Preparing for a timber harvest

[Daver]

All - I am planning on having at least some part of my timber logged sometime relatively soon. If I could describe it in general, I would say that I have plenty of hickory, mostly shagbark, some pig hickory too, good amounts of white oak in some areas and fair amounts of red oaks in other areas. There is some walnut, which I don't plan to take any at this time, and also some black oak, which they can take them all IMO. There's some other species present, but nothing notable that would be likely to be desired by the loggers.

I am roughly estimating that 50% of their take will be shag barks, with a mix of oaks, predominantly red and white, making up most of the rest. My main goal of this timber harvest is to thin my timber. Despite doing TSI work in the past, things have gotten "park like" again in some areas and I thought, "Hmmmm...instead of doing more TSI I could just organize a select harvest and take out A LOT, not all, of the shaggies and kill two birds with one stone." Thicken the timber and slide the percentage of species back towards more oaks and less hickories. My plan is to mark the trees that I want the loggers to remove, so I am in control of what gets cut.

With that said...and knowing that this type of question is difficult to answer if you have not seen the timber...please help me gauge how many trees to cut, or leave behind, say on a per acre basis. My feeling is that I am going to go very heavy on nearly all big shagbarks and some oaks...but how many oaks per acre should I leave? Just enough that I can get some crown openings? TIA.

 

[MOBOWHUNTER]

I don't think there is a good tree per acre number to give and if there was it would be really hard without seeing the timber in person and walking it. I would advise to get a forester out there to walk it with you while you mark it. But the best advice I could give would be to remember that 40 percent of your oaks produce 70 percent of your acorns. You can thin them down pretty heavy if you'd like. Just make sure to follow your logging with a good round of TSI to lead things back into an oak regeneration phase.

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

I am really curious who is interested in buying shagbark hickory?

After you sell most of them, I would cut most of the rest leaving only the perfectly straight and nice poles.

Black Oaks... worthless unless you have a pallet buyer.

 

[Daver]

I am really curious who is interested in buying shagbark hickory?

After you sell most of them, I would cut most of the rest leaving only the perfectly straight and nice poles.

Black Oaks... worthless unless you have a pallet buyer.

Buyers of shagbarks...Pilcher Brothers, Douds, IA. I was surprised too when they said they cut them. I was happy to hear it though, because I was going to have them take out some oaks and then I was going to go in after them and waylay the hickories. This way...win, win.

 

[Hardwood11]

Hickory Is incredible wood, flooring, wall siding, cabinets!

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

Hickory Is incredible wood, flooring, wall siding, cabinets!

Agree, one of my favorites. Just never found anyone in iowa that would buy it.

 

[Sligh1]

When u get to a large amount of any tree above maybe 22” DBH, especially 26”+…. U will have no issue selling. Cottonwood on the extreme side of that where those trees can have a lot of board feet. U want them gone as it opens things so much & a worthless wildlife tree. Worth good $ if ambitious crew can get em to mill- those board feet add up!!!!
I personally would take any LARGE tree of these species that doesn’t take a “tree stand tree” or one near a treestand tree out (for back cover):
Elm, bitternut hickory, ash, cherry (valuable if u have a few big ones- rare), big basswood, hackberry, black oak, locust & few others. Any large trees of those species should have some value & u want them taken when large. Most of those are pallet- few are not.

U can sell shagbark as a marketable timber. Clearly maple, (cherry listed above), select red oak & a few others will be marketable valuable timber to varying degrees.


The ones to be super careful on….. your premo value: straight white oak. That’s your valuable tree. Same with straight swamp & burr oaks. Don’t cut them too small!!!!!!!
On the other end of that…. If you have sparse white, burr & swamp…. The poor quality trees…. Especially when u see acorn tops - I’d leave them if sparse or leave some... Worth very little and great wildlife & seed producers. Leave em be IMO.
& on the big valuable white, swamp & rare burr- again, don’t go too small but also- don’t feel like u need to take every last one of course. Maybe leave a loner here or there.

After the harvest- I’d personally do Tsi - initially and then again after few years. Really fight off the ironwood, buckeye & random things like hackberry flushes. Watch for bush honeysuckle. The multi flora rose- it’ll come but a little time on that can keep it managed. Thin your young & thick shagbark stands as well!

You are gonna have awesome results year 1 & Likely get better for each year after. Then it’s just touch up after you do some Tsi. Not a massive amount of work & maintenance is a very small amount of work.
Oh- on that list- thin the junk walnuts where they crowding canopies of bigger veneers. Baby those veneer!!!! Cut the vines off, etc. That’s a big return there!!!
Have fun, take some pics & post em!!!

 

[Daver]

I do have some pockets where there are plenty of ironwoods...I plan to drop them all after the scheduled timber harvest. I asked a bona fide forester one time what ironwood was good for, his answer...dulling saw blades.

Right now, I am planning on cutting in just three areas, maybe four. Then assess and come back next year to complete. Area 1 = 30 acres, good mix of oaks and hickories. Area 2 = just 4 or 5 acres, but some very nice white oaks there. I will only take out approximately 30%-40% of them, maybe not even that many.

Area 3 - 2 acres. This is a little "orphaned" area across the road from all the rest of my acres. I only very rarely even go over there and it is of little to no value to me. I told them to clear cut it...kinda for real.

Once I get those areas marked and if I am showing 70'ish trees to cut then I will call it good for this year. If I need to get a few more trees, I can mark in other areas too. But I think I can easily get to my goal, 70'ish, in the three areas referenced.

 

[Hardwood11]

Agree, one of my favorites. Just never found anyone in iowa that would buy it.

You know it’s dumb really.. but they charge plenty for hickory wood at the lumber yards & at Menards etc..

I don’t really have any in Western Iowa, but if I did I’d have it cut and milled into boards.

 

[letemgrow]

You know it’s dumb really.. but they charge plenty for hickory wood at the lumber yards & at Menards etc..

I don’t really have any in Western Iowa, but if I did I’d have it cut and milled into boards.

I always though some of that shagbark hickory looked as good as walnut.

 

[HWC]

I milled this hickory with my chainsaw and made a river coffee table. Pictures don't do it justice for how nice it turned out. It really sucked milling though.

 

[fergyr]

I do have some pockets where there are plenty of ironwoods...I plan to drop them all after the scheduled timber harvest. I asked a bona fide forester one time what ironwood was good for, his answer...dulling saw blades.

Right now, I am planning on cutting in just three areas, maybe four. Then assess and come back next year to complete. Area 1 = 30 acres, good mix of oaks and hickories. Area 2 = just 4 or 5 acres, but some very nice white oaks there. I will only take out approximately 30%-40% of them, maybe not even that many.

Area 3 - 2 acres. This is a little "orphaned" area across the road from all the rest of my acres. I only very rarely even go over there and it is of little to no value to me. I told them to clear cut it...kinda for real.

Once I get those areas marked and if I am showing 70'ish trees to cut then I will call it good for this year. If I need to get a few more trees, I can mark in other areas too. But I think I can easily get to my goal, 70'ish, in the three areas referenced.

Hey Daver

How are you?

Just an FYI, I've been taking out Ironwood with the Hack and Squirt method, they are generally showing signs of mortality within 3 to 4 weeks. Been using the herbicide mixture suggested by Dr Woods. You can really cover an area fast with this method.

Take it easy

 

[hillrunner]

Hey Daver

How are you?

Just an FYI, I've been taking out Ironwood with the Hack and Squirt method, they are generally showing signs of mortality within 3 to 4 weeks. Been using the herbicide mixture suggested by Dr Woods. You can really cover an area fast with this method.

Take it easy

Did you have any unintended damage to other trees from root transfer of herbicide?
I just spent a week cutting ironwood but I left it untreated by recommendation of my forester.

 

[Daver]

Hey Daver

How are you?

Just an FYI, I've been taking out Ironwood with the Hack and Squirt method, they are generally showing signs of mortality within 3 to 4 weeks. Been using the herbicide mixture suggested by Dr Woods. You can really cover an area fast with this method.

Take it easy

Doing well, thank you. And you? I am open to killing my ironwoods with the hack and squirt method, but don't want to risk translocation. What was the formula that you used? TIA.