Micro Deer Management Discussion

[OneCam]

I wanted to create a thread regarding micro deer management as the "declining" deer numbers and overall deer management strategy is certainly the hot topic this year.

The DNR , influenced by legislation and numerous interest groups including your everyday hunter, create the regulations, seasons, and tags for hunters and landowners to ultimately manage Iowa's deer herd. We have some great advantages as our shotgun seasons are in December and we limit NR tags to slow the decrease in land available for hunter access. We struggle with changes as new seasons and tag allocations create "management" dynamics that we have not faced in the past.

Some key points for this discussion ...

• Education can be key factor for the ongoing success of Iowa's deer herd.
  
• Deer are very prolific and adaptable.
  
• Carrying capacity - social, habitat, herd health
  
• Hunting practices - how you hunt
  
• and micro deer management - the goals and means for achieving those goals on the grounds you hunt
  
  

Let's discuss :grin:

 

[Liv4Rut]

I think micro-managing is what it all boils down to. The DNR can't do it. Its up to you and the surrounding landowners. Some areas it will work, other areas it will be a tough sell. The best thing you can do if you aren't seeing the quantity or quality of deer you want to see is to create an action plan to make something work or if other people aren't willing to make it work find a new spot that will. Hard to do when you own land though but with many improvements to the proper and low impact hunting can make the world of difference.

 

[dbltree]

• 
  
• Deer are very prolific and adaptable.
  
• Carrying capacity - social, habitat, herd health
  
• Hunting practices - how you hunt
  
• and micro deer management - the goals and means for achieving those goals on the grounds you hunt
  
  

Let's discuss :grin:

1) Is just a fact

2) Too may deer lowers quality of the deer herd

3) Archery and late Muzzleloader along with a couple antlerless during shotgun. I also hunt during the late antlerless season here in the southern counties.

4) Going back to number 1...deer are very adaptable and quickly adapt to different hunting methods with the obvious being nocturnal activity.

I hunt alone so archery helps me to harvest more deer quietly but even at that they soon adapt and I have to change tactics often.

Some places here get heavily hunted while many more are huge sanctuaries that no amount of seasons/methods of hunting will affect.

There are hundreds of unsold antlerless tags still indicating that despite having opportunity via seasons there may be no opportunity to hunt (place to hunt)

As a landowner I cannot possibly control deer living in large protected neighboring lands and have given up trying. No amount of legislation or season changes will change that unless we delve into places people are unwilling to go.

I guess you could say that often my goals are like the DNR's...unrealistic simply because it is not possible given that most landowners are concerned with

1) Protecting their deer
2) Harvesting only antlered deer

Good topic but where I live it sometimes feels like "whipping a dead horse"...

 

[150 Class]

·[FONT=&quot] Education can be key factor for the ongoing success of Iowa's deer herd. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] Deer are very prolific and adaptable. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] Carrying capacity - social, habitat, herd health<o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] Hunting practices - how you hunt<o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] and micro deer management - the goals and means for achieving those goals on the grounds you hunt[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]<o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] Education alone is key. A lot for the general public and the DNR, but also for us. I can go on and on about this but will wait for more replies. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] As for the prolific and adaptable whitetail, does MUST be harvested to maintain the "social" carrying capacity of the herd. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] We are nowhere near anything but the social carrying capacity of the herd. The habitat will be destroyed far before the herd heath becomes a critical issue. We have seen that in protected areas. Habitat destruction but the herd stays prolific. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] How I hunt has changed a lot over the years. Old school was let all of the does go. Only recently have I started to take some does and even though I now do, it is only at specific farms. <o></o>[/FONT]
·[FONT=&quot] As for micro management, deer travel so I am at the mercy of the DNR and the neighbor. It is impossible for me to manage how I want because my properties are not big enough without a coop or at least similar management philosophies of the neighbor. I do try to manage my places to at least have the deer travel in and out from time to time if not stay there all together.<o></o>[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I will respectfully put a different twist on some of Paul’s thoughts. I agree too many deer is unhealthy for the herd but I think we are a long ways from too many in most if not all areas of the state. Before we have that, we will have habitat destruction and deer moving to other areas, but no health issues. I’ve seen that 1^st hand. Habitat destruction and major crop damage at areas neighboring a refuge until hunting was allowed there but an overall healthy herd. Social carrying capacity will become the issue way before the habitat can’t keep up. <o>

</o>[/FONT] [FONT=&quot]I’ll also mention the opposite is happening in my area in regards to landowners only allowing buck harvests. Too many does are being harvested in the counties I hunt. Seems to be the statewide theme this year too. [/FONT]

 

[shrek1]

I'm with 150 class on this one. Maybe its because were in the same area. My main question is "What do you consider carrying capacity?" With as much agricultural resources that are in the area, we could easily feed 100 deer per square mile. I would be lucky to say we have 5-10. We won't shoot does anymore.

As for education - you can never go wrong with it- as long as your on the same page as the educator.

Micro managing is probably the key- which requires educating, realizing that people want different things and not judging others on what they want, is something we all need to learn about.

 

[Iowabowtech]

I think micromanagement is a great tool for those who have the time, money and resources to make it happen. In this context, I'm speaking of habitat and food sources. There is also the aspect of selective harvest which is another form of micro. I think it too can be of value particularly for those who have control over a large acreage that has also been managed for habitat OR is just an area that is naturally conducive to holding large deer numbers when compared to surrounding grounds.

It's hard to escape the impact of the macro view however and it's impact on micromanagement's effectiveness. This is where we start to get into social or cultural carrying capacity, season allowances and timing, tag allocations, etc. I'm interested to hear opinions on these 2 schools of thought on micromanagement and it's value as it relates to macro trends:

1.) Lower overall herd numbers mean micromanagement is more effective than ever to bring in the largest number of deer possible to the best habitat available. In this theory, managed parcels may still enjoy higher than typical deer numbers and potentially defy the macro plan in favor of the hunter. Input costs to achieve this goal are sure to be worth the resultant, localized deer numbers it outputs.

OR

2.) Lower overall herd numbers make micromangement less attractive when comparing input cost to output value. In other words, is there an equillibrium which requires a certain surrounding (macro) resource in order to make micro efforts viable and financially worthwhile?

Just curious.

 

[crietveld]

The area I live in and do the majority of hunting on is about 2-3000 acres between 15-20 landowners. Over the last ten years it has gradually become micro managed for high numbers. Ten years ago 75% was hunted hard during both gun seasons, now 75% is no hunting or lightly hunted. The capital outlay for this shift was minimal, none of my neighbors are intensively managing their land for deer. The habitat was there, with less pressure the deer are thriving in it.

Only one landowner really complains about the deer and still lets almost anybody hunt on the condition they shoot some does. It took several years of preaching to him that people just killing bucks on his farm wasn't helping to lower the herd.

I would guess the density in this area at 30-40 deer per square mile. This is based off numbers I've seen and from talking to a neighbor who provides a refuge area. This same neighbor hunted late muzzy and saw around 30 different bucks.

In summary I would have to say in my area micromanaging is working despite the DNR's goal of lowering the herd. I feel for the hunters who are seeing drastic declines in the numbers in their areas.

 

[OneCam]

Good discussion.

I tend to consider each time a hunter chooses to pull the trigger a management decision - so no one needs to own land to discuss :grin:

The areas I tend to hunt have a higher than average deer population and I feel doe harvests are continually needed to at least maintain the herd numbers. I've seen data that suggests to stabalize a deer herd - approximately 1/3 of the population needs to be harvested each year.


I too have concerns with the November Gun and late antlerless seasons for the same reasons others mention. Yet I do hunt the late season as it afford me more time to enjoy deer hunting and the outdoors- I'm ultra careful not to shoot a shed buck. My son and I did see 3 shed bucks last time out. I do hope the DNR changes the late season. I also wanted to commend the DNR for changing the November season this year to not allow public land hunting for the November shotgun antlerless season.

I personally believe the hunting pressure will dictate your deer observations - regardless of the number of deer per square mile. As we all know many areas that seem to hold more deer tend to receive less overall hunting pressure. Low impact hunting goes along way in holding and seeing deer throughout the season. How you hunt a property day after day - month after month - year after year has a dramatic impact on the number of deer the property will hold (and age class).

 

[dbltree]

Very well said Chris!

How we as landowners manage the deer on our properties is one thing, how the state is often forced to manage people and deer is quite another.

No one can force me to harvest more deer then I am comfortable with doing and because I can make safe secure habitat to hold deer I also have an effect on what deer are taken around me.

I have nothing but the highest regard for Willie and fully understand the difficulties in balancing the states whitetail herd between what sportsmen desire and those of other entities.

I also understand it's not about me...what I think one way or the other doesn't really matter except on my own property.

Not one single law in the past 15 years has been changed because myself and other sportsmen had a say in it. In my area we have seasons from September to January 31st with every concievable weapon at one time or another.

So forgive me...but why ask me what I think? What I think has no bearing on anything and since we have so many seasons...including several that I detest...what else is there?

What next? What else can be done to lower the quality of our whitetail herd? What else can you ask my opinion on that won't matter anyway?

I'm not directing my thoughts to Chris obviously but I have just grown weary of being asked what I think when legislators will in the end do what they wish anyway...

There...I feel better now...:moon::thrwrck:

 

[hillrunner]

I personally believe the hunting pressure will dictate your deer observations - regardless of the number of deer per square mile. As we all know many areas that seem to hold more deer tend to receive less overall hunting pressure. Low impact hunting goes along way in holding and seeing deer throughout the season. How you hunt a property day after day - month after month - year after year has a dramatic impact on the number of deer the property will hold (and age class). <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

This is spot on. Even the in the lowest deer density county in the state, you will find good numbers if you have a sanctuary, or only hunt ultra low impact.

 

[dbltree]

We could take a lesson from the adaptability of whitetails that's for certain and I am guilty of getting stuck in a rut or tradition rather then adapting to changes.

I'm also guilty of complaining about the things I don't like rather then focusing on the positives. For years I was a staunch archer and pretty much refused to pick up a gun but hunting with my son changed that and my atittude as well.

I like the fact that we can get antlerless permits for shotgun without spoiling our chance for a late muzzy tag and I have begun to take advantage of that.

Hunting solely with a bow made it easy for does to adapt to my hunting methods and simply avoid trees altogther, slipping through the switchgrass and staying well out of range.

This year I purchased a more modern muzzy with a good scope that allows me to take antlerless deer in both shotgun and late muzzy that had been avoiding me. The optics allow me to be certain that my target is indeed a doe and the muzzloader is accurate enough to cover the span of areas i can see from my stands.

I can easily harvest deer at a hundred yards or more and do a better job of controlling deer numbers on my property while still retaining control of what happens in regards to taking button or shed bucks.

I don't like change but deer don't like being shot at either so like them I have to change my tactics and methods. Not controlling deer numbers is not an option and failing to do so only leads to more "changes" I don't care for......

 

[Iowabowtech]

I don't like change but deer don't like being shot at either so like them I have to change my tactics and methods. Not controlling deer numbers is not an option and failing to do so only leads to more "changes" I don't care for......

Great quote.