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NWSG ?'s / Suggestions Welcome

baggin_bucks

baggin_bucks

Active Member
I have canary grass covering almost all of my bottom ground that is not timber. I would love to get a stand of NWSG in it's place but don't know if it would be a waste of time/money considering how invasive the canary grass is. I do have one small section of about 5 acres that was brome earlier this year. I killed the brome and planted RR beans and was able to keep vegitation to a minimum with round up. This area should work out good for drilling or broadcasting the seed without much competition. I have enclosed a few pictures to show what I'am up against.
Here is the stand of canary that I would like to get rid of.
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The second pic is of the 5 acres of beans. The bean stalks are only about 12 inches tall but the whole 5 acres is pretty much weed free except for some small areas of fox tail. Can a guy just broadcast the NWSG seed into the unharvested beans?
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Feel free to give me your input. I kind of know what I want/need to do but not quite sure on how to go about it.
 
Your on the right track! Canary grass is next to worthless IMO
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The RR soybean field is the perfect place to either broadcast or no-till drill NWSG into this winter.

I would continue to kill the remaining canary grass in the same way and seed as you get it killed.

It looks like a pretty good sized area...what are you hoping to achieve with your new seedings?

I ask because you have several options. Switchgrass does very well on low moist soils and is IMO the very best year around deer cover.

It will remain standing thru heavy snows and deer will use it year around.

A NWSG mix of Big Bluestem, Indiangrass and Switchgrass will provide a more "clumpy" habitat for nesting birds, but I've found that in rich moist soils the Indiangrass tends to go flat easier. It grows fast and tall...and then over it goes.
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Since this is not a CRP planting you are free to choose what will achieve your habitat goals.

You most likely have read these threads but there are some good links in them as well.

Switchgrass

NWSG

Osenbaugh’s Prairie Seed Farms
 
Burn and Round up, or Roundup and burn, that should take care of it and when the taller switchgrass comes in it should shade the ground enough to keep the canary grass from coming back... I think.
 
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Burning it sure wouldnt hurt by the looks of it
Just a suggestion

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Funny you mention that! Been there tried that notice I said tried
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Too dang hard on my blood pressure
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Thankfully we keep everything under control but I didn't like any part of it. Seriously though, that is what I will probably do. I talked to the local fire dept. after I burnt it this spring and they said they would come out and burn it for me as a training session. I told them I would give them a donation of whatever they wanted if they did.
Dbltree, I want some thick nasty stuff for the deer but want to be able to help out the pheasants as well. The first pic I would probably do the straight switch grass because of it's location right along the timber. The second picture is right along the road and is a good location for the pheasants. I've been looking at the pheasant forever website http://www.iowapheasantsforever.org/docs/2006%20FALL%20Iowa%20native%20seed%20program%20CP25.doc and like the looks of the CP-25 without switch in it for the pheasants. On the opposite side of the farm I have a 25 acre wetland that is getting a face lift this summer and will probably do more of the CP-25 on it as well. I just wasn't sure if I would be able to keep the canary grass killed off if I went ahead and planted the switch grass in the area that is overgrown with the canary grass.

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Burn and Round up, or Roundup and burn, that should take care of it and when the taller switchgrass comes in it should shade the ground enough to keep the canary grass from coming back... I think.

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That's what I was thinking as well Muddy, but wasn't sure.
Thanks for the help guys
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How often does the bottomland flood? You'll always fight canary as it washes in from upstream but maybe the natives can hold their own? Would it qualify for some type of wetlands restoration? Ponds and cattails would look great.
 
Pharmer,
This part does not hardly flood. In the last five years that I've owned it the water level has never been even close to being outside the timber. The whole farm was actually put into wetlands by the previous owner. It's a long story but he was paid a lump sum and it now cannot be put in any crp type programs. He never did any up keep on the wetlands and the 25 acres that are getting redone this summer is being paid for to "redo" them "correctly". I was able to get some money for some hardwoods and cedar trees earlier this year and a little assistance on the NWSG stand that I'm already working towards (second pic)
The 25 acres that are getting redone is going to have several shallow ponds and hopefully thick cattails down the road. I'm thinking switchgrass is probably the hardiest of NWSG so this would be why I would plant it where the existing canary grass is? Don't know if it will work for sure but I've wasted money on alot worse things if it doesn't. Thanks,
 
Reed canary grass is a tough one to deal with ... I was involved in an ongoing study the Missouri Dept. of Conservation that is trying to determine the best way to get rid of reed canary grass ... no legal chemical on the market works well at completely eradicating it. The best results came from a heavy application of Roundup at 64 oz/acre.

If you have reeds growing in bottomland I would assume you have fairly wet soil conditions. Most native grasses will not do well in moist bottomland soils. Cave-n-Rock switchgrass does ok in wet areas but it will probably struggle to get established against a thick stand of reed canaray grass. Another excellent native grass for wet areas that competes well against reeds is prairie cordgrass. Prairie cordgrass establishment works best if planted in plugs, much like tree seedlings. The plugs aren't cheap but this is the only species of grass I know of that will outcompete reeds in wet areas. The plugs can be purchased from Forest Keeling Nursery in Elsberry MO.

I would burn it in March, apply 64 oz/acre roundup after you get at least 8 inches of green-up. Burn it again in May, apply another 32 oz/acre roundup after 3-4 inches of green-up and then plant or drill your natives 2-3 days after the last herbicide application. If you have any high spots in this field plant those areas to Indiangrass,Big Blue Stem, and Canada Wild Rye. If you have wet spots or obviously low spots I'd try the cordgrass plugs on a 5'x5' spacing. The rest of the field I'd plant switchgrass. Burn it in late May/ early June for the first 3 to 5 years, depending on how the natives come in and then every two years after that. You will never get rid of reed canary grass but you might keep ahead of it this way.

If you don't want to go to all this trouble and expense ... just burning it in June each year will set it back and give other native forbes more of a chance. Burning reed canary grass before the middle of May will only invigorate it and increase your diversity problem.
 
The pros here have already given you better advice than I can. I have a small planting of CIR switch that is 3 years old and I have some canary grass that was starting to creep into a low spot. I burned the CIR last spring and noticed that the canary grass was greening up a couple weeks ahead of the CIR so I hit some of it with roundup. To be honest I wasnt entirely sure what I was looking at with the early stages of growth (lack of experience) so I took it easy, but this did seem to be effective. I am thinking of burning it again this spring and using that couple week window to toast the rest of the canary grass, which prior to this springs treatment was spreading fast.
I put in some CP25 this spring and I like the looks of it so far, but I really like the CIR switch for ultimate cover and wouldnt mind if I had alot more of it, though I wouldnt suggest a huge area of only CIR. The local NRCS did let me add a little CIR to my CP25 as well.
 
Everbody has made some good points...

Cattails are awesome cover and help act as Mother Natures "sponge". Just don't see them often down here in the "hills"
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Still...wetlands are a great option.

I'm gonna have to study up on the "cordgrass"...I've heard of it but the only "wet spot" around here is in the bottom of the creek
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The canary grass is going to be a headache, so one wants to make sure to incorporate firebreaks in whatever you do.

If it grows soybeans it should grow some white clover around the edges...or if not leave a strip that can be tilled and planted to oats (or some such annual)

Burning is going to be needed anyway and especially to keep the RC set back.
Timing your burn will be important also.

If it were me...I would start by seeding the area already killed this winter and kill the rest of it this next summer.

Plant it to RR beans...or mow/burn and spray it several times thru out the summer and early fall.

You will most likely want to hit the soybean field with RUP in early spring before the WSG starts to germinate. That should set back any RC starting to creep back in.

and if none of that works...it was all thier idea...
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and if none of that works...it was all thier idea...


[/ QUOTE ] I won't hold anyone responsible....LOL!

I'm going to give it a try. If it doesn't work out I guess I can't say I never tried
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Once again I really appreciate all the help guys!!!
 
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I burned the CIR last spring and noticed that the canary grass was greening up a couple weeks ahead of the CIR so I hit some of it with roundup ... I am thinking of burning it again this spring and using that couple week window to toast the rest of the canary grass ...

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Save the roundup if your switch is already established and burn it in late May or early June. I would bet your last burn in the field you described was in March or maybe April.

If you want to invigorate a grass with a prescribed burn, the best time to burn is when that grass has 3 to 4 inches of new growth ... depending on the species. If you want to severely set back a grass, burn it just before it starts to develop seedheads.

In Iowa ...

Feb-March- early April burns are great for early forbs and cool season grasses and promoting new growth of shrubs in a timber stand.

May-June burns will invigorate a stand of warm season native grass but sets back cool season grasses and woody species and it can kill understory brush in a timber burn.

July-Sept burns can set back warm season native grasses if they are too thick and release forbs.
 
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I burned the CIR last spring and noticed that the canary grass was greening up a couple weeks ahead of the CIR so I hit some of it with roundup ... I am thinking of burning it again this spring and using that couple week window to toast the rest of the canary grass ...

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Feb-March- early April burns are great for early forbs and cool season grasses and promoting new growth of shrubs in a timber stand.

May-June burns will invigorate a stand of warm season native grass but sets back cool season grasses and woody species and it can kill understory brush in a timber burn.


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The cool thing is you get to have more then one "burn party" TP
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One early for your NWSG mix...and one later for your CIR!
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I sure hope Farmland has a "party" soon...(hint hint)
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Farmland, I'm pretty sure I burned in late April. I'd know if my activity log wasnt locked up in my crashed computer. My switch is well established and the canary grass areas are small, maybe a couple about the size of a one car garage each. Thanks for the tip.

Dbltree- Burns are great for
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as long as you dont forget to watch the fire! Gonna be hard to separate the two fires though, they run together.

Sorry Jeremy, didnt mean to hijack this thread. I wish I had as much area to work with as you do. Whichever species you plant I think you'll definately like the improvement and think it was worth the effort.
 
I had an area about 15 acres that had a lot of thistle and reeds canary. I mowed in august, sprayed in sept, and planted in november. I planted 1 acre of clover, 5 acres of NWSG, and then put the balance in CIR. This will allow feeding, nesting, bedding, and winter cover. The whole field is surrounded by a clover fire break. This is all next to a corn/bean field. I can't wait for the results. My bow stand is between the grass and the corn. Anything you do will be an improvement. Good luck.
 
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Sorry Jeremy, didnt mean to hijack this thread. I wish I had as much area to work with as you do. Whichever species you plant I think you'll definately like the improvement and think it was worth the effort.


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No need to appoligize, I love reading every one of them
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I think that Google is about ready to put Rob's picture up when you search for "fire god".

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I checked under my name...it says " Call Fire Department"
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