shedhunter93
PMA Member
It only took them 3-4 years before any action is happening to these elk and even though it'd be cool, its prolly a good thing they're killing them...
Iowa Elk herd to be shot...
- Thread starter ArcheryIA44
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hotshott2289
Active Member
The month and day are wrong but otherwise i was pretty surprised when i saw this when i pulled the card
moosehunter
PMA Member
If the elk were wild and wandered into Iowa I would say leave them be. These were escapes and CWD is definetly a concern. What if the DNR did nothing and in the next year or two CWD breaks out in Iowa's deer herd. I bet there would be a bunch of people questioning why the escaped elk were not taken out.
cedar creek
Banned
I know a guy that shot an elk during shotgun season in eastern Iowa some 15 years ago; maybe longer. It cost him $2500 (i believe) and his hunting privleges were revoked for several years. There has been elk coming down from Minnesota into north east Iowa for many years now. It was common to watch a local herd eat hay left for them during the winter months.
AZHunter
Iowa Boy At Heart
As ArcheryIA44 points out, elk are grazers, not browsers like deer. However, they can and will drive deer out of their habitat. It happens all the time out west, especially when you are dealing with a subspecies that is not native to where it is established. In AZ, Merriam's elk were wiped out around 1917 and around 1930 Rocky Mountain elk were brought down from Yellowstone to get an elk herd reestablished for hunting. Needless to say they THRIVED. Now, 80 years later they are a nuisance in several areas because they get into habitats that the Merriam's elk never got into and the RM elk are destroying aspen stands, which are an important early seral succesional species after wildfires. And several of our hunting units have decreased deer populations (mule and whitetail) becaue the elk numbers have flourished and habitat has, at times, been managed to improve trophy elk units (good for elk, bad for deer). Don't get me wrong, I love elk and I love hunting them, but allowing non-native species (subspecies in this case) into ecosystems they are not evolved with can be very detrimental to the ecosystem. Eastern elk were native to Iowa, but eradicated 100+ years ago. You don't want RM elk in Iowa. They will graze all of the good crops, alfalfa, etc. right alongside the deer and cattle and they will outcompete deer by the sheer volume of what they eat. I've seen what they will do to crops out west, especially when they don't migrate because the food source is so good and constant. And if IA DNR's management regulations are like AZGFD's management regs, then there can be no net benefit from removal of non-native/invasive species. I've shot tons of bullfrogs in the name of recovery of federally listed species and had to leave the frogs to lay (no frog legs for supper) because there can be no benefit from the management actions. Same for fish removal. Tons of bass, sunfish, catfish, carp, etc. seined/poisoned out of lakes, streams, ponds to aid in the recovery of native fish and we have to let them lay. I can't say I agree with it, but I do have to follow the regs.
As far as the Neal Smith NWR supporting a limited hunting opportunity, ArcheryIA44 is again correct in that it is a Federal matter, not a state matter. Nothing against the IA DNR, but state wildlife management agencies don't have much (if any) say on what hunting regulations and opportunities occur on NWRs. It does behoove NWRs to partner with the state agencies, though, to avoid "us vs. them" mentalities that get everyone nowhere.
As far as the Neal Smith NWR supporting a limited hunting opportunity, ArcheryIA44 is again correct in that it is a Federal matter, not a state matter. Nothing against the IA DNR, but state wildlife management agencies don't have much (if any) say on what hunting regulations and opportunities occur on NWRs. It does behoove NWRs to partner with the state agencies, though, to avoid "us vs. them" mentalities that get everyone nowhere.
Nontypcl1
Member
I have hundreds of pictures of a young bull elk from a couple years ago that was roaming my area. I saw him on a number of occasions while on stand. I thought it was pretty cool going out to my stand knowing that I had a good chance of seeing that elk during my hunt.
That darn thing ended up destroying one of my trail cams and I also got video of him thrashing another one. Evidently he got tired of getting his picture taken. When I talked to my CO about it he said definitely do not shoot it because they were protected. I guess it's seems kind of odd that the DNR is going to shoot this group of elk then.
If they are indeed wild elk and just roamed down here I don't understand why they are being shot. Sure they could do crop damage, but they were native here at one time. Why not let them be until a population became large enough that they really might need controlled?
That darn thing ended up destroying one of my trail cams and I also got video of him thrashing another one. Evidently he got tired of getting his picture taken. When I talked to my CO about it he said definitely do not shoot it because they were protected. I guess it's seems kind of odd that the DNR is going to shoot this group of elk then.
If they are indeed wild elk and just roamed down here I don't understand why they are being shot. Sure they could do crop damage, but they were native here at one time. Why not let them be until a population became large enough that they really might need controlled?
Nontypcl1
Member
AZhunter, you made some very good points. I didn't realize that it was a different subspecies than what was native here and to me that makes a lot of difference. Thanks for enlightening me on the subject. However, I still do believe that if they are shot then the meat should at least be donated to local shelters.
AZHunter
Iowa Boy At Heart
Absolutely my pleasure, Nontyp! And I don't disagree with you at all. The meat should not be wasted, but I don't make the rules and regs. I don't even know if the scenario I presented is in IA DNR's regs, its just an example I have to live with. I don't know how many times I've shaken my head at all the meat I've had to leave to waste. At least the racoons, skunks, vultures, etc. were well fed.
If an elk vs. vehicle shows up on an insurance claim or one farmer complains about a couple cobs being eat'n, Farm Bureau will have them dead in less than a week. Problem solved.:way:
Seriously though, if they wanted them dead quick. All they'd have to do is tell the general public to........"have at em boys". I'd make that trip myself, just for the tender morsels.
Hopefully there's been no disease associated with them.
:way:Seriously though, if they wanted them dead quick. All they'd have to do is tell the general public to........"have at em boys". I'd make that trip myself, just for the tender morsels.
Hopefully there's been no disease associated with them.
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jjohnson
Well-Known Member
These Elk have been around for quite a few years now and now some of them have been born in the wild. There is a lot of pissed off people up here now that they're trying to get rid of them. From what I understand the DNR is not overseeing this. It's the AG department I believe. A couple farmers complained about crop damage. They may not get them all. There is a group of people soaping the bait so they stay away. It's turned into a pretty big deal.
I don't really have an opinion on whether or not they should be allowed to stay but I just don't understand why they don't tranc them and test them or move them.
I don't really have an opinion on whether or not they should be allowed to stay but I just don't understand why they don't tranc them and test them or move them.
nannyslayer
New Member
O good lord, we have soapers in Iowa now? I thought it was only in Kansas, now they've migrated across the boarder?
Seems Tide was the soap of choice for whitetails, what do the soapers use to keep elk off of property? Or is the Tide multipurpose, like it says on the box?
JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
If it is anything like tranqing a whitetail deer, it takes about 20-30 minute for the drug to take effect and the animal can travel a great distance in that time. Where is the animal going to go? Murphy's law says somewhere that it will take a helicopter to get it out of. Not like two guys are going to grab hold and drag it out.
Then, it would need to be penned until the test results come back. How long will that take? How much feed?
Who would pay for all that? Most likely taxpayers.
kbnelson3
Supporter of Landowners
These elk have summered on our farm for the last 3 or 4 years. CWD threat is bunk. Iowa already has CWD if they're ever going to get it, this is another excuse for the DNR to stick their nose where it doesn't belong. The DNR in Allamakee County doesn't have time to investigate poaching cases but they're going to spend money and time trying to kill all of these elk? I'm really hoping they move back towards our place or any of our neighbors; the DNR certainly won't feel welcome there.
On the elk causing crop damage: I've watched this little herd a lot, I've seen them in cornfields, they're no worse than whitetails or raccoons. Typical farmers complaining..
On the elk causing crop damage: I've watched this little herd a lot, I've seen them in cornfields, they're no worse than whitetails or raccoons. Typical farmers complaining..
cedar creek
Banned
That's simply not true. Too bad they aren't eating your crops, but then again you're not a farmer.
kbnelson3
Supporter of Landowners
There's 10 elk tops. You're telling me they're doing noticeably more damage than the THOUSANDS of racoon or HUNDREDS of deer? Have you actually watched these elk ever?
thats what I thought.
wegner36
New Member
(From wikipedia, so not positive on the credibility)
Elk consume an average of 9.1 kilograms (20 lb) of various foodstuffs daily
(roughly four times that of a whitetail) so that would put the 10 at eating the same as 40 deer... not to mention eating habits, as some have said deer are more of a browser where elk are more grazer... 20 lbs would be bad enough in the fall, but what about in the spring, when a heard of 10 elk shows up on a bean field where the beans are 3 inches tall, 200 lbs of been seedlings is where the real damage comes into place...
One thing i'm fairly ignorant to is how much the elk will move during spring/summer, if they concentrate on feeding in one field that would also be a major difference
I don't believe that the worries of crop damage are for the small number of elk now, it would be for the reestablishment of an elk population,
AZHunter
Iowa Boy At Heart
While Wikipedia is not the most credible source, you are right on track with what I was eluding to in my previous comment. It doesn't take nearly as many elk to reduce forage as deer can/will. While 10 elk alone may not be an issue, you are dead on in that if allowed to grow, it will become VERY problematic, especially on crops and other habitat areas as elk completely alter the ecosystem.
And it really depends on the area as to whether or not they migrate. I know of several herds that don't migrate from summer to winter grounds simply because there is a constant healthy food source and the conditions are favorable year round. I know several farmers in one valley in Colorado that will gladly let you hunt cow elk from the resident herd that are destroying their crops.
Way to reiterate the point, Wegner!!
blake
Life Member
From the Iowa DNR:
Formerly Captive Deer, Elk Pose Health Risk to Wild Deer in Iowa
Posted: February 15, 2011
Iowa wildlife officials have been tracking elk in and around the Yellow River State Forest that are likely escapees from a captive herd in Allamakee County. One elk was killed by state conservation officers last week, but at least four remain at large, which gives state officials cause for concern about the potential impacts from disease to Iowa's white tailed deer herd and domestic livestock industry.
The DNR has been working with the state veterinarian at the Iowa Department of Agriculture and Land Stewardship (IDALS), who supports the effort to dispatch the escaped elk.
Dr. Dale Garner, chief of wildlife with the Iowa Department of Natural Resources, said the instances of escapees from captive deer and elk herds are on the increase.
"Our top concern is for the health of our deer herd and for our domestic livestock," Garner said. "Because once chronic wasting disease (CWD) or bovine tuberculosis (TB) is out there, there is no going back. For the most part, there will be no happy ending to this situation."
CWD is a neurological disease affecting cervids, primarily deer and elk. It is caused by an abnormal protein, called a prion, that attacks the brains of infected animals, causing them to lose weight, display abnormal behavior and lose bodily functions. Signs include excessive salivation, thirst and urination, loss of appetite, progressive weight loss, listlessness and drooping ears and head.
Garner said the problems associated with CWD are unfolding across the river in Wisconsin where five years ago, less than 10 percent of the male deer in the herd from their core area had CWD. Today, that number is more than 20 percent. In Wyoming, the percentage with CWD is much higher.
There have been 48 instances in Iowa since 2007 of elk escaping from captive herds involving 81 animals. When an elk sighting report comes in, the DNR works with IDALS to determine status of elk and the best available options. If the elk can be returned to the proper owners, then they are. If not, they then pose a risk to spreading CWD and/or other diseases and are dispatched. The elk are tested for CWD and if the tests are negative, the meat is donated to local needy families or a food bank.
"While the risk that the escapees are introducing CWD or TB to our wild deer may be small, the consequence to the resource is enormous," Garner said. "This is a risk that should be avoided.
"Having these escapees is more than a minor irritation. The prion linked to CWD does not go away when the infected animal dies. It stays active in the soil and contaminated soil can infect other animals, in addition to animal to animal transmission," Garner said. "TB is extremely difficult to get rid of and cost billions of dollars to the livestock industry."
Deer hunting has been a $200 million per year economic boost to much of rural Iowa through gas, lodging, meals and hunting supplies. Deer hunters have traveled to hunt in northeast Iowa, where about 10 percent of Iowa's deer harvest occurs in Winneshiek, Allamakee, Fayette and Clayton counties.
Garner said Iowa does not have the large land areas typically needed to support an elk herd. Elk are two to three times the size of an Iowa white tail, averaging between 500 to 700 pounds.
Formerly Captive Deer, Elk Pose Health Risk to Wild Deer in Iowa
Posted: February 15, 2011
Iowa wildlife officials have been tracking elk in and around the Yellow River State Forest that are likely escapees from a captive herd in Allamakee County. One elk was killed by state conservation officers last week, but at least four remain at large, which gives state officials cause for concern about the potential impacts from disease to Iowa's white tailed deer herd and domestic livestock industry.
The DNR has been working with the state veterinarian at the Iowa Department of Agriculture and Land Stewardship (IDALS), who supports the effort to dispatch the escaped elk.
Dr. Dale Garner, chief of wildlife with the Iowa Department of Natural Resources, said the instances of escapees from captive deer and elk herds are on the increase.
"Our top concern is for the health of our deer herd and for our domestic livestock," Garner said. "Because once chronic wasting disease (CWD) or bovine tuberculosis (TB) is out there, there is no going back. For the most part, there will be no happy ending to this situation."
CWD is a neurological disease affecting cervids, primarily deer and elk. It is caused by an abnormal protein, called a prion, that attacks the brains of infected animals, causing them to lose weight, display abnormal behavior and lose bodily functions. Signs include excessive salivation, thirst and urination, loss of appetite, progressive weight loss, listlessness and drooping ears and head.
Garner said the problems associated with CWD are unfolding across the river in Wisconsin where five years ago, less than 10 percent of the male deer in the herd from their core area had CWD. Today, that number is more than 20 percent. In Wyoming, the percentage with CWD is much higher.
There have been 48 instances in Iowa since 2007 of elk escaping from captive herds involving 81 animals. When an elk sighting report comes in, the DNR works with IDALS to determine status of elk and the best available options. If the elk can be returned to the proper owners, then they are. If not, they then pose a risk to spreading CWD and/or other diseases and are dispatched. The elk are tested for CWD and if the tests are negative, the meat is donated to local needy families or a food bank.
"While the risk that the escapees are introducing CWD or TB to our wild deer may be small, the consequence to the resource is enormous," Garner said. "This is a risk that should be avoided.
"Having these escapees is more than a minor irritation. The prion linked to CWD does not go away when the infected animal dies. It stays active in the soil and contaminated soil can infect other animals, in addition to animal to animal transmission," Garner said. "TB is extremely difficult to get rid of and cost billions of dollars to the livestock industry."
Deer hunting has been a $200 million per year economic boost to much of rural Iowa through gas, lodging, meals and hunting supplies. Deer hunters have traveled to hunt in northeast Iowa, where about 10 percent of Iowa's deer harvest occurs in Winneshiek, Allamakee, Fayette and Clayton counties.
Garner said Iowa does not have the large land areas typically needed to support an elk herd. Elk are two to three times the size of an Iowa white tail, averaging between 500 to 700 pounds.