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Coyote predation

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westwind

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Whats your thoughts on this?

I always pictured coyotes killing fawns and sick deer more than healthy adult deer. I had one cleaned carcass in CRP next to a foodplot after Christmas and neighbor just sent me a pic of two together in a timber draw.

Seems like more than usual but I don’t really know.

I gotta get busy shooting some either way, have never really done any coyote hunting.
 
chadw said:
I had a buddy show me how to set snares on Friday. First time I’ve ever set a set for coyote. Caught one on Saturday. Was surprised how easy they were. Wish I had learned earlier.


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Nice! I have considered trapping- there is a guy that trains coon hounds near me, I think he’s good about property lines but maybe not the hounds!

Either way, very time a coyote is eliminated its a win.
 
I think coyotes get blamed for more kills than they actually make. Just because they are eating a deer carcass doesn’t mean they killed the deer. I mean look at how fast deer get ate when you leave them overnight sometimes.

Yes, I’m sure there’s times when coyotes will kill a deer. But the energy expenditure vs success is low so it’s not gonna happen often especially on 100% healthy deer.

Now where I do think they impact the deer herd is during fawn predation.


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Coyotes impact to fawn mortality is substantial. I have the game camera images to prove this!

(Several carrying around fawns in their mouths in May, June). I've posted these before..

I don't get the impression they mess with adult deer much. If they do, it's more likely due to herd imbalance, sickness or overpopulation of coyotes. Just my own theories, observations..
 
This thread reminded me of a cougar study years ago out west. They GPS collared 4 cougars if my memory serves me correctly. They were wanting to document the older and sick deer kills to back up that cougars would help eliminate CWD deer. To their amazement the cats ate 100% fawns for the first six months after does started dropping fawns. Easy easy meal just makes sense. Then after that I don't think there was any rhyme or reason on what they killed. Just like us bowhunters, if a close range kill opportunity falls into place we take advantage it.

There are plenty of documented cases of coyotes taking adult deer. Several of these that have been documented over the last 20 some years involve packs of 6 to 8 coyotes literally running deer to death. Well, almost to death, and then they ate them alive. They are a stamina runner and deer aren't.

Nature is a cruel mother.
 
My view is that an adult deer is a threat to the health of a coyote. A coyote with a busted jaw or busted leg from a well-placed deer kick is DOA. I think they'd opt for easier kills, only taking down adult deer if in a pack or starving.
 
Que my " chime in" on this topic.

I've been a fanatical coyote hunter for year traveling to 8 states to do so.

If a coyote want a deer, it can catch one. Yes, even a healthy one.
.nows the time to let's some hound guys in fellas. I know lots of them and they are all good,respectful fellas.

Hell, ask them if you can join in. I'm sure it will change your perspective of the being the (boogie man)

Don't worry about the deer. Let's kill some coyotes.;)
 
chadw said:
I had a buddy show me how to set snares on Friday. First time I’ve ever set a set for coyote. Caught one on Saturday. Was surprised how easy they were. Wish I had learned earlier.


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Good deal. ^^ Scout up some YouTube "how to" videos too. There are many pretty good ones to review out there.
 
bluedog69 said:
This thread reminded me of a cougar study years ago out west. They GPS collared 4 cougars if my memory serves me correctly. They were wanting to document the older and sick deer kills to back up that cougars would help eliminate CWD deer. To their amazement the cats ate 100% fawns for the first six months after does started dropping fawns. Easy easy meal just makes sense. Then after that I don't think there was any rhyme or reason on what they killed. Just like us bowhunters, if a close range kill opportunity falls into place we take advantage it.

There are plenty of documented cases of coyotes taking adult deer. Several of these that have been documented over the last 20 some years involve packs of 6 to 8 coyotes literally running deer to death. Well, almost to death, and then they ate them alive. They are a stamina runner and deer aren't.

Nature is a cruel mother.
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I think the old "sick & weak" grade school and USFW talking points have pretty much been debunked. My take is that predators are just killers, it's how they're wired and that's what they do. I try to never let a yote or any kind of a cat walk. We never deny a serious trapper or a good coon hunter access, except during early November.

I once watched a hawk take 6 quail out of a covey of 15. He would take one, go to a tree, kill it and drop it. Now that I have more game cams I see coyotes constantly harassing deer.
 
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I clearly must live in an area that has no coyotes (it’s a joke) but the deer I shot this year, the gut pile literally laid there for a month before it was gone. I’ve got a stray cat I’ve kept around because- IT CHASES AWAY FOX! Most of the other stray cats have met their demise, but this one earned its keep. I wish I was joking but we raise lots of chickens and the cat doesn’t bother the chickens but it literally chased a fox away (and if I dig hard enough I can come up with cell cam photos too of it).
I’ve said before- I really want to get trapping yotes but we have TONS of night hunters in this area. The one guy apparently has something like “night ride” or something- he literally drives down the rode with either night vision/thermal and finds stuff to shoot. (I don’t know specifics- he just hunts my brother in laws farm for coyotes and I’ve heard sketchy stories)
 
Guy I know from Arizona posted this in another forum, coyotes are getting pets.
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I looked up some info on snares even though they are illegal in my state. Was surprised how much discussion there was about how they catch deer and how hard it was to keep from catching deer.

@Bucksnbears I have a caller and an ok rifle. Can you point me towards a thread to just get me started on calling set ups? I am a pretty successful hunter but have just never had that first little bit of success with coyotes to get rolling. I also have it in my head that killing them on a small property is going to be a challenge since I’m constantly educating the bastards.

I think I’m probably going to make the investment in thermal equipment. Damn expensive! No one seems to regret it though.
 
westwind said:
I looked up some info on snares even though they are illegal in my state. Was surprised how much discussion there was about how they catch deer and how hard it was to keep from catching deer.

@Bucksnbears I have a caller and an ok rifle. Can you point me towards a thread to just get me started on calling set ups? I am a pretty successful hunter but have just never had that first little bit of success with coyotes to get rolling. I also have it in my head that killing them on a small property is going to be a challenge since I’m constantly educating the bastards.

I think I’m probably going to make the investment in thermal equipment. Damn expensive! No one seems to regret it though.
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In my younger years I trapped a decent amount. Set snares for raccoons beavers and coyotes. Never once caught a deer. In iowa you have to put a stop on your snares to keep the loop from getting smaller than I think a pop can diameter. That is much bigger than a deer leg, so if a deer starts to get caught, it just falls off of their leg. Not saying you can't catch a deer, but it has to be very rare.
 
Never set a snare- the videos I looked at were setting the loop perpendicular with the ground so the coyotes head goes through it? It looked super easy compared to leg hold trapping especially with snow on the ground.
 
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westwind said:
Never set a snare- the videos I looked at were setting the loop perpendicular with the ground so the coyotes head goes through it. It looked super easy compared to leg hold trapping especially with snow on the ground.
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They are set like you say. The loop should be low enough that a deer's head and neck should go over it so you only have to worry about catching the legs and that is where the stop comes into play. You change the size of loop and how far off of the ground to match the animal you are trying to catch.
 
IMHO - I think coyotes kill far more adult deer than folks realize…. I know I’m the minority on this thinking. Anecdotally I’ve seen it happen with my own eyes several times over the last 5-7 years …. Saw 2 mature & “healthy” bucks get “ambushed” by packs of coyotes that set traps… Killed. Got to witness one in thermals where coyotes chased a mature doe all over until it was exhausted All these deer I found later. Found a near my stand that was run to exhaustion & “blew its lungs out” with foamy blood out its mouth & I proceeded to empty my quiver on coyotes that AM - recovered arrows & shot a few more times…. Got 5-6 coyotes that am.
The amount of pics I’ve seen on my places or buddies where bucks have a pack of coyotes chasing it & u find that buck dead nearby…. Too often!!! It’s nature but I hate those coyotes!!!

That’s my anecdotal examples. & this is in a very high coyote density area. They “appear” to hunt like wolves more in packs. I don’t hear or see this stuff in areas where coyote density is much lower & clearly predation far less.

On fawns…. In high coyote density areas… incredibly bad. Again, if they are Lower pop… minor issue. I’m in a bad area & the amount of pics I get of fawn heads in mouth or legs is crazy. Working on farms - finding killed fawns (from variety of things) is/was bad. Coyote density varies a lot. Kansas…. Good gosh, insane the amount of coyotes & how often see does with no fawns. They for sure keep huge regions of deer #’s low.

I guess all this is anecdotal but here’s my experience in high density areas…. We have killed right around 150-300 coyotes per year for last 4-5 years on my farm & the surrounding area. Kill rate trending down. … total WAR. All year shooting + trapping when legal. It’s probably gone down some for how many shot & we have to go further & hunt/trap more to even hit probably 100 this year. Way way less. We kill em during fawning season as well of course. In last 2 or so years…. The amount of fawns killed is obscenely less, no doubt in my mind!!!!! The other one…. I believe they target bucks that are rutted down, little injuries or they see any weakness (natural for coyotes to target that) …. Since WAR…. We have lost far fewer bucks I find dead “for no good reason” Fawns & bucks & deer in general killed- way less. But… all that was…. Taking a super high density & dropping it way down. A lot of regions may luckily already be there. If you aren’t and u are full of coyotes… IMO- I’d get every neighbor on board for miles & get guys trapping & thermal hunting all over if possible. If predator hunting & trapping take place consistently over wide area, HUGE impact IMHO & experience. I’ve seen what they do when get obscene populations of coyotes…. I’ll never let it happen again.
2 nights ago friend got big one. :). I watch for em on trail cameras & set traps & hunt em as I notice when they move in.



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LITERALLY 2 mins ago as I’m typing this!!!!!…

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