Apple/Pear Trees

[HannibalBowhunter]

I noticed that alot of your fruit trees are caged and tubed. What is the reason? I am planting my first few apple trees this year and was planning to cage them. Do I need to tube them as well?

 

[letemgrow]

I noticed that alot of your fruit trees are caged and tubed. What is the reason? I am planting my first few apple trees this year and was planning to cage them. Do I need to tube them as well?

MIce and rabbits love apple trees and they will girlde the tree if they are not caged/tubed properly to avoid them. Use pea gravel around the bases of the trees to keep vegetation away and use windown screening about 2 feet tall in case a bunch of snow comes in cause the varmits can walk on top and girlde the trees then. I like to just spray roundup in a 4 foot cirlce to keep bare dirt and use tree tubes instead of screening since I already had them available.

 

[Sligh1]

I find it easy to build a massive fence around my orchard. I have one that's 50 trees- I put a full fence up for $50 because I grabbed old fence around farm and cut trees for poles- took me 3 hours to build it. I mulch around tree and cover trunk for rabbits/mice. Just another option....

 

[dbltree]

Do I need to tube them as well?

as Phil mentioned...use window screening because apple moths love to get behind tubes and lay eggs and then you end up with a dead tree.

The window screen can be stapled shut right up tight to the trunk to keep both bugs and rodents out yet as the tree grows the staples will just pop out so no worries about it being too tight.

Deer will both browse on and rub apple trees and can kill a bunch of them over night...I have a friend who found that out the hard way.

I use this system but there are plenty of options...

 

[letemgrow]

as Phil mentioned...use window screening because apple moths love to get behind tubes and lay eggs and then you end up with a dead tree.

I had better check the tubes and spray the Bonide on them then. :way:

 

[dbltree]

I went ahead and planted some of Kazak apple seeds (in pots) because some had sprouted in the fridge but really they should go to step 5 and i'm not sure how to accomplish that temp (50 degrees)??

I may try storing some in the garage and see if that spurs germination?

Guidelines for Malus Seed Germination

1) Wash and disinfect all containers to be used for chilling or germination and disinfect the working surface on which the seeds are handled.

2) Soak individual seed lots in separate containers, for a minimum of 24 hours to a maximum of 48 hours in regular tap water. Start the soak in the a.m.; Change the water every 2-3 hours to remove any possible growth inhibitors. You will not need to change water for the overnight soak. Label containers with appropriate identification and handle carefully to avoid misidentification.

3) Distribute seed evenly on saturated but not dripping wet blotter paper or paper towels, shake off any excess water. Place germination containers in the dark at 1.5oC (34oF) (regular kitchen refrigerator works fine at 38°F to 42°F) for a minimum of 90 days. Check on seeds once a week, changing paper every two weeks.

4) As needed, surface disinfect each seed lot in 10% chlorox for two minutes, followed by a thorough rinse in running tap water. After 60 or more days, the radicle (white root that starts to emerge from the base of the seed) begins to emerge; then discontinue the use of all surface disinfectants so as not to burn the root-tip.

5) Therefore after about 60-110 days of chilling as you see a few of the seeds in each seed lot showing radicles, place seeds at 10oC (50oF) (or cool room ~ 60oF is fine) for 2-5 days to promote full germination of the seed lot. If some of the seed still appears viable continue to hold the seed at 100C until you see radicle emerge and then plant.

6) When radicles have emerged, carefully plant pre-germinated seed in 4" plastic pots with Cornell mix (commercial potting mix). When planting the seeds with the white radicles, take extra care in not damaging the young radicle (1st root) tip. Grow seedling to 6-7 true leaves and transplant to nursery.

 

[Sligh1]

Apple trees were $12.99 at TRACTOR SUPPLY today in Ankeny. Some were big, some were smaller (3-5' was the range). Ankeny had maybe 5-8 varieties. I always buy large quantities from nurseries BUT I just thought if there were some guys who wanted to plant a few and weren't picky on variety, this could be a good way to get some.

 

[Salkeela]

Hello dbltree - I too have a batch of Kazak apple pips on the go.

(1st post here & I'm not an Iowan nor have I ever seen a whitetail! I joined because a google search brought up some-one with these apple pips..... Hope you don't mind that I'm just here for that reason! :drink2

Anyway back to apples.......

Mine started to germinate in the fridge, and then when I brought the dishes to a cool room temp (we have a N facing unheated corridor in the house that I used) most of the rest germinated too.

I put them in small pots to start with and left them on windowsills down this corridor until several had seed leaves up. Then I moved them to an unheated greenhouse.

Most of them now have 3 true leaves, and I have potted them up into 6" pots and put them outside in a sheltered position. Remarkably I have 81 in total!

I have a bit of space here and so am hoping to create my own wild orchard...... ( I'm in N.Ireland.)

Hope your seedlings are progressing well. I wonder how many others worldwide have taken up this offer and are also planning wild apple forests.....

Sal

PS I love all the pics on this forum. So different to Ireland!

 

[Salkeela]

Adding another post to activate the email alert feature.....

 

[letemgrow]

Glad to have ya here Salkeela!!!

Post up any and all good info you have on growing apple trees cause we are all here to learn.

 

[dbltree]

Glad to have ya here Salkeela!!!

Post up any and all good info you have on growing apple trees cause we are all here to learn.

I'll second Phil's thoughts Sally! Keep us posted on the progress of your Kazaks and share some pics from Ireland too! :way:

 

[Salkeela]

Thanks for the welcome.

I have about 80 apple seedlings now from the ones sent as pips. I was very pleased with this but suspect I will loose a few more before they are established!

I emailed back and asked about nursery beds etc. and got this advice for bringing these pips on:

I would put the seedlings in a nursery setting for 1-2 growing seasons
depending on how well they grow the first year. The planting distance in
the nursery should be 14"-16" apart. The final orchard spacing can be
12'-15' between trees and 15'-20' between rows. As far as pruning there are
many books on the subject. You would treat them just like you would any
grafted tree, but just remember they will be large full size trees, not
dwarf trees. As far as selecting for flavor that would be a personal
choice. If left unsprayed , you could observe what is resistant and would
is susceptible. Good luck,

So mine are in 6" potsfor now and I will put them in a nursery bed in due course - then hopefully transfer them onwards early in 2012 or so? Well that's a plan anyway.

Up to now I have always put cardboard down around the base of my newly planted trees to keep back the grass. This is replaced every year for several years and I also use horsemanure to weight the card down and eventually it rots down and feeds the trees.... or so the plan goes! I may have to seek extra card boxes for this lot!

I hope eventually to dabble in a bit of apple breeding - perhaps crossing local heirloom varieties with some Kazak apples to see what I get. Probably nothing of any value, but at least the orchard I leave behind will have the genetic variety that may be useful in the future.....

This is the area I hope to plant with apple trees:
(Pigs are now in the freezer - & yes that was "the day" they were moved there!)

And these are the bees that will keep them pollinated:
(We just started with bees last year... so no honey yet.... )

That's me on the left ..... :lol:

I'm lucky (or unlucky perhaps) not to have deer that will sabotage young trees.

I look forward to hearing more about your progress with these seedlings as time progresses....

Sal

 

[dbltree]

Thanks for sharing your pictures and plans Salley! :way:

So far only one seed has germinated from the first batch and none from the second batch?

Here's the one that did sprout...

I started the second batch in a 32 cell Rootmaker tray

I'm having terriffic sucess with oak acorns in the 18 cell trays'

I will move whatever Kazaks that do germinate to larger Rootmakers after 12-16 weeks.

You might like to read more about the Rootmakers and how they help establish better/stronger root systems thru root pruning at this link:

Rootmakers

Keep us posted on your kazaks Salley!

 

[whitetail fanatic]

quote: "as Phil mentioned...use window screening because apple moths love to get behind tubes and lay eggs and then you end up with a dead tree.

The window screen can be stapled shut right up tight to the trunk to keep both bugs and rodents out yet as the tree grows the staples will just pop out so no worries about it being too tight.

Deer will both browse on and rub apple trees and can kill a bunch of them over night...I have a friend who found that out the hard way.

I use this system but there are plenty of options"


Do apple moths leave the fuzzy white stuff on the trunks of small apple trees/seedlings? Are those the eggs you are talking about? I noticed a couple of mine that I had landscape fabric hoops around and that white fuzzy stuff was all over inside and the trees were dead. How do they kill the tree? Letemgrow mentioned using Bonide. Is Bonide a spray that will keep them off or kill apple moths?

thanks

 

[letemgrow]

I will move whatever Kazaks that do germinate to larger Rootmakers after 12-16 weeks.

I bet you will have to move them before that time Paul. They should out grow the 18 cell trays by then. :way:

So far, I have not had a single kazak apple sprout. The ones I kept in the fridge from store bought stock in damp peat have started to germinate and are basically my controls to make sure they are not watered too much etc.

 

[Sligh1]

Almost all my Kazak seeds have sprouted. I've had them in a cool room with a constant 55 degrees roughly, slightly cooler at night. kept it moist. doing good BUT we'll see how they fare now that they are in the root-maker trays.

Interested what folks say about moths, etc WF. not sure? I'm using general fruit spray and have no troubles, seems to kill every bug you could think of. I do have the screen cover around trunk instead of tube though.

 

[dbltree]

How do they kill the tree?

The larvae can get behind protectors (if screen is not used) and burrow into the tree eventually killing it.

There are links to diseases and pests back towards the beginning but here is a quick guide to some pests

Apple and Pear Insects

Almost all my Kazak seeds have sprouted. I've had them in a cool room with a constant 55 degrees roughly, slightly cooler at night

That is the key! The first ones I took from the fridge and planted and only one sprouted but the second set I left in the garage when it was in the mid 50's and a number of them are sprouting now.

They are in Rootmakers outside enjoying the 85 degree temps! :way:

 

[whitetail fanatic]

Thanks for posting that link dbltree. They had a description and picture of what I've seen on a few apple trees (they are 2-3 year old trees transplanted as 1 yr old seedlings a year or 2 ago).

from the link: "white woolly material on branches, trunk: woolly apple aphid. Insecticidal soaps and carbaryl (Sevin) are effective against the woolly apple aphid where it occurs on stems."

 

[loneranger]

If you are not against poison,,Nursery manager at Earl may in Ottumwa told me to use Super 8 spray it is called. Amoung other things it is supposed to kill Borers. I lost one apple tree to them. Since using it I have seen no more dmage,,so I guess it works.

 

[Sligh1]

So, I have lots of experience with grafted/planted apple trees. The Kazak seeds are new for me. They all sprouted like I said so I put them BARELY under the dirt. Put a little water on them and they are outside. The top of the soil gets crusty and hard from minor watering.
Will those rascals bust through soil ok even though it's crusty/harder?
Think it's ok that they haven't busted through yet?
Bringing them in at night and leaving outside during day. Sound ok?
How often you suggest watering?

THANKS!

SALKEELA-
I would love to see more pictures of Ireland, the trees, area, farm, etc. You all hunt there and for what? Interesting to have an Irish visitor!!! My family is from Scotland and other half is from Netherlands.