theDoorman
PMA Member
Well put.
Things that make me go Hmmmmm....Land Prices
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deerdown
Well-Known Member
This topic is just too good to leave alone. A lot of us think about where prices are headed probably at least once a week.
I had a neighbor call me and offer to sell me his 80 for 11k an acre yesterday. His farm touches my Harrison County Mo farm on the south...The same Harrison County farm I mentioned on here that I've been thinking about selling for $5400ish/acre. Jeez.... Am I that far off, or is he?
Anyway, read this post on another forum today, and thought it was spot on about land prices and peoples reaction to them:
"In the early 80's the great retraction in land prices happened and, guess what, getting bids at an auction was like pulling hens teeth. Those who are afraid to buy at high prices are afraid to buy at low prices. Fear is a paralyzing thing."
I had a neighbor call me and offer to sell me his 80 for 11k an acre yesterday. His farm touches my Harrison County Mo farm on the south...The same Harrison County farm I mentioned on here that I've been thinking about selling for $5400ish/acre. Jeez.... Am I that far off, or is he?
Anyway, read this post on another forum today, and thought it was spot on about land prices and peoples reaction to them:
"In the early 80's the great retraction in land prices happened and, guess what, getting bids at an auction was like pulling hens teeth. Those who are afraid to buy at high prices are afraid to buy at low prices. Fear is a paralyzing thing."
What is the 80? Have to be nearly all tillable and highly productive with great soils for that price to even begin making any sense.
deerdown
Well-Known Member
66.37a tillable. He said his best soil farm.... I didn't ask his APH on the farm, and he didn't say, instead he used the "lots' of money out there, people buying ground at any cost, adding to their thousand acres they paid $400/a for back when and cost averaging it out ,marketing lane....
He said rent was $323/a for the next 3 years, $20,500...Highest rent in Mo I've heard of for a new contract starting this year..... there were a few red flags waving at that point....
Slick
Well-Known Member
You better grab that or you will regret in 30 years.
deerdown
Well-Known Member
Ha! I promise you I won't. I'll be dead in 30 years....You better grab that or you will regret in 30 years.
daniel93077
Active Member
What It Really Takes: Cost Breakdown for a Family of Four in Iowa in 2025
I asked ChatGPT to create a detailed look at what it takes financially for a family of four in Iowa to live a middle-class lifestyle while paying for a new house and 80 acres of land, maxing out retirement accounts, and accounting for taxes in 2025.
Here’s the scenario it gave me:
Total monthly outflows come to about $17,888, totaling roughly $215,000/year.
I asked ChatGPT to create a detailed look at what it takes financially for a family of four in Iowa to live a middle-class lifestyle while paying for a new house and 80 acres of land, maxing out retirement accounts, and accounting for taxes in 2025.
Here’s the scenario it gave me:
- Land purchase: 80 acres at $6,000/acre ($480,000 total)
- Land loan: 25% down, 15 years, 7.5% interest → $3,368/month
- Home purchase: $400,000, 20% down, 30 years, 6.5% interest → $2,019/month
- Maxing out 401(k) contributions: $3,833/month (for two earners)
- Living expenses for a middle-class family of four: $5,500/month
- Federal taxes (based on 2025 brackets): ~$2,537/month
- Iowa flat state tax (3.8%): ~$631/month
Total monthly outflows come to about $17,888, totaling roughly $215,000/year.
daniel93077
Active Member
Felt low so I asked if it factored in FICA - it didn't....came back with $231K
DMarley83
DMARLEY83
So are you saying it is not doable or not worth it?
Also #s are different if just starting vs upgrading. Do you need to spend 400k on 1st home + 480 for land so 880,000 for new house and 80 acres vs an older farm house w/ acres....
My opion yes these #s are correct if you must have a new home however if willing to put In some work far less....
daniel93077
Active Member
It’s very doable! No doubt, it’s all about priorities and trade-offs. This person could choose not to save in retirement accounts, not have kids, live in a cheaper house (though $400K isn’t extravagant at today’s prices), buy a smaller property, or start with cash purchase and work up from there. Lots of decisions they can make.
From my experience, it’s pretty clear: with a few exceptions, for most people, the best path to building exceptional wealth is by having equity in a successful closely held business. You either have to build it from the ground up, buy it & build, or bring so much value that you’re invited to become a partner in a business you believe in.
Also, increasing income can’t be underrated. Growing income is far more effective at building wealth than just being frugal. You can only cut back so much, but there’s no cap on how much you can earn. Developing in-demand skills, pushing for promotions, and hustling can really move the dial.
Then, once you’ve grown your income and have discretionary income to work with, it’s time to invest in assets that grow over time. It’s all very doable—and very worth it! My previous post is just showing one example of what it takes. It might discourage some.....but.....it might make another hungry....those are my people.
tall@wide
PMA Member
Plus you have to account for unexpected expenses, family vacations, property taxes, property improvements or food plots, etc. I’d say you need to be in the 300k range in your family scenario.
It’s super hard to get “lots” of ground in today’s world for your average 21 year old. Even that 80 is super hard with how things have changed today. The kids I know that are “making” it either had their parents pay all their bills (paid off their houses or vehicles, unburied them from credit card debt etc) or their grandparents left them tons of money. Heck I bought my first house for 62,000 and that was “dirt cheap” at the time. Now glancing the market in the same area the cheapest house is 214,000 on market and only go up for houses in town (the house I bought was sold last fall for 197,000 for no improvements not by me)
We’re doing several things to benefit us, but it takes more time today than it did 15 years ago. Big factor is internet in my opinion. Good deals are less available because they are widely searched. Good products are hard to get a niche market on because everyone can search the internet. So it’s a bit harder- not impossible- but takes “more” work today.
deerdown
Well-Known Member
Good post.
Too much of the wrong kind of debt servicing takes away a lot of progress on building wealth. Cars, CC, even the wrong kind of education.
My first house was 520sf, and cost $21k...lol..
It is about priorities to a large degree. I can't believe the number of coffee shops around our town. Seriously, I've heard people complain about having more month than money yet they have no problem stopping for a coffee or 2 every day, or buying lunch every day. Smh
daniel93077
Active Member
I don’t disagree. I thought $5,500 on the living expense side was pretty low if one is going to do much around the property while also providing for a family of four…. specifically because this assumes zero in reserve after doing all those other things…most people wouldn’t want that.
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Age old discussion on IW and in general. I actually think being a financial coach would be an awesome gig. The majority (def not all) of folks that complain about not being able to afford this or that.... well it would be very easy to pick apart. Comes down to priorities and DISCIPLINE.
Steve-O
World Member
Priorities and discipline if you make enough to afford the initial costs. But then one has to ask, how much debt is worth it when in the end you end up with nothing.
As I spend months on ranches that are 10s of thousands of acres..I started to think..how much is enough for one guy? (Latest is 13,000 acres and has an interstate that runs through the middle) Because in the end you really never own it. Government project comes through, imminent domain, don't pay the tax, government sells it for back taxes.
It is easier when it land is " handed" down but with inheritance laws, there could be a huge financial burden that comes with that if not done correctly on that side as well. Not as easy as it used to be. Oh yeah...taxes again.
As I spend months on ranches that are 10s of thousands of acres..I started to think..how much is enough for one guy? (Latest is 13,000 acres and has an interstate that runs through the middle) Because in the end you really never own it. Government project comes through, imminent domain, don't pay the tax, government sells it for back taxes.
It is easier when it land is " handed" down but with inheritance laws, there could be a huge financial burden that comes with that if not done correctly on that side as well. Not as easy as it used to be. Oh yeah...taxes again.
It can be done. When u buy ONE tract …. That gets u in the game & keeps u in no matter what prices do. It’s for sure the HARDEST- buying first one!!!! Even if it’s 25 acres of lower end stuff in middle of no where…. Say it’s $125k (that’s on the low side of what guys spend & for size). Be about $40k down. That’s the hard part.
& as I just came up with that “random figure” - I just realized it’s $10k more than my first farm 25 years ago…. 80 acres, zero income was $115k. & the bank made me put down $40k. I think I had like “38,500” & had to scratch up $1500 more. Interest was 7.5%.
Now, I literally started saving at 10 years old & made: $4.25/hour (that was at 14 when worked weeding flower fields by hand) or lawn jobs that paid $7-15 from 10-16 years old. Internships got me to $15/hour. Waiting tables made good $ & delivered pizzas, factory work & was the cart boy at Walmart. Detailed cars at dealership & on side + did buy & fix up & sell some cars too - grand profit here or there. Saved 50-75% of it??? I did work a lot though - I still had plenty time for life & enjoyment but I worked countless extra hours, jobs or shifts. So- $15/hour max & by miracle I had $38,500 saved. Again…. At time- zero income on first farm + did pay for property taxes + all the improvements so it was majorly NEGATIVE for couple years- with payments & costs…. Pry $10k negative per year. I was stressed for a year making those payments & improvements (my job outta school paid maybe $55-60???).
I sold that farm 2.5-3 years later for $240k. Rolled it into bigger & priced right…. Fixed up and sold couple years later …. & repeated that about 50 gazillion times.
.It’s HARD- at beginning or even when u r rolling. I don’t care how u shake it. IF u don’t have lots of $ - I didn’t!!!!!! I frigin eaked by!!! Stressful for few years & even for “10 years” I never thought it was “easy”. Heck, 25 years later I don’t think this whole land thing is “easy” but I love it. It’s doable for anyone but no one can sugar coat it- some stress, some balls & some discipline & hard work. But - anything “great” in life… isn’t anything like that in a way???
“GREAT”….
1) a job u enjoy or have passion/interest in
2) a wife that’s not insane.
3) owning any amount of hunting land
4) living in iowa & being able to keep this state GREAT.
5) Trump being Prez.
6) consistently getting on older bucks for your area.
There’s six random examples of the subjective definition of GREAT
God & eternal salvation are beyond great - DIVINE & the true answer. But…. Great earthly things that matter to most us- hard to achieve but doable.