with everything I share...I want to know the truth and have the facts clearly proven.
Would deer ignore the salt and choose the commercial products...or not? Out of 973 pics....only 4 deer even sniffed the commercial products let alone ate them and all the rest continued to eat the dirt salt/mix already there.
None of the older bucks even approached the commercial mixes
nor did the number of bucks visiting the site increase although I am sharing more pics from this batch then the first, actual activity did not increase
Note the line of fresh TM salt applied and deer using it, although most preferred the salt already mixed in the dirt
In time...as rain washes the various products into the soil I expect they will indeed use all of them at some point but it is certainly clear that in no way are these products more attractive then plain old...salt. They also do not have the ability to produce ginormous racks...only age and genetics can accomplish that.
Provide salt and free choice minerals but get more bang for you buck by buying 50# bags from your local feed store or farm and fleet and don't be misled into believing that any food or mineral will have a significant impact on the antler growth of wild, free roaming whitetails with normal, healthy food native food sources available to them...there is simply no verifiable evidence to prove otherwise.
I will update the results of my tests over time including into next year but the is more to this then meets the eye and relates to food sources and over all management.
Whitetails rarely travel far and often less then a 1/2 a mile if their needs are being met so knowing this we can see that neither food nor minerals can attract deer from miles away. On farms I manage most bucks will never (other then rut) travel from one end to the other of a 300 acre farm...so do not expect a mineral or food source to perform miracles.
Cover first, hidden year around food sources, age and genetics...in a nutshell those are the key ingredients to holding and harvesting big whitetails on your farm...
Where legal, salt and minerals are easy and relatively inexpensive to put out for whitetails and are one of the best ways to get fairly accurate trail cam surveys. Deer love salt and hate minerals so will only eat minerals when they are "disguised" with salt so even a bag of mineral is in large part....salt.
Trace Mineral salt is by far the most the most economical yet most effective way to attract whitetails and when people ask me what to put out for a cam survey, this is what I recommend. 50#'s will last the season and deer typically dig huge craters, eating the soil/salt mixture over time. This of course allows them to get some minerals naturally but I usually add a bag of mineral to the mix.
When it comes to minerals it is important to remember that despite all the hype, university studies have shown absolutely zero benefits in regards to antler growth. Many people believe it is helpful but without cloning to whitetail bucks and feeding them identical rations...it is impossible to prove. Just be realistic about expectations and avoid spending your habitat budget dollars on expensive and ineffective commercial products.
Trace mineral salt will almost always provide rapid results in regards to attracting deer to a cam site and will generally be more effective if put out in mid to late winter but a friend of mine decided to try a bag in early summer and shared the results with me. A simple bag of TM salt for a round $7 produced 415 pics in 19 days, 329 of which were buck pics...
The lick was placed near a pond where deer normally travel to drink
and in this case apparently in a summer buck bedding area where bachelor groups live
Using the cam survey he can begin to identify bucks by age structure and begin to come up with a management plan
For 7 bucks...he is gaining a tremendous amount of information about the whitetails on his farm and if he continues to maintain this lick in subsequent years it will be even more heavily used and the information he gains invaluable for his management goals.
I have a client where i Have put out salt and minerals but he felt he might see more activity if we added some commercial salt/mineral mix....which I did but I doubted we would see any significant results. In the meantime I thought it would be fun test various commercial mixes against my own TM salt/livestock mineral
I have a lick that I have used for nearly 15 years now and it varies from 500-1500 pics per card pull so I decided to record the # of pics and note the dates, start and stop...such as shown here
6-28-2012 Start
7-10-12 Stop...660 pics
I picked up some commercial mixes
Noted the high concentration of salt in each....
along with various other ingredients
In each one
Keep in mind that each one of these weighs only a few pounds and cost as much or more then 50#'s of salt, most of course contained some minerals but a 50# bag of minerals is roughly $18-25
I placed marker flags in the existing lick
and emptied the contents of each bag by the appropriate flag
noting the heavy activity by deer digging the rock hard bone dry soil/salt in the lick
and deer currently using it
Noted the start 7-10-12
and stop 7-23-2012 973 pics (keep in mind that before I kept records some pulls were in 1200-1500 range)
I was curious if there was a commercial mix that was more attractive to deer then...salt, something I felt I already knew the answer too but as with everything I share...I want to know the truth and have the facts clearly proven.
Would deer ignore the salt and choose the commercial products...or not? Out of 973 pics....only 4 deer even sniffed the commercial products let alone ate them and all the rest continued to eat the dirt salt/mix already there.
None of the older bucks even approached the commercial mixes
nor did the number of bucks visiting the site increase although I am sharing more pics from this batch then the first, actual activity did not increase
Note the line of fresh TM salt applied and deer using it, although most preferred the salt already mixed in the dirt
In time...as rain washes the various products into the soil I expect they will indeed use all of them at some point but it is certainly clear that in no way are these products more attractive then plain old...salt. They also do not have the ability to produce ginormous racks...only age and genetics can accomplish that.
Provide salt and free choice minerals but get more bang for you buck by buying 50# bags from your local feed store or farm and fleet and don't be misled into believing that any food or mineral will have a significant impact on the antler growth of wild, free roaming whitetails with normal, healthy food native food sources available to them...there is simply no verifiable evidence to prove otherwise.
I will update the results of my tests over time including into next year but the is more to this then meets the eye and relates to food sources and over all management.
Whitetails rarely travel far and often less then a 1/2 a mile if their needs are being met so knowing this we can see that neither food nor minerals can attract deer from miles away. On farms I manage most bucks will never (other then rut) travel from one end to the other of a 300 acre farm...so do not expect a mineral or food source to perform miracles.
Cover first, hidden year around food sources, age and genetics...in a nutshell those are the key ingredients to holding and harvesting big whitetails on your farm...
HorseDoctor
PMA Member
Interesting stuff. I've always used a mix of salt, trace mineral salt & dical with decent results. On a lark, I picked up a well known protein supplement block (the one with corn kernels in it) just to see what would happen. All of a sudden, all I get on my camera is a constant parade of raccoons gnawing on the block and the bucks that were using the site fairly routinely have gone somewhere else for the last two weeks. Won't make that mistake again soon. May just stick with good old red salt.
JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
Great post, Paul! :way:
Save your money, don't buy the mineral supplements aimed at whitetail management.
I found a much more affordable mineral product (with ALL the necessary components) at the local Thiesen's: Stockade Mineral. Four years ago, before I gave up putting out licks, I bought the Super 6% and had tons of pics over it. :way:
dbltree
Super Moderator
Not implying they won't eat any of the products shown if no other salt is available, certainly they will...this is meant to show they PREFER...just salt and the expensive products are in fact less attractive if given the opportunity to choose pure salt.
August 27th
I haven't had time to check my cams lately but took advantage of the rain day to check the lick cam and see how goes it with the product comparisons regarding commercial salt/mineral combos versus inexpensive trace mineral salt ($7 for 50#) and livestock mineral. Will the expensive products bring in more deer or will deer even eat them?
after being our several months now it is clear (as expected) that no more/different deer are using the site and after all this time only a couple deer even touched the expensive commercial products, preferring instead to continue eating the plain old...salt...
1136 pics from 7-23 to 8-26...not much new or different there and the average deer did the same thing every time...ate the trace mineral salt
only a 1/2 dozen pics showed a deer even sniffing the other products let alone eating them
the little salt blocks are of course...90% salt (two tiny blocks cost almost as much as 50#'s of salt!!) and at least one deer did lick the blocks...
Day after day, deer turned up their noses at the other, highly touted, and widely advertised commercial products
Including every buck that came in
none touched the commercial products
Choosing the line of salt in front of the other products
Minerals...can not produce huge racks...only age and genetics can accomplish that
If then you wish to use the least expensive yet most effective means of determine which deer live on your property...stop by your local farm supply store and pick up a bag of trace mineral salt and perhaps a bag of sheep mineral and put them out right after your season ends if legal in your state)...and have fun seeing what is living on your farm...
