IBA supports feeding baiting bill
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flugge
Well-Known Member
Okay, lets get back on the topic...
Earlier I stated that I read in petersons hunting that wildlife biologists said have no negative effect on the herd. Here is the article out of Petersons Hunting, Predator Issue, Feburary/March 2011 issue. It was in a trail camera article on page 76
"Most biologists agree, and the research proves that when done properly, baiting will NOT have a negative effect on whitetail herds. The catch is getting everyone to propery space bating stations and use attractants that do not harm the animals they are attracting"
With that coming out of the article, I would say that the DNR must know something that no one else knows if they want to push this through. Because still, it is illegal to hunt over, or on any path heading to the bait with 200 yards or whatever it reads. Most commercial bought mineral lick supplies, corn, and mineral blocks, will not harm deer. So therefore, I guess everyone take your own opinion. I said I was done with this topic along time ago, but have been getting signatures on the petition. And even this article has helped get signatures, because it shows the DNR has more motives that spread of disease IMO. But again, take it as you want..I am done once again with this topic..
Earlier I stated that I read in petersons hunting that wildlife biologists said have no negative effect on the herd. Here is the article out of Petersons Hunting, Predator Issue, Feburary/March 2011 issue. It was in a trail camera article on page 76
"Most biologists agree, and the research proves that when done properly, baiting will NOT have a negative effect on whitetail herds. The catch is getting everyone to propery space bating stations and use attractants that do not harm the animals they are attracting"
With that coming out of the article, I would say that the DNR must know something that no one else knows if they want to push this through. Because still, it is illegal to hunt over, or on any path heading to the bait with 200 yards or whatever it reads. Most commercial bought mineral lick supplies, corn, and mineral blocks, will not harm deer. So therefore, I guess everyone take your own opinion. I said I was done with this topic along time ago, but have been getting signatures on the petition. And even this article has helped get signatures, because it shows the DNR has more motives that spread of disease IMO. But again, take it as you want..I am done once again with this topic..
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
Then quit taking government hand outs from tax payers. Tell me why myself and every tax payer, should fund your idle land, but get nothing in return? I'm all ears.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
Lol...uh huh. Good to see someone admit that the DNR is "looking the other way"Well, it is not a "clear" violation as you state. The DNR prohibits carrying in and scattering food, but kind of looks the other way if you grow it there.
And you know it isn't planted there for killing game, it is planted there to "increase the health of the herd", just like mineral licks.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
Lol...good info in that link too. I too hunt public land a lot, as I just enjoy using a boat and hunting river ground. I was born on a river, and will always be a river rat.Maybe we could give them 3 buck tags....
I hunt public land also.
JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
Well, in return you are getting higher food prices at the grocery store.
One of the original premises of the CRP program was to idle less-than-ideal ag land in the hopes of driving up grain prices (farmer benefit) while also having less ag chem and silt run off (public benefit). With ag prices high, it might be time to revisit this program.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
Yes sir, you are right. Is it true or myth, that if the DNR stocks your pond, free of charge with fish, then you have to allow the public in to fish?
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sureshot
The Hunt Never Ends....
HCH, wow man. You are so clueless. When was the last time you killed a buck!? You post more pictures of your wife/girlfriend then you do of deer. Of course, we all know how great of equipment you have......but, you're still oldschool because you don't use trailcameras......hahahahaha, wow man.
You know, I would be willing to bet that you could run cameras this fall and still not kill a buck. Just sayn.......
You know, I would be willing to bet that you could run cameras this fall and still not kill a buck. Just sayn.......
JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
Myth, though they strongly encourage you to allow people to fish.
I bought fish from a local hatchery to stock my pond.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: AMES, IOWA
Posts: 1,831
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnus
I'm presuming that you don't personally have any land enrolled in CRP? Trust me, its a big hassle --- initial and yearly paperwork, limitations on what you can/cannot do with it after you have let the government in your door, etc.--- all in exchange for minimal payments. To have you suggesting that these acres be open for public hunting, because of the tiny public funds rec'd by the owner, is just dumb. Sorry.
Then quit taking government hand outs from tax payers. Tell me why myself and every tax payer, should fund your idle land, but get nothing in return? I'm all ears.
I can think of a few reasons to support CRP. It reduces soil erosion and therefor increases water quality, which effects all of us. It is better for the wildlife, and wildlife just doesnt stay on that ground they can move over fences, etc. Kind of like having a refuge, why do we have them if you can not benefit from it. It all provides a role in this monoculture we have of crop fields. Also it provides cover for non-game species of animals. That is a few and in my opinion some important issues. I have no problem paying for that -- heck it is better than paying for health care, food stamps, living assistance, ect isn't it?
magnus
PMA Member
HCH --- I have to tell you - for a guy who's a self proclaimed "conservative republican", you sure sound lvery liberal/socialist with all of your ideas about the government opening private lands to public hunting, private ponds to public fishing, etc. I think you need to re-think where you really are on the political spectrum.....
DOR
Life Member
HCH isn't 100% off track here on CRP. We the taxpayer get cleaner water out of it, but why should we have to PAY the farmer to do the right thing? He is blunt and brash sometimes but he states his case clearly. You might not agree but I see what he is getting at. Appears JNRBRONC gets it too and he owns land.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
I'm not clueless to your agenda of wanting to keep running cameras over grain/mineral and being a pro baiting, food plot activist, and not wanting anyone not agreeing with the DNR, IBA, or many others that have the same views regarding these issues being allowed to voice their opinions on the matter without the small penis syndrome of personal attacks on the opposing opinion of others. Here is a question for you, would you ever kill a buck if it wasnt for cameras, mineral licks, and food plots?
DOR
Life Member
Incorrect. Liberals love a free hand out. CRP is essentially a free hand-out. Just like many other government subsidies. When you take the welfare from the public you should keep all the same privilidges? Private ownership should be private for a true conservative. Not private ownership subsidized by Joe tax payer.
I like the CRP program, but there is a strong case for some sort of return to the tax payer.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
No sir, You have your political parties mixed up, I want a return on my $, a democrat just wants to distribute the wealth and bail out and support programs like CPR and cash for clunkers. Like DOR stated, the landowner should take take care of the land and be a proper caretaker, without our tax dollars.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
nannyslayer
New Member
Ok, Ok, here is the low down on CRP if people really think that it is a government dollar that should be "public ground". I work with these things everyday, so lets get to it.
Most of your CRP ground is highly erodiable ground. If farmed even in a no till situation, it will still have a certain amount of run off. With the round up ready era we are in, our chemicals have gotten more environmental friendly now than they have ever been. But, with every crop, you have P and K, and with high commodity prices, not one person can afford not to have their ground up to par to raise optimum crop. If you have high phosphate levels, there is a certain amount of Nitrate carried with it. Now, there is where the run off is saved. Is one field run off going to make a difference? NO, it will take many, many fields run off to even make a significant impact on the environment. So CRP helps in that sense.
Now for habitat, if all farmers took CRP out of rotation, what habitat is left in the state of Iowa, not counting the southern 2 tiers? You are talking about making a huge impact on the populations of many, many different species, not just whitetail and pheasants. A lot of song birds nest in CRP.
But if your not convinced now HCH, lets break down some figures for you.
Ground with a CSR rating of 55 will bring around $4000 an acre right now, even more if you have siding landowners get into a bidding war over it. So I will do this on a 40 acre tract, to keep it simple for you.
40 acres @ $4000/acre=160,000
Annual Taxes on CSR 55 ground=2200 a year
Cost per acre to put in a corn crop $425/Acre over 36 acres (unless you have a strange field in the state of Iowa with no terriaces or waterways or fencelines)=$15,300
You can sell corn for next year delivery right now for 5.07. CSR 55 ground should raise around 160 Bu/Acre corn on a pretty good year.
160 Bu/Acre corn @ 5.07 per bushel=$811.20/Acre
So simple input cost, not even thinking about taxes or interest on the ground, farmer makes $386.20 per acre. It will be less after land payment and taxes, but still making good, good money.
NOW, CRP payment on CSR 55 ground, 165.00 an acre. Farmer is losing more than half, but yet not having to do any work. And you think it should be public? Every farmer I know enrolled in the CRP payment program would pull out of it and start farming the ground, hence, destroying thousands, let me repeat, THOUSANDS of acres of ground for wildlife habbitat. You ready for that because the government is handing out "your" money to them? I can think of 150 different things that I am shat full of the government handing out money for, rather than paying a farmer to leave land idol, which he could make more money on farming.
You seriously got to think about it. So your saying, HCH, that you own all the ground you hunt on, or you only hunt public ground? Because if your answer is NO, and you hunt on a farmers ground, I really hate to tell you they have gotten a payment for something, rather it be preventative planting, CRP, federal crop insurance, buffer strips, waterways, no till, minimum till, timber reserve, shall I go on? If there is a farmer in the state of Iowa that has never received a payment on their ground from the government for anything at all, I would like to meet them and shake their hand.
Most of your CRP ground is highly erodiable ground. If farmed even in a no till situation, it will still have a certain amount of run off. With the round up ready era we are in, our chemicals have gotten more environmental friendly now than they have ever been. But, with every crop, you have P and K, and with high commodity prices, not one person can afford not to have their ground up to par to raise optimum crop. If you have high phosphate levels, there is a certain amount of Nitrate carried with it. Now, there is where the run off is saved. Is one field run off going to make a difference? NO, it will take many, many fields run off to even make a significant impact on the environment. So CRP helps in that sense.
Now for habitat, if all farmers took CRP out of rotation, what habitat is left in the state of Iowa, not counting the southern 2 tiers? You are talking about making a huge impact on the populations of many, many different species, not just whitetail and pheasants. A lot of song birds nest in CRP.
But if your not convinced now HCH, lets break down some figures for you.
Ground with a CSR rating of 55 will bring around $4000 an acre right now, even more if you have siding landowners get into a bidding war over it. So I will do this on a 40 acre tract, to keep it simple for you.
40 acres @ $4000/acre=160,000
Annual Taxes on CSR 55 ground=2200 a year
Cost per acre to put in a corn crop $425/Acre over 36 acres (unless you have a strange field in the state of Iowa with no terriaces or waterways or fencelines)=$15,300
You can sell corn for next year delivery right now for 5.07. CSR 55 ground should raise around 160 Bu/Acre corn on a pretty good year.
160 Bu/Acre corn @ 5.07 per bushel=$811.20/Acre
So simple input cost, not even thinking about taxes or interest on the ground, farmer makes $386.20 per acre. It will be less after land payment and taxes, but still making good, good money.
NOW, CRP payment on CSR 55 ground, 165.00 an acre. Farmer is losing more than half, but yet not having to do any work. And you think it should be public? Every farmer I know enrolled in the CRP payment program would pull out of it and start farming the ground, hence, destroying thousands, let me repeat, THOUSANDS of acres of ground for wildlife habbitat. You ready for that because the government is handing out "your" money to them? I can think of 150 different things that I am shat full of the government handing out money for, rather than paying a farmer to leave land idol, which he could make more money on farming.
You seriously got to think about it. So your saying, HCH, that you own all the ground you hunt on, or you only hunt public ground? Because if your answer is NO, and you hunt on a farmers ground, I really hate to tell you they have gotten a payment for something, rather it be preventative planting, CRP, federal crop insurance, buffer strips, waterways, no till, minimum till, timber reserve, shall I go on? If there is a farmer in the state of Iowa that has never received a payment on their ground from the government for anything at all, I would like to meet them and shake their hand.
DOR
Life Member
As long as we are ranting way off topic might as well argue the logic of Ethanol subsidies. :thrwrck::grin:
I ruffled $'s feathers so I better not say much else.:grin: I don't want him to have a massive MI over this. LOL
I shouldn't have gotten involved here my feelings on these things are no where near as strong as your guys'. Just seems some want to argue just to argue and can't even consider an opposite point of view. Life is grey, not black and white.
I don't have the time to keep up with these posts lately. I wish Thomas would have never told me to read the shed contest or the baiting thread. :drink1::drink1:Time for a beer.
I ruffled $'s feathers so I better not say much else.:grin: I don't want him to have a massive MI over this. LOL
I shouldn't have gotten involved here my feelings on these things are no where near as strong as your guys'. Just seems some want to argue just to argue and can't even consider an opposite point of view. Life is grey, not black and white.
I don't have the time to keep up with these posts lately. I wish Thomas would have never told me to read the shed contest or the baiting thread. :drink1::drink1:Time for a beer.
Hardcorehunter
UL Shelter/Stove Geek
If the land was made public hunting, they will pull their land out of the easy, no work, free paycheck they get, and farm it instead?
Btw, good stats you put up there.