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New black powder substitute

JNRBRONC

JNRBRONC

Well-Known Member
There is a new black powder substitute that looks good (to me), Blackhorn 209. The early word is that it is non-corrosive and does not foul the barrel. I'm sure it isn't for every BP shooter and it might not win over those who like the ease of pellets. It is plenty early in the year yet so for those who want to play with it, there is time to hit the range and develop a pet load.

Read this review by Toby Bridges.

After reading the article, I'd recommend AGAINST using Powerbelt bullets with this powder.

Another Toby article.

"Press Release"
 
Ive been reading a lot of articles about this powder over the last month or so and every time they use a 100, 110, 120g charges. There getting great velocities but Im the kind of guy thats wants as much as I can get out of something and I cant seem to find anything that says if you can safely use a measured 150g charge and if so what kinda performance would that have. I called the company today and they connected me to a tech but I only got a voicemail but left a message so I'll be sure to post the answer when I get it.
 
From a post on another forum, I guess the back of the can reads:

Volumetrically equalivalent to black powder
For bullets up to 300gr, DO NOT exceed 120 volumetric units of Blackhorn 209
For bullets above 300gr, DO NOT exceed 100 volumetric units of Blackhorn 209
Bullets over 350gr are not recommended
Not recommeded for sidelock muzzleloaders
 
Alright, gotta share. We had been using 777 pellets since we started muzzleloading. Just weren't happy with the consistency so were going to try 777 poured powder but a buddy told us about this new Blackhorn 209. We got that instead and shot it yesterday. We were amazed!

First thing we noticed was the other three guys out there shooting and they weren't happy with how their guns were performing and they were cleaning the barrel every 3 or 4 shots. We shot 16 shots before we found which load the Encore liked best. From shot 1 to 16 each loaded just as easy and seated just the same. Never had a flyer, slow ignition, and the last group was just as tight as the first. It was enjoyable being able to just load and shoot without cleaning between shots or a few shots.

We tried 120g first and it was a great group, then 90g which was scattered, then 110g and that was a touch tighter than 120g so we stuck with that. Going out tomorrow to dial in at 100yds and shoot 150 and 200yds.

Another thing we liked about this powder was the ease of clean when we got back home and it isn't supposed to be affected by temp. change or humidity. It has an extremely long self life unlike some charges that absorb moisture really easily. I'd reccomend it, its worth the extra money.
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JNRBRONC</div><div class="ubbcode-body">From a post on another forum, I guess the back of the can reads:

Volumetrically equalivalent to black powder
For bullets up to 300gr, DO NOT exceed 120 volumetric units of Blackhorn 209
For bullets above 300gr, DO NOT exceed 100 volumetric units of Blackhorn 209
Bullets over 350gr are not recommended
Not recommeded for sidelock muzzleloaders </div></div>

Thats what the bottle says but Im shooting a 350g bullet out of my .52 cal. long range hunter and it loves 88g WEIGHED which I think is the equivelant of like 123-125 volume. It makes the gun work great with the ballistic plex on my burris euro diamond scope Sighted in at 100yds the 2nd crosshair is on at 150 the 3rd is on at 200 and the 4th is like 1 1/2" low at 250yds havent had the time to shoot the bottom post at 300yds yet to see how it works but Im sure its close. Im going to try to get another range session in before late season if I do Ill take pictures of the groups at each of those ranges and post them
 
This is the stuff I mentioned in the "Which New Muzzleloader" thread. I will be sighting in my Omega using this tomorrow. I've been doing a lot of reading and it sounds like it's the real deal.

I'm the kind of guy that hates swabbing after every shot or two to get good accuracy. And I hate cleaning the TC after shooting 777. This will hopefully solve all of that.

I will let you know how tomorrow goes.

If your going to try this stuff make sure your using the right primers. DON'T USE: Winchester's 777 primers, Remington Kleanbore primers, or CCI's Muzzleloader primers.

They also say not to use any sort of water for clean-up I believe. A lot of guys were using Hoppe's and said a few swabs and your done.
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jjohnson</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This is the stuff I mentioned in the "Which New Muzzleloader" thread. I will be sighting in my Omega using this tomorrow. I've been doing a lot of reading and it sounds like it's the real deal.

I'm the kind of guy that hates swabbing after every shot or two to get good accuracy. And I hate cleaning the TC after shooting 777. This will hopefully solve all of that.

I will let you know how tomorrow goes.

If your going to try this stuff make sure your using the right primers. DON'T USE: Winchester's 777 primers, Remington Kleanbore primers, or CCI's Muzzleloader primers.

They also say not to use any sort of water for clean-up I believe. A lot of guys were using Hoppe's and said a few swabs and your done. </div></div>

JJ How did it go??
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: nacho</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Why would you not reccomend the power belt bullets with this powder???

Elaborate please.... </div></div>

From what I have heard and read about powerbelts is that depending on the gun, they can fit rather loosely (I have no experience with them). Many powder need a good pressure curve to burn efficiently and too much gas can escape around the powerbelt, preventing the pressure from building. I'm sure there are exceptions to every rule. If they fit tight in your gun, it's your call.

There are all kinds of sabots of different thicknesses (MMP black, MMP HPH12, MMP HPH24, Harvestor crushed rib black or red, etc) out there as well as bullets that vary slightly in diameter (Hornady .452 SST and XTP, Barnes Original .458, etc). I'd look for a sabot/bullet combo that was snug.
 
I have had power belts not seat well before and they lob out about 30 yards and hit the ground. Its definitely strange.
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: risto</div><div class="ubbcode-body">JJ How did it go??</div></div>

Well I would have liked to mess around with this stuff more on Friday but it was darn cold. I did end up putting about a dozen shots through the Omega though. Got it dialed in at 100yds and called it good. I was shooting 110g of powder with 250 grain superglide shockwaves. And Winchester primers. Seating the sabot was never an issue and the groups remained consistent. Even managed to get a big ol' doe on Sunday with this combination.

I will get out and do some more playing around before late muzzy season but so far so good.
 
I have always used pellets....how do you make sure you have an accurate measure of loose powder?? I know a powder measure but which one is considered the "best"
 
There are two approaches for getting the proper charge of loose powder: volumetric and weighing. They should have a variety of volumetric measuring devices at any decent sporting goods store. I have one that adjusts and kind of looks like a tire pressure gauge. You move the graduated center plunger to the volume charge desired and fill it up. This might not seem real accurate but is pretty consistent.

The other option is to get a powder scale and preweigh powder, storing it in vials. I used to preweigh all loads but this year I got lazy and used the volumetric method to fill some vials. I haven't noticed any accuracy differences from shot to shot, probably very small if there is any.

I read an article where the author weighed a bunch of pellets and reported quite the weight variance from pellet to pellet.
 
Black powder substitutes are designed to be measured volume to volume of black powder. Most substitutes weigh less than black powder and you can have problems if you weigh it. IE...over charge.
 
I might have to try this stuff out. I have never had a problem with the 777 pellets, would put the accuracy of the pellets and a 200gr shockwave up against anything in the 100-200yd range, but the cleaning after every 3 shots is a real pain in the arse. If the accuracy can stay the same with the Buckhorn I will likely switch.

By the way, the Powerbelt suggestion I think holds true for any powder/pellets. To me those things are worthless, I found them to be very incosistent from package to package. Some fitting snug, some fitting very loose. Groupings using the powerbelts were terrible, I have shot Hornady's, TC Shockwaves, and Barnes and never had a problem with the groupings on any of them.

However, I know lots of other guys that have had great luck with the Powerbelts, so maybe my gun just doesn't like them.

Kratz
 
Not all 50 cal. barrels are manufactured to the same specifications. T/C’s (.500) tend to be “tighter” than Knight’s (.502). A thousand of an inch can make a big difference in how easy or hard a particular sabot loads.

Here is a good link with lots of ML information:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/index2h.muzzleloader.htm

I just bought some of the Blackhorn 209 as well but I haven't tried it yet. I'm waiting for some new bullets to arrive.

Tim
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shovelbuck</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Black powder substitutes are designed to be measured volume to volume of black powder. Most substitutes weigh less than black powder and you can have problems if you weigh it. IE...over charge. </div></div>

Very true, Jay.

One thing you could do is weigh a certain volumetric load a couple of times to try to find an average weight, then continue to use that average to weigh out consistent loads. Then again, if you have the volumetric means, why bother weighing? Maybe load consistency, but when it comes to being that accurate, my rifle skills are the weak link.
 
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