bkcrrtnps
Well-Known Member
ha WV has 4 Bowhunting counties and we know WV isn't a big buck state nor do they have any agriculture but those 4 counties turn out studs every year!
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- Thread starter Hardwood11
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KnuckleDragr
Active Member
Totally agree, Sligh. I hope and pray that every other state lobbies to mirror our current regs in hopes of being the whitetail destination that we are known for.
Daver
PMA Member
I agree!! Why don't other states with poor buck hunting model their regs after Iowa...instead of the multiple and various efforts to mold the Iowa regs after the substandard states around us??? It's bananas!
Solve this and you are a genius!
in2harrisonCO
New Member
Nebraska Too!!!
Agree. I've hunted every state bordering Iowa or accompanied hunters. Except Minnesota but I have multiple buddies who flee MN to come hunt in Iowa. All the bordering states- I've spent multiple years in. Have multiple buddies with multiple farms there. The contrast in quality is staggering in every example. Like I said earlier - words can't explain it and I wish folks wanting to mess with our seasons could spend year's in these other states or my home state of Michigan. If they had to hunt there for a few years- I believe these same people would change their mind and fight to keep IOWA the same top state and defend our regulations instead of changing them.
The closest place To the quality of Iowa ive spent years hunting is KANSAS, right by NE border (where KS is substantially better than NE IMO) and Kansas is so good - coincidentally because of December gun season. Now, if folks read up on all the Kansas websites and talk to KS residents- U'll hear what I saw 1st hand there too- regulations from special interests hurting hunting. Once again- changes like guaranteed tags vs when I started there it was a draw. Late doe season, landowners reselling tags to out of staters for a while, etc, etc. Once again, when I spent my "decade" hunting other areas- I also saw KS take some drastic hits, quality loss and pressure increases. I saw it 1st hand. Not as bad as Illinois but it got worse. I mean, for those who would travel for the best regulated state and most sound, common sense management - where do we go if Iowa goes down from all these special interest folks pushing all this non stop garbage, new seasons, new regs, etc. If u want to go to the "great area" after Iowa was ruined (if it happened like many other states unless u Own a few thousand acres) - where u go- Canada???? Leave Iowa alone!
Hardwood11
It is going to be a good fall!
Oh yeah!! Nebraska and I'll add South Dakota.
Non-typ.
Active Member
Will never change Mo gun season because gun hunters won't let it happen. Just like the party hunting in Iowa. Now if Mo moved the gun season out of the rut, only allowed 6000 non.res. tags and no non.res.landowner tags. You guys wouldn't have any where to go after you filled your Iowa tags.
Liv4Rut
Active Member
why would you want to move gun season out of the rut if you had it. Most likely it would be your best crack at a cruising buck. That would be the fear for other states proposing to move the gun season back. People fail to see the big picture of what is going on around them.
Hardwood11
It is going to be a good fall!
Plenty of guys get it in MN. Actually quite a few gun hunters would prefer it, and all the archery guys would support it.
The MDHA (largest whitetail group in MN) is mostly Northern MN gun hunters. They work with DNR to squash any change.
Right now we are outnumbered. There is a push for change, we will see maybe in the future?
Two states would be real standouts if they moved gun season to December...besides Iowa....(Wisconsin and Missouri) Both have so many counties of good whitetail habitat.
Having just moved to Iowa after hunting 23 years in Wisconsin, I'm curious as to the reason you feel moving back the WI gun season would make such a big difference. I'm not necessarily disagreeing, just looking for clarification...
IMO, most rutting activity has ended by Thanksgiving. In the 23 years over there, I've only seen a few (two?) bucks chasing does during the 7 day season. I saw one buck hounding does my only gun season in Iowa. If most does are being bred Nov 8-15, a second estrous period a month later would actually probably miss the current WI season, but occur during Iowa's shotgun seasons.
My two cents would be that if WI moved it back 2 weeks, weather would probably be a bit of a difference maker. Some years, it would be much colder and may lead to fewer/ shorter hunts = less deer harvested. Other years will have snow cover, which would probably increase the harvest (had snow in maybe 7 of those 23 years in WI).
I think the biggest difference is the use of rifles. If WI hunters had to use shotguns, things would change BIG time.
For what it's worth, I think MN should move their rifle season back a few weeks.
Hardwood11
It is going to be a good fall!
McSheddin--You know you could be right, maybe it would not make a difference to move it two weeks. Personally I think it would help some--3/4 year old bucks make it to 5/6.
That being said, I understand that winter can come into play, and that is one reason MN and Wisconsin are reluctant to move the season back.
Rifles are a limiting factor as well. From what I have seen in Wisconsin, SW Wisc in particular, that area has such good habitat/food/genetics. It is good already, but I think it could be better yet.
Wisconsin is obviously better than MN,...SE MN with the new antler point restrictions (more mature bucks) is getting better and better. I just wish they would bump the gun season back---then look out!
That being said, I understand that winter can come into play, and that is one reason MN and Wisconsin are reluctant to move the season back.
Rifles are a limiting factor as well. From what I have seen in Wisconsin, SW Wisc in particular, that area has such good habitat/food/genetics. It is good already, but I think it could be better yet.
Wisconsin is obviously better than MN,...SE MN with the new antler point restrictions (more mature bucks) is getting better and better. I just wish they would bump the gun season back---then look out!
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in2harrisonCO
New Member
This is very true but in my opinion more bucks cruising would get shot, thus decreasing the mature breeding bucks and future hunting quality. And then a downward spiral would occur where you lose age structure more or less eliminating most of your bucks before they get reach 3-4 years old. IMO hunting quality would decrease over time.
Liv4Rut
Active Member
That is the point I was trying to make but did not come out that way. The big picture is what you describe. The tunnel vision they have is the rut is the best time to kill a cruising buck so why would they openly move gun season out of rut not realizing they would get a better age class and bigger bucks in the long term.
in2harrisonCO
New Member
I reread your original post. I miss understood. So we agree. I like what I read earlier... keep Iowa Iowa. Lead by Example.
Two states would be real standouts if they moved gun season to December...besides Iowa....(Wisconsin and Missouri) Both have so many counties of good whitetail habitat.
Having just moved to Iowa after hunting 23 years in Wisconsin, I'm curious as to the reason you feel moving back the WI gun season would make such a big difference. I'm not necessarily disagreeing, just looking for clarification...
IMO, most rutting activity has ended by Thanksgiving. In the 23 years over there, I've only seen a few (two?) bucks chasing does during the 7 day season. I saw one buck hounding does my only gun season in Iowa. If most does are being bred Nov 8-15, a second estrous period a month later would actually probably miss the current WI season, but occur during Iowa's shotgun seasons.
My two cents would be that if WI moved it back 2 weeks, weather would probably be a bit of a difference maker. Some years, it would be much colder and may lead to fewer/ shorter hunts = less deer harvested. Other years will have snow cover, which would probably increase the harvest (had snow in maybe 7 of those 23 years in WI).
I think the biggest difference is the use of rifles. If WI hunters had to use shotguns, things would change BIG time.
For what it's worth, I think MN should move their rifle season back a few weeks.
I lived in MI - same weather as Wisconsin pretty much. Possibly a bit worse with the west wind with the lake effect. A later gun season would have been stunning as to the impact and unleashing of MI potential moving the gun season out of peak rut. Let's just call the peak, Nov 8-17 or so, ballpark. I mean, a week before and after those dates in any case, bucks are running all over. Just delaying it one week would make a big difference, 2 weeks- incredible. Folks would actually have to chase after a much smarter & more aware animal. In MI - it was bucks (not a lot and no old ones) running anywhere and everyone competing to shoot every one they possibly could, the 1st 6 point that walked by - bam, done. Buck pole central. Much of that would change if the bucks weren't running around like hormone crazed lunatics and many more would reach maturity. Common sense we can demonstrate anytime you step foot on late gun season land like iowa.
The weather objection - Bull crap 2 weeks makes that much difference. one year a storm will be nov 10 and the next it will be Dec 4. One nov 20 it will be 35 and one year it'll be 15. It's all over the board from year to year, 2 weeks won't change that a whole lot. For the top tier of MI, MN, WI - I realize the weather does create snow that makes deer herd up. Those areas, imo, if I was making the decision (which I'm not of course!
By moving the gun season out, there's just so many widespread benefits that the ramifications could comprise 10 pages here. 1 BIG ONE that folks overlook...... BOWHUNTERS would get 2 more weeks of bowhunting during "GOOD HUNTING" if they could make that wise move. I mean, heck, in most places, honestly, it didn't get ON FIRE, until Nov 5. So, as bowhunters, maybe most places you get, at best, 10 days a year of really good hunting? Then, say you have to work a few of those or get storms a few, heck, it could be 4-5 days of really good bowhunting. Man, that's depressing. For how much I know I love bowhunting, heck, I'd move out of a state like that if I could only have about 4, 5, 6 days of good bowhunting..... OH WAIT - I DID!!!
You'll find me in a tree until about Dec 1 or 2 and it will be dang good right up until then, I get an extra 2 full weeks or 3 full weeks compared to my buddies to N, S and Northeast up in MI. And it's amazing hunting. I stop around Dec 1 or 2 so the bucks can have peace before gun and have as much a sanctuary as possible.
Let me CLEARLY EXPLAIN MI BOW & GUN HUNTING IN VERY SHORT (this is from 10 straight hardcore years of this or more)...... I hunted HARDCORE NUTS about Nov 2-3 til the 14th. It got good about the 6th or 7th really (good, like you saw 1-3 1 year olds in a sit & a 2 year old on an amazing day- super rare occasion, that's defining "the best" of the year) until the 14th. So, I had the great hunting from about 6-7th to 14th and got out as much as possible. On the 15th, gun season started across the state, Armies formed, battle plans finalized, the troops lined up with artillery & air support.... Before light, the artillery started popping off left & right. By the time the sun was up, troops in orange dotted the landscape. By 9 or 10 am, ammo drops by helicopter were needed, napalm bombs were called with "broken arrow" being cast across the radio. Pushes all day, wave after wave, eliminating as many of those horned enemies as folks could find (for some reason folks refer to bucks as "Charlie" there and look to kill them as quickly & efficiently as possible, rooting them out from any hiding spots. By late afternoon into sundown, the barrage kept strong & firing continued until most ran out of shells or decided it was time to leave their bunkers. Day 2 of gun season, this was generally my last day of the year. The few escapees being tracked down usually got found and eradicated, obviously I made it out with my own life each year to be writing this. 3rd day, I didn't go out (battle fatigue, maybe a form of PTSD or battle shock/shell shock from seeing the carnage), that was a wrap for deer season, Nov 17th of each year was a day I did not go out and looked forward to next year. There was no point after the 2nd day. Everything was dead or found some magic hole to hide in. No point of going out for the rest of the yr.
I never considered looking for a shed & I can recall less than 10 occasions in my life seeing bucks after gun season and couldn't believe my eyes. Nov 17th marked the end of season - how sad is that?!?!? Even though I spent countless days in the MI woods from 6 to 22 years old, I have NEVER FOUND ONE SHED, EVER.
Most of this is true.... The parts I embellished on or maybe exaggerated ....... Well, maybe I didn't even see close to 10 bucks after gun season I've seen make it where I lived over all those years combined, maybe it was really closer to half that. So, ok, maybe a little embellishment for effect here.
In all seriousness. A total disaster. Millions of hunters, all out heavily armed with guns Nov 15th and almost all blasted the 1st 1.5 year old they saw. one of highest amount of hunters in the country, a miracle a buck ever made it to 2 years old (i've seen or killed less than 7-8 living there my entire life and can see twice that in one night in IA) and they had a 2 buck per person system. Now, if that's not poor management, bad politics, special interests wiping out deer - I don't know a finer example of something I'd want to do more of the exact opposite possible?!?! If MI could simply put the gun season 2 weeks later in Lower Peninsula and do a common sense one buck rule, that state would actually be incredibly good. What a waste.
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