Check this out in todays Des Moines Register
http://desmoinesregister.com/extras/salary02/index.html
http://desmoinesregister.com/extras/salary02/index.html
I guess what I was getting at was looking at the highest to the lowest salarys page. The coaches salarys being over half a million and the highest being almost twice that . and then the next two hundred and fifty or so highest paid workers were professors and assistant professors making near a quarter of a million a year each. Im glad my tax dollars are going to good use......
trper
Life Member
I agree with you totally especially when the State is planning to furlough every State Trooper for 7 days starting in March. We need 1.7 million more in our budget to function or we will have to lay off for 7 days every Trp and other key functioning employees of the State. What is more important? Public safety or football! Just my two cents!
Rackaddict
Life Member
Just wait until there's a college football game between two rival teams with no public safety officers present. I'd say the question of importance will be quickly answered.
trper: They're going to do what!!
I think I've heard it all now.
I saw that list a week or so ago and noticed the great disparity between education and enforcement, etc. The best part is a lot of these "professors" can't remember what the inside of a classroom looks like; they're involved in research, permanently. Many times, this is (mis-)labelled "education" funding. I hope we all remember this when we vote.
I think I've heard it all now.
I saw that list a week or so ago and noticed the great disparity between education and enforcement, etc. The best part is a lot of these "professors" can't remember what the inside of a classroom looks like; they're involved in research, permanently. Many times, this is (mis-)labelled "education" funding. I hope we all remember this when we vote.
M
Monster Doe
Guest
Sorry,
I'm gonna have to go with football. That way I won't get pulled over for speeding on my way to the next Hawkeye BCS bowl game.
I'm gonna have to go with football. That way I won't get pulled over for speeding on my way to the next Hawkeye BCS bowl game.
Cornfed
Bowhunting Addict
Most of the 'professors' likely have Masters or Doctorate degrees..... I doubt that many of them are overpaid. Research is a critical part of graduate programs in any major university. Without top research, the University of Iowa could not attract top-notch students and would lose a lot of funding and research grants, etc.
Public service, safety, and law enforcement professions are generally underpaid. But I do not think that a professor with a Doctorate degree should be making the same salary as a state trooper.
Public service, safety, and law enforcement professions are generally underpaid. But I do not think that a professor with a Doctorate degree should be making the same salary as a state trooper.
trper
Life Member
Cornfed, How much should a State Trooper make. I have a masters degree. Some would say maybe I should be doing something else. Its not always about money. How much should someone with a doctorate make. Is he necessarily more qualified to make more money than me because he spent a few more years in school. I am not complaining about what I make. Senior Trp's make in the mid 50's. A good salary by most standards. Should they pay me more because I am educated ? The Chief of the Patrol makes around 100K"s. Yes I chose to do this job and the risks that go with it. But to say just because I don't have a doctorate I don't deserve some fairness in pay is my whole point. As John v said that's just the way it is. We risk our lives daily for what I consider a decent wage. Some would say it is to much and some would say it is not enough. Something is out of wack. There is a mentality out there that I sometimes just don't understand. If a doctor saves your life you would say he is worth every cent he gets paid but if I save your life and loose mine doing it I deserve to get paid less because I don't have my doctorate!!! It may soon come to what John v said in his post. There are limited numbers of qualified applicants applying for teaching jobs and public service jobs because of the low pay in some areas. There are jobs availabe that pay more without having to spend 40 thousand dollars to go to college. I hope we do not have to lower our standards just to find bodys to fill public service jobs. Your childs education is only as good as the teacher who it educating them and the intergrity and honesty of law enforcement is only held by the high standards that applicants have to meet. Sorry for rambling.
Cornfed,
Thank you for clarifying that the "professors" have their masters or doctorates, was not sure on that one...It's wonderful we can bring in the best and brightest and do loads of research. Maybe next we can work on retaining some of that in Iowa. I'll assure you the vast majority of it is leaving our borders and taking our dollars with it for a variety of reasons and we are doing little on the back end to change that. In the meantime our tax dollars continue to fund this and it sounds like we are looking at sacrificing public safety. Great plan...
Thank you for clarifying that the "professors" have their masters or doctorates, was not sure on that one...It's wonderful we can bring in the best and brightest and do loads of research. Maybe next we can work on retaining some of that in Iowa. I'll assure you the vast majority of it is leaving our borders and taking our dollars with it for a variety of reasons and we are doing little on the back end to change that. In the meantime our tax dollars continue to fund this and it sounds like we are looking at sacrificing public safety. Great plan...
O
Ollie
Guest
Salaries are dictated to a certain extent by market value. Nearly all professors in mid and large colleges have Ph.D. degrees. Iowa competes with every other state for a limited pool of qualified applicants. You pay the market price, or settle for less qualified personnel. Same with the football coach at Iowa and Iowa state. While I consider their salaries obscene, they only rank in the middle of what major college coaches are being paid. It is unfortunate that so many professions, like law enforcement and primary and secondary teachers, are not paid appropriate salaries in comparison to what others make. Not fair, but just the way it is.
Cornfed
Bowhunting Addict
Trpr,
I not sure that you understood the point of my post...... I am not saying that you shouldn't make more money, but if you have a master's degree then you are probably one of a dozen or less troopers in this state with that level of formal education (please correct me if I am wrong).... If I have a doctorate and choose to work at McDonalds I am likely not going to make any more money initially than the high school kid next to me flipping burgers. However, if I take my doctorate and apply it in my field of expertise, assuming there is demand in my job market, then I can expect to make more money than the guy next to me with a bachelors degree. On average, higher education has led to higher paying jobs for those who choose to strive for it. In our technologically advanced society I do not see that changing anytime soon.
I not sure that you understood the point of my post...... I am not saying that you shouldn't make more money, but if you have a master's degree then you are probably one of a dozen or less troopers in this state with that level of formal education (please correct me if I am wrong).... If I have a doctorate and choose to work at McDonalds I am likely not going to make any more money initially than the high school kid next to me flipping burgers. However, if I take my doctorate and apply it in my field of expertise, assuming there is demand in my job market, then I can expect to make more money than the guy next to me with a bachelors degree. On average, higher education has led to higher paying jobs for those who choose to strive for it. In our technologically advanced society I do not see that changing anytime soon.
trper
Life Member
Cornfed, I understand your point and the logic behind it. Most of the officers we have hired since I came on, a large percentage of them have their bachelor's degree. Education in todays society dosen't always mean your are going to get paid for it. Society seems to get things messed up when it comes to value and what a job is worth. That's probably where the phrase "You couldn't pay me enought to do that job" came from. I guess I would just like to see the guy at the low end of the totem pole get his due reward more often. I guess that is what I am trying to say. Yeah I know and understand the concept of the have's and the have not's. I guess I would just like to see things change for the betterment of everyone. Thanks for the reply.
J
jbutenhoff
Guest
OK, time for a rant! To bring up the coaches into the pay debate is just pointless. First most of that high salary DOES NOT COME FROM THE STATE, repeat after me I DO NOT PAY FOR MOST OF THE COACHES SALARY. The majority of their money comes from sponsors and other outside sources.
Just a pet peeve of mine when people complain about their tax money paying for coaches!
One thing about many of the professors, once they get set with the school and tenured many of them stop being really productive. Sure there are a few that still teach or do meaningful research, but what about the deadbeats that just look upon a high paying professorship as a early retirement? The whole higher education system is being skewed towards these over paid liberal educators who only teach their close minded viewpoints and create an average college "educated" graduates who are less able to function in the world than high school graduates were three decades ago!
Jamie
Just a pet peeve of mine when people complain about their tax money paying for coaches!
One thing about many of the professors, once they get set with the school and tenured many of them stop being really productive. Sure there are a few that still teach or do meaningful research, but what about the deadbeats that just look upon a high paying professorship as a early retirement? The whole higher education system is being skewed towards these over paid liberal educators who only teach their close minded viewpoints and create an average college "educated" graduates who are less able to function in the world than high school graduates were three decades ago!
Jamie
BugleMIn
New Member
Jbutenhoff hit the nail on the head.
One of my pet peeves with the state universities is the professors and how little they teach. They spend alot of time studying their subject and doing research and barely any time actually teaching. They supervise TA's, Teacher Associate's, who are usually in their master or phd program. These are the people who teach the college courses.
Unfortunately, most TA's are foriegn and english is their second language. I spent three days in a physics class trying to figure out what my lebonese TA was saying, he was pronouncing etch, and he meant to say "H".
Also these professors are studying crap that has no real bearing on Iowa or USA interests. I know of a professor who spent his whole life studying el pacas in South America. (Llama like creatures). Would we be better spending our tax dollars on him studying Bighorn sheep or whitetail deer, or the weather effects on quail? I think so.
Look at all the social studies type professors, some study crap like the ancient customs of some kenyan tribe, instead of social issues that would benefit Iowa or USA.
Ranting mode off....
One of my pet peeves with the state universities is the professors and how little they teach. They spend alot of time studying their subject and doing research and barely any time actually teaching. They supervise TA's, Teacher Associate's, who are usually in their master or phd program. These are the people who teach the college courses.
Unfortunately, most TA's are foriegn and english is their second language. I spent three days in a physics class trying to figure out what my lebonese TA was saying, he was pronouncing etch, and he meant to say "H".
Also these professors are studying crap that has no real bearing on Iowa or USA interests. I know of a professor who spent his whole life studying el pacas in South America. (Llama like creatures). Would we be better spending our tax dollars on him studying Bighorn sheep or whitetail deer, or the weather effects on quail? I think so.
Look at all the social studies type professors, some study crap like the ancient customs of some kenyan tribe, instead of social issues that would benefit Iowa or USA.
Ranting mode off....
Fishbonker
Life Member
Go look up Toycen, Thomas A. See that total? think thats my base salary? Guess again. Ever hear of a thing called a "nursing shortage"? It burns me that now everybody thinks thats my base wage. Base is 49K (top of scale). I AVEAGED 40 hours a month of OT. I didn't work any OT in Sept or Oct. Because of deer hunting you ask? No. I worked so much that I just about destoryed my right foot. Ever hear of a Neuroma? I have. As long as I'm ranting, somebody made the reference to having a PhD and flipping burgers and accepting that the non PhD burger flipper was making the same money. Good for you. Equall money for equall work. I look across the helicopter at my partner, I'm doing the same thing they are, at the same skill/expertise level, but they get about 2K more a year because they have BSN behind their name and I have AD behind mine. I took the same test have the same continueing education requirements and they get paid more? Not fair to me. I'm not mad at them, it just rubs me the wrong way.
But back to my original rant, It is irresposible for the DSM "Rag"ister to print this stuff without us little people being able to tell our story. I'm sure there are those of you out there who don't think I'm a "little person" salery wise, but don't be mislead by everything you read.
Scheels, Gander Mountain, Cabellas, Fin and Feather, Sports Outfitters, Iowa City Motor Sports and Cooks Jewlery (gotta keep the wife happy too) are all very gratefull to the tax payers for paying my salary. Or should they thank Blue Cross and Blue Shield? Don't forget, The University Hospital does get reimbursed by Health Insurance Companies. So keep paying those taxes and insurance preimiums and I'll keep buying "stuff".
Think I'll go sit on my fat State Employee @$$ and watch some football. I don't usually get this cranky but this topic hit a very raw nerve.
The 'Bonker
But back to my original rant, It is irresposible for the DSM "Rag"ister to print this stuff without us little people being able to tell our story. I'm sure there are those of you out there who don't think I'm a "little person" salery wise, but don't be mislead by everything you read.
Scheels, Gander Mountain, Cabellas, Fin and Feather, Sports Outfitters, Iowa City Motor Sports and Cooks Jewlery (gotta keep the wife happy too) are all very gratefull to the tax payers for paying my salary. Or should they thank Blue Cross and Blue Shield? Don't forget, The University Hospital does get reimbursed by Health Insurance Companies. So keep paying those taxes and insurance preimiums and I'll keep buying "stuff".
Think I'll go sit on my fat State Employee @$$ and watch some football. I don't usually get this cranky but this topic hit a very raw nerve.
The 'Bonker
R
Rembrandt
Guest
The notion that a piece of paper or degree entitles someone to more money is typical of bureacratic mentality.
Over the years I've worked with ISU Phd's, state/federal government employees, and with universities all over the country....probably could count on one hand those that would be able to succeed in the private sector. The old saying goes..."There are those that do, the rest teach"......many of these "people of higher learning" lack the motivation and decision making skills required in the private sector.
Fortunately we live in a country with the freedom to choose a profession we so desire....making money is simply a matter of taking calculated risks. Most bureacratic employees are not financial risk takers, their careers offer safety during economic down turns, they meet the required education, put in for tenure, and rarely have to produce results. Pay increases are obtained through more education or seniority....in contrast individuals who are risk takers and achievers do very well in the private sector...with or without the education. The real financial rewards are in the private sector where risk takers either own a business or work within corporate management.
It really boils down to what makes you happy and secure? Making money is easy, if you have the desire and will to go after it. I use to make a six figure income for years with only 2 years of college, but after a while the money becomes less important...priorities and values change.
I don't have a lot of sympathy for those that whine about their job and become preoccupied with what the other guy has...as American's we are priviledged to be in control of our own destiny and financial future...if we don't like our job or pay, we have the freedom to try another line of work.
Sometimes amazes me that immigrants & refugees from Asia and others parts of the world come here with no language skills, get a basic education and start thriving businesses. Makes you wonder why the average American squanders their talent, education, and opportunities....then tries to portray themselves as victims of something out of their control....sounds like whiners to me looking for a pity party.
I would classify the football coaches as risk takers and achievers....a few loosing seasons and these guys are out of a job, if they win....the rewards should be accordingly. Far different than a tenured professor who fails at his profession.
Over the years I've worked with ISU Phd's, state/federal government employees, and with universities all over the country....probably could count on one hand those that would be able to succeed in the private sector. The old saying goes..."There are those that do, the rest teach"......many of these "people of higher learning" lack the motivation and decision making skills required in the private sector.
Fortunately we live in a country with the freedom to choose a profession we so desire....making money is simply a matter of taking calculated risks. Most bureacratic employees are not financial risk takers, their careers offer safety during economic down turns, they meet the required education, put in for tenure, and rarely have to produce results. Pay increases are obtained through more education or seniority....in contrast individuals who are risk takers and achievers do very well in the private sector...with or without the education. The real financial rewards are in the private sector where risk takers either own a business or work within corporate management.
It really boils down to what makes you happy and secure? Making money is easy, if you have the desire and will to go after it. I use to make a six figure income for years with only 2 years of college, but after a while the money becomes less important...priorities and values change.
I don't have a lot of sympathy for those that whine about their job and become preoccupied with what the other guy has...as American's we are priviledged to be in control of our own destiny and financial future...if we don't like our job or pay, we have the freedom to try another line of work.
Sometimes amazes me that immigrants & refugees from Asia and others parts of the world come here with no language skills, get a basic education and start thriving businesses. Makes you wonder why the average American squanders their talent, education, and opportunities....then tries to portray themselves as victims of something out of their control....sounds like whiners to me looking for a pity party.
I would classify the football coaches as risk takers and achievers....a few loosing seasons and these guys are out of a job, if they win....the rewards should be accordingly. Far different than a tenured professor who fails at his profession.