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screening and shrub planting

spltbrow

spltbrow

Member
I am going to be planting a screen / travel corridor around my 12 acre marsh and nwsg field.
The field is closed in when the corn is up but once it is down it is open to the road and not real sucluded.
I am looking for suggestions on what bushes and or trees to plant. this years planting will be 800' and will finish next year with additional 800'.
What i am thinking now is red osierdogwood, grey dogwood and maybe norway spruce. Any suggestions?
how many rose? and spaceing?
Also what is average planting speed? I am thinking auger and loader for holes (1 man) and 2 more guys planting.
Need to get my order in for fall if i still decide to plant in fall. Dont really want to spend a sat planting instead of hunting but would like to get done.
 
I'm not a huge fan of Redosier, I like Gray Dogwood better. If it were me, I'd add: high bush cranberry, wild plum, red cedar, etc. Possibly some swamp white oaks, hybrid poplar, willow - depends on the scenario on those though. Good luck!
your shrubs can be spaced super close, obviously trees you'll want farther. If you're going to do LOTS of trees, you are gonna want a tree planter and not an auger OR you'll be out there FOREVER. Unless you're planting only a couple hundred trees or something small.
 
With the auger it depend on the soil. Heavy clay will be very time consuming as it will clot badly. You have to bust the clots to back fill and pack it to get it sealed. In heavy clay with 3 working with an an auger 300 to 400 is a decent estimate. Nice black dirt will go quickly. like skip said The tree planter is quickest.
 
Ninebark makes the wooliest shrub screen and deer don't hit it as bad as dogwood. Find a tree planter to rent. You'll have better survival of the trees and save a bunch of time and work.
 
when you guys say tree planter, you mean the 3 point style that goes on back of tractor. How do those work? I thought they just cut a slit in the ground and someone slides the plant in? Does it make the roots into a j figure as you put them in or does it cut deep enough so they go in straight. I seen one at an auction that went for $500.
 
Yes, that's the kind of planter I'm talking about. Takes a tractor and two guys but you'll get 10 times as many trees in the same amount of time. As far as how good a job they do, I've driven the tractor for guys who plant for a living and those planters are all they use. do a great job. If you're planting on level ground they are easy to operate. Sidehills take a little more adjusting, but not difficult. Our PF chapter has one we rent out but we're not near you. Check at the NRCS office for your county, they may know where you can get one.
 
You might also check with NRCS about cost share opportunities also, you may get funding to hire the planting done...;)
 
dbltree said:
You might also check with NRCS about cost share opportunities also, you may get funding to hire the planting done...;)
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From reading your past post that was the first thing i did. They said i could not get funding beens it was already enrolled in the crp program. If i wanted to put more land in it then i could get funding.
I even checked to see if i could get some help on frost seeding the crp field beens 90% weeds and no switch, but they said they do not care what is growing there as long as something is there. So if i want to frost seed i would be on my own.
Even tried to get them to mark the good trees for tsi and they told me they really couldnt because the budget was not allowing it. And that they didnt even have the money to buy the spray paint.:confused:
 
spltbrow said:
From reading your past post that was the first thing i did. They said i could not get funding beens it was already enrolled in the crp program. If i wanted to put more land in it then i could get funding.
I even checked to see if i could get some help on frost seeding the crp field beens 90% weeds and no switch, but they said they do not care what is growing there as long as something is there. So if i want to frost seed i would be on my own.
Even tried to get them to mark the good trees for tsi and they told me they really couldnt because the budget was not allowing it. And that they didnt even have the money to buy the spray paint.:confused:
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That's crazy. I would do some more digging. There's lots of programs. Ask about Mid-Contract Management for CRP- pays some of those things you talked about above.
TSI- ask about different program $ like REAP, WHIP & EQUIP - that's nuts- there should be SOMETHING. If you can't come up with anything for TSI- check on NWTF $600 grant and US Fish & Wildlife Service. Lots of options for all sorts of things. I can't believe they told you that stuff, that's too bad, I sure would get some more input and opinions!!!
 
spltbrow said:
From reading your past post that was the first thing i did. They said i could not get funding beens it was already enrolled in the crp program. If i wanted to put more land in it then i could get funding.
I even checked to see if i could get some help on frost seeding the crp field beens 90% weeds and no switch, but they said they do not care what is growing there as long as something is there. So if i want to frost seed i would be on my own.
Even tried to get them to mark the good trees for tsi and they told me they really couldnt because the budget was not allowing it. And that they didnt even have the money to buy the spray paint.:confused:
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The DNR has 50% cost share on seed, even if it is already on CRP. I would give them a call.
 
spltbrow said:
From reading your past post that was the first thing i did. They said i could not get funding beens it was already enrolled in the crp program. If i wanted to put more land in it then i could get funding.
I even checked to see if i could get some help on frost seeding the crp field beens 90% weeds and no switch, but they said they do not care what is growing there as long as something is there. So if i want to frost seed i would be on my own.
Even tried to get them to mark the good trees for tsi and they told me they really couldnt because the budget was not allowing it. And that they didnt even have the money to buy the spray paint.:confused:
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Sounds like Clinton co. They could care less about any wildlife programs. Hard to get anything done here.
 
Couple thoughts...if the ground is in CRP you are probably not allowed to plant trees on it...period. You can only do so by changing the contract which is often when the contract expires or they offer a special contract change to convert areas to trees. No cost share would be allowed to plant trees on CRP ground from other sources either.

In NEW CRP signups that's different story and you can sign up for a hardwood tree planting, shelterbelt, windbreaks, snow fence etc. Those options are also available under the Continuous CRP program as well.

Talk to your IDNR Forester to get different thought however and discuss other options and possibilities. When working with land not under CRP contract there are many many options including IDNR, EQUIP, WHIP and NWTF, PF and even QDMA depending on where you live and if active chapters are in the area.

Remember the thread on tree planting as an incredible amount of in depth information on every aspect of tree and shrub planting and covers nearly every conceivable question on this subject. Check the first page for the "nut's and bolt's" of this subject.

All about Tree Planting

For more ideas and contacts on cost share possibles, check the cost share thread...

Conservation Cost Share Programs

Those of us who have been at this for a lifetime have learned that there is more then one way to skin a cat....:way:
 
I will have to do some more checking i guess? not quite sure who to talk to. I have actually talked with 2 people at the nrcs office multiple times. They have even given me a list of shrubs and conifers i can plant (or they recommend) in the existing crp. But they said " there is no cost share on the trees or seed because at this point they do not care whats there as long as something is there".

They are both younger and seem to be pretty new at this. I have been talking to them since february hoping to get some cost share so i could get my screening planted this year. So far that is a no go unless i just pay for it.

My contract was just renewed last year for another 10 years. 95% of original switch planting is no longer there. If i remember right this is a cp23 contract designed to catch water shed before it gets to the boardering river.

I am not sure if they even know what they are talking about or not? Seems they really dont care what i do as long as i pay for it.

I would really like to get my screening planted this year!!
 
ninebark, buck thorn, dog woods, etc etc...any shrub will do.

I worked for an outfit in MN, did most our contracts on pheasant lands in SD, installing exactly what you want. All i know $$$-wise is the guy I worked for made around $250k from early march to end of june...we planted "living snow fence"...starting on the NW (predominant winds) side we planted some form of five rows (shrubs/pines) usually shrub/shrub/pine/shrub/pine, or shrub/pine/pine/shrub/pine...depends on what you're looking for.

In your situation I think a five row setup is overkill. Try a shrub/shrub/pine or a shrub/pine/shrub. Any variety combination will work...and you certainly want to use a tree-planter.

Put 3-5yds between the rows...3-5ft spacing on the shrubs and 5-10ft spacing on the pines.

remember it will take a few years to establish...

if you can't get cost-share, you should at least be able to rent the equipment from the local conservation board or NRCS (depending on where you are)
 
Talked and met with nrcs today out at property to verify some things.
They did again say that i could plant a screening in the already existing crp if i wanted to. I would not get any cost share beens it is already in crp.

Also said i could frost seed whatever type of nwsg i wanted but could not get cost share on that iether. They are going to get me the contact number to the dnr to see obout the program they have, but then i would be limited to their mix.

What mix of nwsg should i do? its about 6 acres around a marsh. I was thinking about thicker in some areas and more forbes and mixes in others, or should i just replant switch that was previously there?
 
They did again say that i could plant a screening in the already existing crp if i wanted to.
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I should restate that you can do so but...in doing that you will never ever be able to re-sign that area back into CRP. At least if they are doing their jobs correctly.

Land up for re-enrollment must be able to be "farmed" so if they are in trees they have to be removed to re-enroll so just keep that in mind when deciding how much to plant.

Personally I would never plant pines....in areas with any number of deer the pines will be destroyed. Red cedars however are prefect and IMO really a better option then shrubs for screening...:way:
 
dbltree said:
I should restate that you can do so but...in doing that you will never ever be able to re-sign that area back into CRP. At least if they are doing their jobs correctly.

Land up for re-enrollment must be able to be "farmed" so if they are in trees they have to be removed to re-enroll so just keep that in mind when deciding how much to plant.

Personally I would never plant pines....in areas with any number of deer the pines will be destroyed. Red cedars however are prefect and IMO really a better option then shrubs for screening...:way:
Click to expand...

I am going to chk into that for sure. that was one concern i had if i ever wanted to turn it back to farm land i didnt want a bunch of shrubs or trees, and i also dont want to loose my ability to renew the contract in 10yrs.

Dilemma:confused: Thanks for the info will definately chk on that and maybe have to make a tough decision?
 
dbltree said:
I should restate that you can do so but...in doing that you will never ever be able to re-sign that area back into CRP. At least if they are doing their jobs correctly.

Land up for re-enrollment must be able to be "farmed" so if they are in trees they have to be removed to re-enroll so just keep that in mind when deciding how much to plant.

Personally I would never plant pines....in areas with any number of deer the pines will be destroyed. Red cedars however are prefect and IMO really a better option then shrubs for screening...:way:
Click to expand...

damn good information about contracts right there...and I agree about the pines vs. red cedars...
 
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