panthers77
New Member
I know that it is getting late for brassicas to be planted. Are there any that I could get in the ground this week that are fast maturing?? Or should I wait and plant the cereal grains?
Daver
PMA Member
Many people are in the same boat with you, I am one of them. With any decent amount of rain you could still have a nice brassica plot this year, even if you planted this coming weekend. BUT, if it stays this dry for even another 3-5 weeks then you will likely end up with a skimpy plot or even a total failure. (The best time to have planted them is probably about 2 weeks ago.)
I went ahead and seeded some brassicas last weekend though with this thought process...
Food is going to be at a preimum this fall/winter in my area and I went ahead and planted the brassicas with the hopes that I can get a decent crop of them so there is something for the deer later this fall/winter. I realize I may be wasting my time/money/seed, but I decided to gamble and hope to catch a couple rains in the next 2-3 weeks.
If you seed the brassicas now and they fail...you can always try the cereal grains(rye) in early to mid-September and still have a plot. So even with the risk of a brassica failure now you still have a chance at a plot for the fall/winter by going to rye in another month.
Can you split the difference and try some brassicas now and some rye later and if the brassicas fail to take then go all rye? That in a nutshell is what I am doing.
panthers77
New Member
Right now we have an acre of brassicas in, we were debating putting in some more. I plan on doing three acres of cereal grains as well. Thinking I will try another acre of the brassicas this week and see what happens.
DUG
New Member
What to do with the rye in my brassicas?
Finally got some much needed rain here in southeast Illinois. My brassicas plots are looking good! i have quite a bit of volunteer rye coming up in my plots. I am going to spray it with select. Should I wait to make sure all of the rye is up. Most of it is 2 inches tall now? I'm afraid if I let it go its going to choke out the Brassicas. What's everyone's thoughts on that? Thanks
Finally got some much needed rain here in southeast Illinois. My brassicas plots are looking good! i have quite a bit of volunteer rye coming up in my plots. I am going to spray it with select. Should I wait to make sure all of the rye is up. Most of it is 2 inches tall now? I'm afraid if I let it go its going to choke out the Brassicas. What's everyone's thoughts on that? Thanks
SWBUCKHNTR
Member
I was wondering the same my tilled under oats from the oats and berseem are growing like crazy and turnips are just starting to show.
dbltree
Super Moderator
There will be lots of volunteer rye this year because we had no rain to germinate it earlier so just kill it with clethodim, probably when it reaches roughly 3-4" tall. A few late germinating stragglers won't hurt anything but too much of it will compete with the brassicas.
Spray 8 ounces of clethodim and 1 quart of crop oil per acre
for those looking for a source, this is the least expensive one I am aware of...
Clethodim source
Remember clethodim is a grass selective herbicide that will not harm broadleaves like brassicas and clovers and must be applied to the leaves of green, growing grasses including cereals like rye, oats, wheat and so on....
Spray 8 ounces of clethodim and 1 quart of crop oil per acre
for those looking for a source, this is the least expensive one I am aware of...
Clethodim source
Remember clethodim is a grass selective herbicide that will not harm broadleaves like brassicas and clovers and must be applied to the leaves of green, growing grasses including cereals like rye, oats, wheat and so on....
dbltree
Super Moderator
August 16th, 2012
I was asked to plant the feeding area on a farm I had sold last winter and had planted it to rye after all other crops were destroyed by drought and deer last year. For 16 years I have done pretty much the same thing, over and over trying to raise corn, soybeans and at times even brassicas only to have them destroyed and always...going to my back up plan of planting rye. Eventually it finally occurred to me that since the same deer stayed and ate the rye...why on earth was I beating my head against a wall trying to grow something else? You see...I am no different then most landowners, thinking (mistakenly) that I needed some other crop because it was "better" when it fact deer could care less. In years following I have put this to the test on many farms and many feeding areas...all with the same result.
In this case I have concerns that the brassicas can survive until the rye begins to grow but time will tell...
This thread of course is about brassicas...so why tout the benefits of winter rye?? Because with out rye's awesome soil building work before hand, brassicas would not stand a chance in this years extreme drought conditions!! To often people focus entirely on "what deer" like and give not a shred of thought to the soil, until....their food plot crops are withering in the hot summer sun.
At any rate, because I do habitat for a living, I often end up doing my own work last making sure that everyone I work for has theirs planted first and at the right time. So this field was planted to rye in late September and because of the drought last fall the clover seeds did not germinate in time before cold weather.
Almost no rain on this farm since mid June but when I mowed the rye off there was still soil moisture
and when i tilled it the moisture was even more evident...note the soil is slightly sticking to the packer wheels
years of planting rye and clovers have over time built up some beautiful high organic matter soils
and I was amazed to find that I could make a clump with my hand...where most soils have been nothing but dust
after I mowed the rye it rained a little and the rye seed exploded and germinated easily (another example of why rye is so easily overseeded into standing crops)
Because I have maintained high soil fertility on this field we spread 100#'s of urea and 200#'s of 6-28-28 per acre and tilled it in.
and broadcasted the Purple Top, Dwarf Essex Rape and Groundhog forage radish seed and re-cultipacked to cover
I prefer to plant mid July but there is still time to get some great growth especially with the ample soil moisture in this field...if they can keep ahead of the grazing pressure remains to be seen but...time will tell...
Half of that plot is brassicas and the other half tiled and urea worked in ready to plant more rye and red clover in a couple weeks and we'll get some white clover established around the perimeter as well. A beautiful soaker this morning should get the brassicas off and running!
I was asked to plant the feeding area on a farm I had sold last winter and had planted it to rye after all other crops were destroyed by drought and deer last year. For 16 years I have done pretty much the same thing, over and over trying to raise corn, soybeans and at times even brassicas only to have them destroyed and always...going to my back up plan of planting rye. Eventually it finally occurred to me that since the same deer stayed and ate the rye...why on earth was I beating my head against a wall trying to grow something else? You see...I am no different then most landowners, thinking (mistakenly) that I needed some other crop because it was "better" when it fact deer could care less. In years following I have put this to the test on many farms and many feeding areas...all with the same result.
In this case I have concerns that the brassicas can survive until the rye begins to grow but time will tell...
This thread of course is about brassicas...so why tout the benefits of winter rye?? Because with out rye's awesome soil building work before hand, brassicas would not stand a chance in this years extreme drought conditions!! To often people focus entirely on "what deer" like and give not a shred of thought to the soil, until....their food plot crops are withering in the hot summer sun.
At any rate, because I do habitat for a living, I often end up doing my own work last making sure that everyone I work for has theirs planted first and at the right time. So this field was planted to rye in late September and because of the drought last fall the clover seeds did not germinate in time before cold weather.
Almost no rain on this farm since mid June but when I mowed the rye off there was still soil moisture
and when i tilled it the moisture was even more evident...note the soil is slightly sticking to the packer wheels
years of planting rye and clovers have over time built up some beautiful high organic matter soils
and I was amazed to find that I could make a clump with my hand...where most soils have been nothing but dust
after I mowed the rye it rained a little and the rye seed exploded and germinated easily (another example of why rye is so easily overseeded into standing crops)
Because I have maintained high soil fertility on this field we spread 100#'s of urea and 200#'s of 6-28-28 per acre and tilled it in.
and broadcasted the Purple Top, Dwarf Essex Rape and Groundhog forage radish seed and re-cultipacked to cover
I prefer to plant mid July but there is still time to get some great growth especially with the ample soil moisture in this field...if they can keep ahead of the grazing pressure remains to be seen but...time will tell...
Half of that plot is brassicas and the other half tiled and urea worked in ready to plant more rye and red clover in a couple weeks and we'll get some white clover established around the perimeter as well. A beautiful soaker this morning should get the brassicas off and running!
AIRASSAULT
PMA Member
Got the dbltree mix in the ground on July 28th and it is coming in very nicely... Kindof a crappy pic though.. Took it this morning with my cell. I had to water it for about the first week and a half or so, but, we have had some perfect rains since.
dbltree
Super Moderator
Great looking brassicas :way:
August 17th, 2012
The 2012 drought now has the dubious distinction of being the 5th worst in recorded history, the worst since 1956 and if it continues could soon rival the dust bowl days of the 1930's. The disturbing part of this is for those who remember your history lessons, the 1930's drought lasted for a number of years...it was not just a one year, one time thing and unfortunately there is that same prospect that we are faced with now.
What will it take to end the drought?? Days and days of heavy drenching, repeated rainfall....the kind that comes from the remnants of a tropical storm or hurricane as it passes across the mainland. It will take heavy snow fall and plentiful spring rains to rebuild lost subsoil moisture....all of which could happen or...not. Most of you have not farmed and therefore do not know the heartbreaking financial effects of droughts...trust me, you never ever forget those kind of things and far less worse drought years will haunt me to my final breath.
So...growing brassicas is easy...if you get rain, we can throw it out on the ground and given plentiful rainfall it will germinate and grow but...without rain it's a far different story and the results can be very disappointing. Look over the drought map keeping in mind that most of the worst affected areas continue to get worse...if you live in the "white" areas or even in the "abnormally dry" areas...growing brassicas should be a breeze this year and you are indeed fortunate. If however you live in the dark shaded areas of extreme to exceptional drought...growing anything can be challenging or even impossible to say the least...
I live in SE Iowa...an area affected by extreme drought where subsoil moisture is non-existent and even with an inch of rain yesterday morning I went out an hour later and tilled up nothing but dust!
This was an area planted in oats this spring and has never had winter rye (NOT ryegrass) planted on this soil and while an inch of rain seems like an awesome event during a drought, the hard cold truth is that it barely soaked an inch into the top soil...powder dry soils lay below the surface holding nothing for brassicas to grow into.
This field has been planted since July 18th and only now has a few very tiny brassicas emerging and with no more rain in sight, they may very well germinate and...perish
Now...I am aware that there always a few who scoff at the idea of planting winter rye because they no nothing about soil management and are unable to see beyond the "what do deer like" attitudes, but...for those with a lick of sense the following pictures provide undeniable proof of the amazing attributes of winter rye (cereal rye, fall rye grain but NOT ryegrass)
Where the brassicas have emerged and are growing it was in rye and red clover last fall...where growth stops was in oats this spring...which do you wish your brassicas were planted in???
Other side of the same field looking at it crossways...it's like a line in the sand so to speak...brassicas planted in winter rye on the left and in oats on the right....
Why?? How is it that during an extreme drought that these brassicas can actually grow??
Because rye scavenges more then just soil nutrients like nitrogen and potassium...it's tremendous root systems hold water like a giant underground sponge and unlike the previous pic of powder dry soil...we have moisture nearly 6" deep and below it can in no way be described as "powder dry"
Brassicas are a great fall and winter food source and an important part of my rotations and easily grown under normal weather conditions but...a drought year will separate the men from the boys when it comes to growing food sources for our whitetails. If you have a great crop of brassicas growing, please share and at the same time share the area in which you live (relative to the drought map) and how much rain you have received since planting, the type of soils and previous crop...all information that can help others learn to avoid future disasters.
Remember...if your brassicas fail you can follow with the rye mix and still have outstanding food sources that will be every bit as effective as anything you could possibly plant and...next year when you follow 1/2 of yur plot with brassicas, they'll have a fighting chance should the drought of 2012 stretch into...2013.....
August 17th, 2012
The 2012 drought now has the dubious distinction of being the 5th worst in recorded history, the worst since 1956 and if it continues could soon rival the dust bowl days of the 1930's. The disturbing part of this is for those who remember your history lessons, the 1930's drought lasted for a number of years...it was not just a one year, one time thing and unfortunately there is that same prospect that we are faced with now.
What will it take to end the drought?? Days and days of heavy drenching, repeated rainfall....the kind that comes from the remnants of a tropical storm or hurricane as it passes across the mainland. It will take heavy snow fall and plentiful spring rains to rebuild lost subsoil moisture....all of which could happen or...not. Most of you have not farmed and therefore do not know the heartbreaking financial effects of droughts...trust me, you never ever forget those kind of things and far less worse drought years will haunt me to my final breath.
So...growing brassicas is easy...if you get rain, we can throw it out on the ground and given plentiful rainfall it will germinate and grow but...without rain it's a far different story and the results can be very disappointing. Look over the drought map keeping in mind that most of the worst affected areas continue to get worse...if you live in the "white" areas or even in the "abnormally dry" areas...growing brassicas should be a breeze this year and you are indeed fortunate. If however you live in the dark shaded areas of extreme to exceptional drought...growing anything can be challenging or even impossible to say the least...
I live in SE Iowa...an area affected by extreme drought where subsoil moisture is non-existent and even with an inch of rain yesterday morning I went out an hour later and tilled up nothing but dust!
This was an area planted in oats this spring and has never had winter rye (NOT ryegrass) planted on this soil and while an inch of rain seems like an awesome event during a drought, the hard cold truth is that it barely soaked an inch into the top soil...powder dry soils lay below the surface holding nothing for brassicas to grow into.
This field has been planted since July 18th and only now has a few very tiny brassicas emerging and with no more rain in sight, they may very well germinate and...perish
Now...I am aware that there always a few who scoff at the idea of planting winter rye because they no nothing about soil management and are unable to see beyond the "what do deer like" attitudes, but...for those with a lick of sense the following pictures provide undeniable proof of the amazing attributes of winter rye (cereal rye, fall rye grain but NOT ryegrass)
Where the brassicas have emerged and are growing it was in rye and red clover last fall...where growth stops was in oats this spring...which do you wish your brassicas were planted in???
Other side of the same field looking at it crossways...it's like a line in the sand so to speak...brassicas planted in winter rye on the left and in oats on the right....
Why?? How is it that during an extreme drought that these brassicas can actually grow??
Because rye scavenges more then just soil nutrients like nitrogen and potassium...it's tremendous root systems hold water like a giant underground sponge and unlike the previous pic of powder dry soil...we have moisture nearly 6" deep and below it can in no way be described as "powder dry"
Brassicas are a great fall and winter food source and an important part of my rotations and easily grown under normal weather conditions but...a drought year will separate the men from the boys when it comes to growing food sources for our whitetails. If you have a great crop of brassicas growing, please share and at the same time share the area in which you live (relative to the drought map) and how much rain you have received since planting, the type of soils and previous crop...all information that can help others learn to avoid future disasters.
Remember...if your brassicas fail you can follow with the rye mix and still have outstanding food sources that will be every bit as effective as anything you could possibly plant and...next year when you follow 1/2 of yur plot with brassicas, they'll have a fighting chance should the drought of 2012 stretch into...2013.....
I am seeing rain coming tomorrow on my land. When was last rain you had on them? What are you "hoping for" or seeing for predicted rain? Curious how much stress & lack of rain you're talking about? If it's just starting to stress them & you get rain in the next few days, I think you'll be fine.
They have had around 1" total since planted mid july. Going on 2 weeks since last rain.
That isn't good!!! 2 weeks is stretching it. Possibly pull one out to see how your root length is? And at that level, is there any soil moisture down that far down? If we get rain this weekend on your plots- I'd check soon after to see if they appear to bounce back. I'm on fence. You'll know soon though. If they do NOT bounce back, seed the dbltree special or interseed some more radishes if there's some sparse areas that did make it, etc. You thankfully have a back up plan with any scenario. Good luck, bring the rain!
dbltree
Super Moderator
August 26th, 2012
The brassicas around here vary greatly, much like the soybeans this spring...spotty uneven germination due to lack of soil moisture where they were planted in cereal rye they are toughing it out
Lighter soil with less moisture they are just now germinating...this soil has only had tenths since the 1st of July
Once up they are pretty tough plants and struggle along with little or no rainfall
Most of my are received 1.5 to 2+" of rain this morning which should germinate anything that has been laying in the soil and spur growth of those that are up. If you have thing brassica plantings you can always overseed with winter rye to fill in the empty bare spots in early September.
Computer models suggest now that Hurricane Issac may come blasting up the MS Valley and bring heavy rainfall to drought stricken areas...to early to be certain but if this occurs it would be a good time to get seed and if necessary...urea down ahead of the approaching rainfall....
The brassicas around here vary greatly, much like the soybeans this spring...spotty uneven germination due to lack of soil moisture where they were planted in cereal rye they are toughing it out
Lighter soil with less moisture they are just now germinating...this soil has only had tenths since the 1st of July
Once up they are pretty tough plants and struggle along with little or no rainfall
Most of my are received 1.5 to 2+" of rain this morning which should germinate anything that has been laying in the soil and spur growth of those that are up. If you have thing brassica plantings you can always overseed with winter rye to fill in the empty bare spots in early September.
Computer models suggest now that Hurricane Issac may come blasting up the MS Valley and bring heavy rainfall to drought stricken areas...to early to be certain but if this occurs it would be a good time to get seed and if necessary...urea down ahead of the approaching rainfall....
jmm46
Member
I did two strips of brassicas, one with fertilizer and one without(I ran out of fertilizer so I kept going just to see difference)...well, the fertilized strip is awesome and the non-fertilized strip isn't doing so hot...can I broadcast some urea on it just before a good rain to help it out or anything else I can do or is it a lost cause? It's about 6 inches tall but is starting to change to a red/purplish color
dbltree
Super Moderator
September 3rd, 2012
A couple inches of rain sure makes a big difference in the ole brassica patch!
Seed is still germinating even though it's been planted for 6 weeks now!
I had a little leftover brassica seed in my drill when I started the cereals and it shows you why I plant in mid July rather then late August!! Planting that late is like planting corn in June rather then April...it may grow but yields will be substantially lower...
I have shared many pictures of the amazing difference winter(cereal ) rye made on brassicas during a drought year, the only brassicas that came up, did so where they were planted into winter rye that was planted the previous fall. This pic shows a strip where I tested a field cultivator early this spring and in so doing killed the winter rye in that strip early on....note that brassicas did not germinate there....
On either side where the rye grew and then was killed with herbicide but left standing, the brassicas germinated and grew despite the extreme drought!! Only a smattering of brassicas are coming up 6 weeks later in the tilled strip where the rye was killed...
My friend Fred sent me a pic of his combination plots, where he has brassicas, the rye mix and not seen here are soybeans and clovers all surrounded by beautiful switchgrass and hinged timber beyond that...outstanding!
Then there is my friend Mike from WI who sent me pics of his brassicas just to remind me what they should look like this time of year!!
Mike always does a great job and is building his soils with plenty of manure!
A few inches of rain made the difference and from this point on the deep rooted brassicas will do very well...rain or no but hopefully we'll continue to get timely rains and cooler weather to boot... :way:
A couple inches of rain sure makes a big difference in the ole brassica patch!
Seed is still germinating even though it's been planted for 6 weeks now!
I had a little leftover brassica seed in my drill when I started the cereals and it shows you why I plant in mid July rather then late August!! Planting that late is like planting corn in June rather then April...it may grow but yields will be substantially lower...
I have shared many pictures of the amazing difference winter(cereal ) rye made on brassicas during a drought year, the only brassicas that came up, did so where they were planted into winter rye that was planted the previous fall. This pic shows a strip where I tested a field cultivator early this spring and in so doing killed the winter rye in that strip early on....note that brassicas did not germinate there....
On either side where the rye grew and then was killed with herbicide but left standing, the brassicas germinated and grew despite the extreme drought!! Only a smattering of brassicas are coming up 6 weeks later in the tilled strip where the rye was killed...
My friend Fred sent me a pic of his combination plots, where he has brassicas, the rye mix and not seen here are soybeans and clovers all surrounded by beautiful switchgrass and hinged timber beyond that...outstanding!
Then there is my friend Mike from WI who sent me pics of his brassicas just to remind me what they should look like this time of year!!
Mike always does a great job and is building his soils with plenty of manure!
A few inches of rain made the difference and from this point on the deep rooted brassicas will do very well...rain or no but hopefully we'll continue to get timely rains and cooler weather to boot... :way: