Starting The Release Process

[fergyr]

Headed down the Rabbit hole, going all in on the Grant Woods Release Process. Crimped some Rye, it worked well. But didn't plant into the standing Rye before crimping as prescribed by Grant Woods due to the drought, soil is dry, and the Rye took up even more moisture, not ideal....will take my chances once some rain comes, if ever.

This plot was planted last Fall with Green Cover Fall Release blend, i think it had something like 12 varieties in it. Looks like 4 of the 12 have over wintered Elbon Cereal Rye, Kentucky Pride Crimson Clover, Fixation Clover and some Winter Wheat.

Most impressive part, very few weeds,

 

[Sligh1]

That’s sweet!!! Post up some updates for sure!! How are u gonna plant beans? Drill or planter or what’s the plan? Any herbicides or none?
I’d plant em…. They will sit there til rain comes. Then- that mulch will keep it very moist.

 

[fergyr]

That’s sweet!!! Post up some updates for sure!! How are u gonna plant beans? Drill or planter or what’s the plan? Any herbicides or none?
I’d plant em…. They will sit there til rain comes. Then- that mulch will keep it very moist.

Will drill the beans, bought some Real World Soybeans, damn things were expensive, but what isnt these days, figure I have several weeks yet to get them in, bought the Northern Blend shorter maturity group, right now I'm not sure that the drill would get them deep enough to suit me. Its all a gamble, thanks for the words..

Dont plan to use any herbicide, and right now as things sit it wouldnt appear to be needed, we'll see though, this is all new stuff, learn as ya go.

 

[Bassattackr]

Make sure you drill in the same direction as you laid down that rye. Otherwise you’ll have a nice mess on your hands

 

[fergyr]

I'm

Make sure you drill in the same direction as you laid down that rye. Otherwise you’ll have a nice mess on your hands

Thanks, Made my passes with that in mind.

 

[MN Slick]

I hope you have better luck than I have. I love the concept of getting soil biology firing, covered soil, improved water infiltration, less or zero fertilizer, less chemicals, saving time ETC, but I've struggled. I'm 3 or 4 years in by the calender but my fall plantings have really struggled (failed), so in reality it's more like a year or 2. A lack of rain is the biggest factor but I also believe it's operator error on planting depth and sometimes I wonder if the rolled down warm season mix is too heavy for the fall seed to push through. Just once I'd like to get adequate rain fall on a fall planted mix. It seems some guys, like Grant Woods, are now letting their warm season mix stand rather than rolling it down so I'm going to try that this fall........if my summer mix grows. So far it's looking grim. Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Snail3496]

That will be happy soil. Have never crimped, but I no till beans then spray into rye every year. I have had some close calls planting into the rye with fawns/turkeys over the years. That thing looks like a killdozer for them. Did you walk it first?

 

[Bassattackr]

The crimper is good in theory. But unless you’re crimping at the perfect time, I see that turning into a mess real quick. Out comes the sprayer..

What happens if the field is too wet when you need to crimp in the spring?

 

[fergyr]

The crimper is good in theory. But unless you’re crimping at the perfect time, I see that turning into a mess real quick. Out comes the sprayer..

What happens if the field is too wet when you need to crimp in the spring?

I make no claims whatsoever on being an "expert" but from what I have read and videos that I have watched operators have stated that in wet conditions you are actually able to get into the field a few days sooner than a neighbor using traditional methods due to the moisture uptake of the Rye.

Also, I was concerned about the duration of the crimping window, but from what I've experienced (this year) I had at least 2 weeks and probably closer to 3 to get it crimped.

 

[fergyr]

I hope you have better luck than I have. I love the concept of getting soil biology firing, covered soil, improved water infiltration, less or zero fertilizer, less chemicals, saving time ETC, but I've struggled. I'm 3 or 4 years in by the calender but my fall plantings have really struggled (failed), so in reality it's more like a year or 2. A lack of rain is the biggest factor but I also believe it's operator error on planting depth and sometimes I wonder if the rolled down warm season mix is too heavy for the fall seed to push through. Just once I'd like to get adequate rain fall on a fall planted mix. It seems some guys, like Grant Woods, are now letting their warm season mix stand rather than rolling it down so I'm going to try that this fall........if my summer mix grows. So far it's looking grim. Good luck and keep us posted.

That's one thing that frustrates me about this year, its so darn dry that I don't think that I will be able learn from this experience in 2023, but I keep reminding myself that some good will come of it due to what has happened so far with organic matter from Crimping last falls cover crop.

Also think it's important to drill the fall seed into standing Summer Mix, as Grant says as not to clean the table.

 

[RepCity_BK]

I hope you have better luck than I have. I love the concept of getting soil biology firing, covered soil, improved water infiltration, less or zero fertilizer, less chemicals, saving time ETC, but I've struggled. I'm 3 or 4 years in by the calender but my fall plantings have really struggled (failed), so in reality it's more like a year or 2. A lack of rain is the biggest factor but I also believe it's operator error on planting depth and sometimes I wonder if the rolled down warm season mix is too heavy for the fall seed to push through. Just once I'd like to get adequate rain fall on a fall planted mix. It seems some guys, like Grant Woods, are now letting their warm season mix stand rather than rolling it down so I'm going to try that this fall........if my summer mix grows. So far it's looking grim. Good luck and keep us posted.

We have had similar results with the Fall Release during really dry years like last year in south central Nebraska. Summer Release has came up great for us the past two years and we have drilled directly into that when planting Fall Release like you mention. I don’t have a crimper yet so we have been mowing and spraying to terminate the fall crop before planting Summer Release. This year I plan to really watch seed depth when drilling this fall. A lot of those seeds in the Fall Release are pretty tiny except for the cereal rye. I think planting too deep has been our main issue as we have good amounts of rye germinate in the fall but barely any of the clovers. Fwiw we have been using a Great Plains 1006NT to plant.

 

[fergyr]

That will be happy soil. Have never crimped, but I no till beans then spray into rye every year. I have had some close calls planting into the rye with fawns/turkeys over the years. That thing looks like a killdozer for them. Did you walk it first?

Only critters that I saw were rabbits, and they were able to stay clear.

 

[fergyr]

We have had similar results with the Fall Release during really dry years like last year in south central Nebraska. Summer Release has came up great for us the past two years and we have drilled directly into that when planting Fall Release like you mention. I don’t have a crimper yet so we have been mowing and spraying to terminate the fall crop before planting Summer Release. This year I plan to really watch seed depth when drilling this fall. A lot of those seeds in the Fall Release are pretty tiny except for the cereal rye. I think planting too deep has been our main issue as we have good amounts of rye germinate in the fall but barely any of the clovers. Fwiw we have been using a Great Plains 1006NT to plant.

Being too deep is a concern for sure, one theory is that when the larger seeds germinate they help to create a channel for the smaller seed to make it up to the surface.

I put last year's Fall Release mix in with the drill set for the same depth as a natives planting, but also received a timely rain and it did great.

 

[Bassattackr]

I make no claims whatsoever on being an "expert" but from what I have read and videos that I have watched operators have stated that in wet conditions you are actually able to get into the field a few days sooner than a neighbor using traditional methods due to the moisture uptake of the Rye.

It’s actually the opposite. Shaded soil stays moist much longer. One of the reasons why many terminate rye with Gly much earlier than they plant.

Surprised Grant Woods never had slug issues with that method. Although if he did he wouldn’t admit it! Ha

 

[fergyr]

It’s actually the opposite. Shaded soil stays moist much longer. One of the reasons why many terminate rye with Gly much earlier than they plant.

Surprised Grant Woods never had slug issues with that method. Although if he did he wouldn’t admit it! Ha

Actually is depends on the growth stage of the Cereal Rye, when its shorter your point is true, and this is the more common practice in Ag today, to terminate the Cereal Rye with herbicide while it is still fairly short. When the Cereal Rye is 5-6' tall, it will draw moisture from the soil. Here is an article for your reference. And as you may know Grant Woods allows the Cereal Rye to reach the growth stage where it is very tall, i.e. producing seed and is easier to roller crimp which provides good biomass thus increasing organic material, a 1% increase in organic matter allows the soil to infiltrate an additional 1" of rain, its not how much rain you get, its how much rain you can keep.

Cereal Rye - Advance Cover Crops

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[Bassattackr]

Actually is depends on the growth stage of the Cereal Rye, when its shorter your point is true, and this is the more common practice in Ag today, to terminate the Cereal Rye with herbicide while it is still fairly short. When the Cereal Rye is 5-6' tall, it will draw moisture from the soil. Here is an article for your reference. And as you may know Grant Woods allows the Cereal Rye to reach the growth stage where it is very tall, i.e. producing seed and is easier to roller crimp which provides good biomass thus increasing organic material, a 1% increase in organic matter allows the soil to infiltrate an additional 1" of rain, its not how much rain you get, its how much rain you can keep.

Cereal Rye - Advance Cover Crops

Shop Cereal Rye Cover Crops. At Advance Cover Crops, Our Focus Is To Provide The Right Resources, Tools, And Advice For Cover Crops And Equipment. Enhance No-Till Farming Operations With Our Line Of Cover Crop Rollers.

advancecovercrops.com

Very familiar with Ag practices today

Most terminate early due to crop insurance requirements, biomass management and keeping rye from shading soil. Tall rye always shades the soil more than shorter rye, which prevents both evaporation and soil temperature escalation in the spring. There in lies the issue..

So, moist soil (no sunlight) and going from one growing crop to another (just recently terminated) is an opportunity for both slow emergence (cold soil) as well as nematode issues.

Best of luck, hope it works out for you.

 

[Sligh1]

It’s actually the opposite. Shaded soil stays moist much longer. One of the reasons why many terminate rye with Gly much earlier than they plant.

Surprised Grant Woods never had slug issues with that method. Although if he did he wouldn’t admit it! Ha

I THINK what they mean is… rye absorbs more water out of the soil- thus drying it out quicker. Which it does do. Once it’s crimped- different story as that will hold moisture in.

Don’t know if this applies to the residue at hand but a lot of guys will have tall grass they want to plant beans in. Ask “should I mow it then spray it”. IMO- I tell them NO! Let it die standing. Much easier for beans to grow through erect grass vs a mat. I’ve never planted into crimped rye but my wheels are turning. I wonder if row cleaners would help some??? Strip til would but I doubt anyone on here is gonna mess with that .

One step below the objective …. Could try not crimping sometime?? Dead rye is still fantastic. Still builds soil. Still aids in beneficial fungus & bacteria and still has allopathic effects on weeds. Only thing it doesn’t have is the layer of matting. But if the matting itself is causing an issue- dial it back one notch & spray & drill vs crimp. It’s still light years better than conventional & ur still getting “8 out of 10” of the benefits or whatever.

Keep posted on how this shakes out- looking forward to hearing back!!! Good luck!!!

 

[MN Slick]

That's one thing that frustrates me about this year, its so darn dry that I don't think that I will be able learn from this experience in 2023, but I keep reminding myself that some good will come of it due to what has happened so far with organic matter from Crimping last falls cover crop.

Also think it's important to drill the fall seed into standing Summer Mix, as Grant says as not to clean the table.

Yep, I terminated nice warm season plots last fall when I planted my fall plots then got no rain. This year I'm planting green in the fall and not terminating the warm season plots so at least I'll have some early season food if it doesn't rain. Hopefully, the cool season crop is growing to some degree and will take off once frost kills he warm season crop. Guys claim it's working for them??? It all sounds so good in theory, LOL. Meanwhile, I just got a quote on a Firminator.

My ground is like conctrete so I wonder too if it needs a rip or deep till to loosen it up. I was hoping a couple years of Regen would help but it hasn't so far. I planted beans on one farm so I could nuke the grasses and it looks like a fail. Drilled too deep? Ground crusted over? Deers mowed them off? I have no clue but it looks grim.

 

[Hardwood11]

I have a guy that does some food plots on my farm in Minnesota. This is what he’s doing . Good for spring, summer and early fall.

Nothing seems to be attractive in late fall or early winter. The deer move elsewhere. I think it’s good for the soil, but not the best for a deer hunter !

 

[Sligh1]

I have a guy that does some food plots on my farm in Minnesota. This is what he’s doing . Good for spring, summer and early fall.

Nothing seems to be attractive in late fall or early winter. The deer move elsewhere. I think it’s good for the soil, but not the best for a deer hunter !

Always need to have several food sources In one plot. Say this was “6 acres”…. Whatever …. 1/2 acre would be clover. 1 acre brassicas. 1 acre Dbltree cereal rye mix. Rest - standing beans.