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All Things Logging/Timber Harvest - Discussion

ELK919

New Member
My Hope with this new thread is; it could be a place for less experienced land owners/operators to visit, ask questions, find answers and gain knowledge from some of the many experts that are on these forums. A place where most logging/selective cuts/etc can be found without having to read a number of different threads. A collaborative discussion thread (if there already a is specific thread that I missed please tag me in it)

I have listened to podcasts, read other websites, forums, etc - some are in agreeance, some are contradictory, and some ask questions and never get any responses.

I know that there are differences in every situations but Here are some of the questions that I have.

My Scenario: I bought my piece of land almost exactly 1 year ago, so I am very new and raw to the land owner position. So I don't know what I don't know and I want to make sure I am understanding, asking the right questions, and not getting screwed over in every deal.

So, I am meeting with a State forester and a logger next Friday (they both have spoken very highly of one another) to walk my 30~ acres of hard land bottom that are mostly walnut. I have mentioned to both I am looking to do a selective cut, only cutting mature and ready trees with a focus on creating better wildlife habitat.

1. Going into this meeting are there any specific resources anyone would recommend watching/listening to?
2. What are specific contract questions to be asking that someone may not be asking?
3. I don't have a lot of income coming off of the land so I want to make the most amount of money off of this deal but also planning for future harvests -
4. Are there specific ways to negotiate the prices of the each harvest or do the loggers pretty much have the upper hand in naming their prices?
-Prices vary with the markets but is there typically way to figure out what the percentage the landowner gets off the each deal?
- or how would a person know if a loggers price is fair and they aren't getting taken advantage of?
5. What are ways to control the amount slash/debris? and is this typically in the contract?
6. Would you recommend them leaving the tops to create thicker bedding areas?
7. Do you know of any specific NRCS/FSA/Federal Forestry Dept. grants, cost sharing programs available?
8. Focusing on wildlife and habitat, is there anything that you would advise FOR or AGAINST that would directly impact wildlife and how the operation would be done?

I would appreciate any insight anyone has whether it is more questions or thoughts or answers.
 
Strong opinion: I would back up and not be working with one individual logger. Find a private forester (not DNR) to bid the sale to multiple buyers. The range of bids might shock you.
Very much concur. ^^ Coming from someone, me, that worked with one individual logger. Harrumph. Looking back, I now know that I left several thousand dollars on the table in my exchange.

A couple of other thoughts...if you have veneer quality walnuts then you REALLY want to do it right. As the difference between a run of the mill walnut log and a true veneer quality log can be thousands of dollars per. Also, something that I did do right...I marked the trees that I wanted them to take...and some that I DID'NT want them to take. Be very intentional here, don't leave it to someone else.

Please consider IBH's advice above...it could really be a game changer for you. Good luck, great thread topic.
 
Strong opinion: I would back up and not be working with one individual logger. Find a private forester (not DNR) to bid the sale to multiple buyers. The range of bids might shock you.
I do think this would be the best case and wouldnt know the first place to start, however, I have called i bet close to 10 different guys that log or used to log and dont anymore, and I just havent had much success in finding interest or willingness to travel to location, etc.. Also, I do have multiple references for the guy I am meeting with that have had high praise for him, in price fairness and quality of work, which is refreshing to hear.


Daver: I definitely will be marking specific trees, this is the reason, i want the forester to walk with us, because truthfully I am not 100% confident in what exactly I am looking at...1 thing I am 100% sure on is I will make sure it is a selective cut and not a clear cut! (unless i have them remove a bunch of cedars ;) )
 
I have a couple questions for walnut.

1. Is there a certain diameter that they need before they would cut?
2. Is there a general minimum number trees that a logger would want before they would bother with it?
 
I have an upcoming logging project that I'm planning for the end of February, I worked with a state forester to start. My trees are not as valuable as yours. Maples, but their BIG, and need to go. My farm was like a city park before I started cutting some on my own. Then after I had a narrow miss I decided to have someone log it. We marked like 100 trees, but left a bunch of big ones that we didn't mark. I'm going to Cut my property a little harder than the forester suggested, because my goal is thick, nasty cover, and a sanctuary environment. I want the deer to feel safe. I'm logging for habitat purposes, if I can pocket a few bucks in the process that's fine. I've had 2 loggers bid the project.
 
I have an upcoming logging project that I'm planning for the end of February, I worked with a state forester to start. My trees are not as valuable as yours. Maples, but their BIG, and need to go. My farm was like a city park before I started cutting some on my own. Then after I had a narrow miss I decided to have someone log it. We marked like 100 trees, but left a bunch of big ones that we didn't mark. I'm going to Cut my property a little harder than the forester suggested, because my goal is thick, nasty cover, and a sanctuary environment. I want the deer to feel safe. I'm logging for habitat purposes, if I can pocket a few bucks in the process that's fine. I've had 2 loggers bid the project.
How is maple market?
 
How is the walnut market ?
Is there a specific place to look for market updates? I assume all markets can vary by region, sawmills in the area, etc? Would you just call a sawmill and ask what the going prices are for each type of tree you or how does someone get a specific update on how the market value of each species?
 
Iowa Bowhunter I had 2 loggers look at the trees, and they each gave me a bid. One of the loggers was referred to me by a friend that has had him do a lot of work. It looks to me like the maple market is 50-60 dollars a tree depending how big, and board footage. Like I said I'm interested in improving the property and making it nasty thick. So the dollars per tree is a bonus.
 
The way I would start the process is like this
1. Walk your property with the State Forester. He can give you general info on what you have, some possible market conditions and most important what can be done long term to meet your goals. Also possible post harvest cost share for TSI.
2. Find a Consulting forester and explain your goals exactly and have him mark the timber and manage the sale. Make sure he sends the bids out with plenty of time for inspection prior to the deadline.
The bad news is all this takes time. If its a big sale my guess is starting now you could be 12-18 months from the cutting even starting
 
Really I’d start with the forester and work on your “woodland plan” first. Get that ironed out and then the information you will get will go a long ways. Remember the further you get from a mill- the less you will get for logs too. So that will also play a factor as to who will want to buy them and if they can get enough for a semi load (hopefully multiples) in an area helps drive up price as well. I had my place cut and talked to all the neighbors and everyone jumped on board to make the prices better for everyone. Between 4 of us, we had enough for 7 semi loads out of good quality stuff. Every buyer will also want their own size range we found out- which was interesting. But start with your forester- get your plan down- that will help gauge how many you’re dealing with to help value your sale.
 
We are members of The Iowa Woodland Owners Association. They hold field days, throughout the state, throughout the year. Most are held at a members property, some at a State Forest. All topics, tree related, are covered at one event or another. And obviously, there are a lot of topics!
 
Many good suggestions here. It is probably worth mentioning that loggers as a whole are some of the least trustworthy individuals out there. The profession is overweight these types because of the ease of taking advantage of landowners. I always recommend utilizing a private forester as they are worth the percentage that they charge. Also, utilize a good written agreement (contract) with the logger and get references.
 
It will be interesting to see if the wild fires have an impact on the lumber materials market ?

The devastation could potentially be #1 all time in US history in terms of costly disasters!:confused:
 
It will be interesting to see if the wild fires have an impact on the lumber materials market ?

The devastation could potentially be #1 all time in US history in terms of costly disasters!:confused:
Hurrican Katrina leveled like 140,000 homes and damaged a million. Last I saw this fire was up to 10,000. Much more expensive homes due to location but so far this is nothing compared to a massive hurricane.
 
Iowa Bowhunter I had 2 loggers look at the trees, and they each gave me a bid. One of the loggers was referred to me by a friend that has had him do a lot of work. It looks to me like the maple market is 50-60 dollars a tree depending how big, and board footage. Like I said I'm interested in improving the property and making it nasty thick. So the dollars per tree is a bonus.
I looked at a farm last week. MONSTER maples. No exaggeration I bet a million + board feet of 80 acres. If there was a market......
 
  • Deleted by IowaBowHunter1983
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It will be interesting to see if the wild fires have an impact on the lumber materials market ?

The devastation could potentially be #1 all time in US history in terms of costly disasters!:confused:
It’s already the most costly I believe. Up to around 150 billion.

A lot of our wood now comes from Canada so natural or unnatural disasters don’t really affect our lumber prices.
 
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