Stuck at my cabin (snowstorm ) rant

[Bucksnbears]

Bad weather today so have been watching YouTube hunting vids since 4: 30 this morning.
One thing that has got me riled up for some time now is the proliferation of t.v. stars calling in for a tracking dog after the shot.

Used to be, they'd try n track the deer first but couldn't find it. Now, they seem to " review" the footage and if the hit looks marginal, they will go in HOURS later with a tracking dog.

Just watched a Greg Ritz episode where he hits a big buck and they gave it 24 hours to trail.
Doubt he would have done that if it was a doe?

Have been on HUNDREDS of bloodtrails in my life, (yep, have lost some), but it's what helps us become good hunters. How can we get better at one of the most important aspects of the follow up when we don't even try to finish the process?
From what I've seen over the years, you call in a dog tracker/ drone, it's all about the antlers.

 

[jkratz5]

I am ok with calling in the dogs and drones if you have done your job tracking the deer and come up empty. To take the shot and immediately go to I am going to use these tools is a little greedy and unprofessional to me! I get wanting to recover your deer - but make the effort to track, learn, and respect the animal

 

[theDoorman]

Bad weather today so have been watching YouTube hunting vids since 4: 30 this morning.
One thing that has got me riled up for some time now is the proliferation of t.v. stars calling in for a tracking dog after the shot.

Used to be, they'd try n track the deer first but couldn't find it. Now, they seem to " review" the footage and if the hit looks marginal, they will go in HOURS later with a tracking dog.

Just watched a Greg Ritz episode where he hits a big buck and they gave it 24 hours to trail.
Doubt he would have done that if it was a doe?

Have been on HUNDREDS of bloodtrails in my life, (yep, have lost some), but it's what helps us become good hunters. How can we get better at one of the most important aspects of the follow up when we don't even try to finish the process?
From what I've seen over the years, you call in a dog tracker/ drone, it's all about the antlers.

Watched that video last night as well and thought the same thing.

 

[Bucksnbears]

I am ok with calling in the dogs and drones if you have done your job tracking the deer and come up empty. To take the shot and immediately go to I am going to use these tools is a little greedy and unprofessional to me! I get wanting to recover your deer - but make the effort to track, learn, and respect the animal

Agree.

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

Understand the sentiment.

The other side of the coin is this. Certain shots and situations..... absolutely the right move is to wait. Especially if shot back. Deer will can live up to 24 hours hit back. But they usually dont go far and will be dead in first bed IF they dont get pushed. The second piece to that is a dog works waaaaaayyyy better if you haven't boogered up the trail. If they get bumped they can go a LONG way and usually you arnt going to find them.

Havent seen the video you are referencing so not sure of the specific situation. Just noting there is a time and place to waiting

 

[DMarley83]

Understand the sentiment.

The other side of the coin is this. Certain shots and situations..... absolutely the right move is to wait. Especially if shot back. Deer will can live up to 24 hours hit back. But they usually dont go far and will be dead in first bed IF they dont get pushed. The second piece to that is a dog works waaaaaayyyy better if you haven't boogered up the trail. If they get bumped they can go a LONG way and usually you arnt going to find them.

Havent seen the video you are referencing so not sure of the specific situation. Just noting there is a time and place to waiting

I used a dog this year with a real similar situation. It was more about finding the deer than the antlers (as it was a 130type cull buck that's been around for years)

I did call in a local guy/dog combo who did awsome by the way and wasn't in it for the $ as he was extremely fair!

In my case I had a deflection and hit the deer just in front of the rear quarter dead center up and down. Saw the shot and retreaved the arow. It was covered in SHI*. Zero blood on arow just what looked like poo. Felt terrible and thought I would try a tracker as it is a real live skill that takes a lot of work to master (both dog and man)

He explained to me the dog actually tracks the scent of the deer not so much the blood like I thought. When you do your do dillegence and take up the trail and then follow up with a grid search you actually take that deers scent and speard all throughout the woods making it very tough for the dog.

I did not track the deer at all. We came back 24hrs later and took up the trail. Went right to him inside 10 mns. The deer was actually where I thought he might be and I 100% would have found him without the dog however the dog and the tracker made a believer out of me. (Im probably the biggest skeptic of everything new).

So it is definitely a dilemma as to what is the right move.

Not trying to hijack your post here but thought I might help inform as I just learned this myself. Makes me think if I had a dog id be training him for this. It was an all around awsome experience.

Her is a pick of the dog/tracker/and deer.

Also a pic of the trackers info. I would highly recommend him as was very good to work with.

 

[Giovanna]

Understand the sentiment.

The other side of the coin is this. Certain shots and situations..... absolutely the right move is to wait. Especially if shot back. Deer will can live up to 24 hours hit back. But they usually dont go far and will be dead in first bed IF they dont get pushed. The second piece to that is a dog works waaaaaayyyy better if you haven't boogered up the trail. If they get bumped they can go a LONG way and usually you arnt going to find them.

Havent seen the video you are referencing so not sure of the specific situation. Just noting there is a time and place to waiting

You are 100% correct on wait times, particularly during the rut.
I can't speak to to "just being about the the antlers"...but tracking too soon, bumping the deer certainly can make recovery more difficult.
We track for the public, and we see more hunters understanding proper wait times which without a doubt results in more recovered deer.
Haven't seen the TV show, but sounds like they have a good handle on this.

 

[Bucksnbears]

I'm not knocking using dogs to track a deer.
Let's be honest about it though. I'm guessing the vast majority of deer can be found just by blood trailing. To give it no effort ain't right.
That deer can be laying dead 50 yards from impact and to wait that long to start trailing is Wanton Waste!

You leave a deer overnight here, almost gaureteed the coyotes will have found it. Great chance the coyotes are gonna find the deer and bump it also if still alive.

Sorry, I'm not gonna salvage what's left after coyotes have been ripping into it.
You wait 24 hours and find the deer, ain't no way I'm eating that meat.
(Would you)?

Wonder how many would wait 24 hours if it's " just a doe"?.

 

[deerhunter93]

Are you just wanting to rant or are you open to hearing other's opinions and experiences?

I have not used a dog or drone to recover a deer but I believe they have a time and place and can be extremely valuable in recovering an animal. There are countless scenarios where guys would never have found a deer had they not used outside help. I hit a big 10pt about 4 years ago that I thought was a great hit on a quartering away shot. There was very minimal blood and the last speck was about 750 yards from impact. I never found that buck and wish I would have called a dog. Like others have mentioned, trackers would prefer the hunter to not track the deer if a dog is going to be used. I do agree that it seems like immediately backing out is possibly used too much but it may have taken one bad experience where they went in too soon and bumped the deer and never found it to change their approach.

It would be nice if we could watch them all fall within sight and never have to worry about it but that's part of the game. I have left a few deer over night and I believe only one of them was eaten on by coyotes but that is always a concern of mine. I am aware there are areas out there that leaving one overnight isn't possible due to coyote numbers.

I would likely be one of the hunters that falls in the camp of calling a dog to help locate a buck vs a doe.

 

[John Young]

I am ok with calling in the dogs and drones if you have done your job tracking the deer and come up empty. To take the shot and immediately go to I am going to use these tools is a little greedy and unprofessional to me! I get wanting to recover your deer - but make the effort to track, learn, and respect the animal

The problem with that is that the more scent you lay down messing up the area the less chance you have of the dog finding your deer. So the moment it doesn’t feel right the best thing you can do is back out and quit contaminating the area.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[booneriverbucks]

I don’t have a huge problem with tracking dogs, but I can’t say I like the idea of automatically waiting a day and just calling in the dog becoming common practice. Overall, dogs and game tracking are common throughout the history of hunting and they have their place. I also have no problem waiting 16+ hours to look for a deer if the shot is questionable because it is impossible to find a deer that isn’t dead yet.
Drones- not so much. We cannot even effectively regulate drone useage on currently approved activities . I was at a convention recently for pesticide application and drone industry representatives freely admitted only %61 of drone aerial applicators were legally licesnsed to spray with drones. This is an extremely highly regulated industry at both the state and federal level and somehow even drone companies freely admitted almost %40 of their users were illegal. How on earth are we going to expect game wardens to enforce drone laws related to hunting when even multiple state and federal agencies fail to do so for other uses. It’s best to draw a hard line and start limiting the technology used while hunting. Most agree everything was better 30 years ago before much of our currently used hunting tech was available .. why are there constant cries to keep going the other direction?

 

[John Young]

I don’t have a huge problem with tracking dogs, but I can’t say I like the idea of automatically waiting a day and just calling in the dog becoming common practice. Overall, dogs and game tracking are common throughout the history of hunting and they have their place.
Drones- not so much. We cannot even effectively regulate drone useage on currently approved activities . I was at a convention recently for pesticide application and drone industry representatives freely admitted only %61 of drone aerial applicators were legally licesnsed to spray with drones. This is an extremely highly regulated industry at both the state and federal level and somehow even drone companies freely admitted almost %40 of their users were illegal. How on earth are we going to expect game wardens to enforce drone laws related to hunting when even multiple state and federal agencies fail to do so for other uses. It’s best to draw a hard line and start limiting the technology used while hunting. Most agree everything was better 30 years ago before much of our currently used hunting tech was available .. why are there constant cries to keep going the other direction?

Where I’m at in Van Buren County if you left your deer 24 hours all the time you would rarely get meat because the coyotes would beat you too it most of the time. It’s a bummer but we have a tremendous amount of coyotes. I killed three without trying a couple weeks ago on 5 all day sits


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[booneriverbucks]

Where I’m at in Van Buren County if you left your deer 24 hours all the time you would rarely get meat because the coyotes would beat you too it most of the time. It’s a bummer but we have a tremendous amount of coyotes. I killed three without trying a couple weeks ago on 5 all day sits


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Totally agree.. It’s never good when a poor shot is made. I’ve never had to use one luckily but it kind of looks like most dog trackers prefer to wait 24 hours + if the shot is questionable. Much better to find the thing either way and get some closure than chasing something that’s not dead all around the country.

 

[Giovanna]

Couple things...
A 24 hour wait time is not always needed, however this is what most knowledgeable trackers will use as a minimum for bucks hit behind the diaphram during the rut, particularly intestinal shot deer, take longer to die during this time of year.
Early October is a different story, and they will die sooner. So are does. We don't wait that long on does. They die quicker in warm weather as well.
As far as meet consumption, the deer is not laying dead for 24 hours. Many times we find they have expired not too long before we find them.
Coyotes are for sure a problem, depending on the area. However, the deer that are tracked to soon and pushed leave a longer trail for the coyotes to follow.
Most of the deer we track for folks, the hunter has already tracked. When tracking changes to searching, they call.
Others just back out and call when they know the shot is marginal. We love these tracks. Some folks just enjoy watching a dog work, and consider it a bonus to the hunt.
It's all good.

 

[Bucksnbears]

Let's give our woodsmanship skills a workout first. (that's how we LEARN)

I can forsee a new crop of hunters coming in, flinging arrows and well, (let's call in a dog guy".

Sure hate to see it become The New Norm.
Learning how to bloodtrail is part of hunting SO Learn How To Do It!

Hell, let's bring back the POD, hit em in the foot watch em run 50 yards n tip over.
Of course dog trackers are gonna suggest a long wait time, they make $ on it, and enjoy watching the dogs work. They don't give 2 craps if the meat is spoiled.
Yes DH 93, the title of this thread had the word "rant" in it so yeah...
You shoot, you track to the best of your abilities and if that fail, call in a dog tracker. Not shoot and call them without an effort to find your damn deer!
I think I made that kinda clear in the first post?

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

Let's give our woodsmanship skills a workout first. (that's how we LEARN)

I can forsee a new crop of hunters coming in, flinging arrows and well, (let's call in a dog guy".

Sure hate to see it become The New Norm.
Learning how to bloodtrail is part of hunting SO Learn How To Do It!

Hell, let's bring back the POD, hit em in the foot watch em run 50 yards n tip over.
Of course dog trackers are gonna suggest a long wait time, they make $ on it, and enjoy watching the dogs work. They don't give 2 craps if the meat is spoiled.
Yes DH 93, the title of this thread had the word "rant" in it so yeah...
You shoot, you track to the best of your abilities and if that fail, call in a dog tracker. Not shoot and call them without an effort to find your damn deer!
I think I made that kinda clear in the first post?

So if you know you hit a deer back your tracking to give your woodsmanship skills a workout? I don't call that learning....

 

[Bucksnbears]

Hmm?. OK.
I guess I do.


I'm old and old school. I relish the blood trail. Like fresh meat also.
You gonna salvage the meat after a 24 hour wait 83?.
Didn't think so.

 

[Sligh1]

Trying to understand premise of post & where I tried to picture your mental frame of mind based on the title/subject….

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

Hmm?. OK.
I guess I do.


I'm old and old school. I relish the blood trail. Like fresh meat also.
You gonna salvage the meat after a 24 hour wait 83?.
Didn't think so.

If you wait when appropriate the deer will not have been dead for anywhere near 24 hours. So ya we have salvaged most of the animal unless it's really warm out. The alternative to going too soon is the only ones that get meat are the coyotes cuz the deer gets bumped to the next county.

 

[CurtisWalker]

Hmm?. OK.
I guess I do.


I'm old and old school. I relish the blood trail. Like fresh meat also.
You gonna salvage the meat after a 24 hour wait 83?.
Didn't think so.

I’ve salvaged meat a couple times after a 24 hour wait time. I’ve never used a dog but I think it’s a great tool.