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Deer Mangement Update 9-6-08

blake

Life Member
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<u>Open meeting: Deer Management in Iowa and the Depredation Program</u>

On August 28th The Iowa DNR will be providing information about the Depredation Program in Iowa. They will also be looking at Deer Management at the state, county, and local levels.

Anyone interesting in attending this meeting is welcome.

<u>Agenda:</u>

1. Welcome & Introductions.

2. Deer Management at the state, county, and local levels: Tom Litchfield.

3. Deer Depredation Program update: Tom Bunger & Mike Olson.

4. How to get involved!

5. How does the program help me as a landowner, and a deer hunter!

Date: August 28th
Time: 7:00 p.m.
Location: Page County Conservation Board
Conservation Center/River Access
2039 Highway 71
Clarinda, Iowa
51632
Questions: 515-975-8318

A big Thank You to Charly Stevens Office Manger for the Page County Conservation Board for putting this meeting together.

I hope to see some of you IW and IBA members at this meeting, we all need to get involved. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif

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Iowa's number one resource for the whitetail deer.
 
Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

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I attended this Depredation/Deer Management Meeting that was hosted by the Page County Conservation Commission and presented by the Iowa DNR. The presentation put on by the IDNR was well rehearsed, very professional, and informative.

Those of us in attendance were given the opportunity to openly ask questions during the presentation and meet with the DNR Officer's after the meeting was over. Often I had difficulty determining if we were talking about the depredation program or the general deer hunting season, as many landowners wanted their questions answered immediately as topics came up in the presentation. This was somewhat disruptive, but I will say that the DNR tried to keep on topic re: Depredation aspect of the meeting.

The purpose of this meeting IMO was to educate property owners and hunters to work together to solve the deer population "problems". In other words, get hunters together with landowners experiencing crop damage problems due to the local deer population. The DNR wants to get Iowa's deer herd down to the early 1990's level. This idea was popular with some landowners, but not with many deer hunters.

Some of these landowners acknowledged the fact that some of their neighbors who didn't allow hunting or only allowed hunting on a limited basis were also a huge problem. They complained that deer would come from these sanctuaries and damage their crops because the food sources on the properties in the deer core areas had been depleted or there weren't any food sources in the first place. Basically the sanctuary owners were allowing there neighbors to provide the food sources for the big bucks that they want to hunt.

Another topic off discussion was State and County Wildlife Preserves/Parks that create deer sanctuaries especially when the gun seasons begin. Every deer in the county runs straight to these protected areas. Some State Parks have opened hunting on a limited basis for antlerless deer but they need to harvest more deer. Once the gun seasons are over the deer often migrate back to the original core areas and the problem remains the same for next year. Few if any County parks in the state allow any form of deer hunting. Again one must wonder how we as hunters are expected to reduce the deer herd if there is no access to these sanctuaries.

Leasing by outfitters was briefly discussed and the opinion of the DNR officers present was that outfitting has a negative impact on the deer herd and creates a management problem for the DNR. However, they did not discuss how or if they plan to regulate outfitting in Iowa.

Access to hunting properties was a major topic presented by hunters. Leasing and accusation of property by resident and non resident hunters was discussed. The general feeling was that these individuals are not managing their properties properly. They are shooting bucks only, and not harvesting enough antlerless deer to maintain a proper balance. A couple of farmers mentioned that non-resident land owners should be able to get a buck tag every year and so should there dependent children.

The "Earn a Buck" Program was mentioned by the DNR, but not discussed in length. There is like doubt in my mine that it is an option that is being considered.

The DNR also mentioned making hunters wanting to participate in the depredation program or park hunters to pass an education class and participate in a shooting proficiency test. The DNR feels that landowners and park board members maybe more respective if they knew that hunters wanting to hunt their property had passed a certified safety course and shooting proficiency test.

Other positive aspects of this meeting were getting to meet the region Depredation officers. These are the guys that meet with the farmers having problems with deer and get you the hunter and the farmer in their respective regions working together.

Northeast Iowa: Ross Ellingson 563-929-6001

Southeast Iowa: Greg Harris 319-330-5578

Central Iowa: Bill Bunger 515-975-8318

Northwest Iowa: Maury Muhn 712-320-0611

Southwest Iowa: Mike Olsen 712-250-4436


Landowner Concerns

Several landowners stated that the lack of hunters asking permission to hunt their properties was a major problem. These landowners want more deer harvested off of their land and they don't much care how that happens. Some of the local farmers would like to see the deer population at the 1950's levels. Basically no deer; or a very limited number of deer.

Some of these landowners signed up on a list to allow hunters to hunt their properties. And I was able to talk with several of these landowners and gain permission to hunt as several other hunters in attendance did.

One surprising thing that I learned was that most of the landowners in attendance believe that bow hunters shoot bucks only and don't harvest any antlerless deer. I and several other hunters made an attempt to dispel this misconception. Bottom line folks; is we need to start shooting antlerless deer with our bows and show them to
the landowners.

Other landowners stated that if a hunter wanted to hunt their property he would have to show the landowner that he did in fact have in his procession antlerless tags.

Some of these landowners signed up on a list to allow hunters to hunt their properties. And I was able to talk with several of these landowners and gain permission to hunt as several other hunters in attendance did.

One surprising thing that I learned was that most of the landowners in attendance believe that bow hunters shoot bucks only and don't harvest any antlerless deer. I and several other hunters made an attempt to dispel this misconception. Bottom line folks; is we need to start shooting antlerless deer with our bows and show them to the landowners.

Some of the landowners talked about implementing their own "Earn a Buck" program on their land. Numbers being thrown around were like making the hunter shoot 3-5 antlerless deer before they could shoot a buck.

Other landowners stated that if a hunter wanted to hunt their property he would have to show the landowner that he did in fact have in his/her procession antlerless tags.

And several landowners stated that the lack of hunters asking permission to hunt their properties was a major problem. These landowners want more deer harvested off of their land and they don't much care how that happens. Some of the local farmers would like to see the deer population at the 1950's levels. Basically no deer; or a very limited number of deer.

Several landowners wanted the state to issue them a certain number of tags and they could sell them to whom ever they wished; resident or non resident!


Topics Covered After the Meeting

I had the opportunity to talk with several farmers and hunters after the meeting was over. I found their views very interesting. The following are a few of the subjects that the farmers are less than pleased about:

<u>Leased land for hunting:</u>

Some of the problem areas (deer sanctuaries) are being managed for bird hunting and the funding for these properties is coming from Pheasants Forever, Quail Forever, CRP, and timber grants. In some cases the DNR is paying landowners to cut downlocust trees to provide protection for pheasants and quail after the grasses grow up between the downed tree limbs. These properties also make excellent bedding areas and safe havens for the whitetail deer. And with all the funding available there is minimal cost to the landowner. Many of the farmers were upset that these programs are directly responsible and contributing to the "over abundance of deer".

Some farmers felt that the problem is reduced numbers of hunters, and reduced land access. Some felt the DNR also was part of the problem.

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In closing my thoughts are these:

We must all work together to reduce the deer herd to and acceptable level for all of use, non hunters, farmers, tree growers, flower growers, city property owners and hunter alike.

We as deer hunters should expect certain entities to try and make some major changes in the deer hunting regulations in the very near future. The Outfitters, Realtors, the Insurance industry, and the State of Iowa are seeing dollar signs.

If the resident deer hunter wants to continue to hunt deer in this great state we had all better become very proactive. These large groups mentioned in the above paragraph are organized, and they are getting stronger every day. If they get their way there will be a very negative impact on the quality of deer hunting in Iowa.

The next couple of months will likely shape the future of deer hunting in the State of Iowa for many years to come. As many of you are aware there are some organizations and companies out there that are trying to make some changes that will adversely affect your deer hunting and hunting in Iowa in general.

If you like to watch deer, photograph deer, hunt deer with gun or bow then you need to become proactive. How you ask, by joining the only organization the actively prompts deer hunting, is a watch dog when it comes to our state reps, and works with the DNR so deer hunting in Iowa can and will remain a great experience for non-resident and resident hunters alike.

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Please join and support the Iowa Bowhunters Association, united we can make a difference.<span style="color: #CC0000"> For more information about becoming an IBA member&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;</span>Details<span style="color: #CC0000">&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;</span>
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Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

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TTT………………Please read the above lenghty post! Kind of scary in spots?


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Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kind of scary in spots? </div></div>

Yikes...I guess so! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

Thanks for posting the info Ron /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
 
Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

I am personally having a problem understanding what is being called a deer management plan here in Iowa. I am not taking shots at the DNR here, and most of you know that I have been very supportive of them in the past, but I think that they are caving into many different groups who furnish them no financial support what so ever and harming those of us who support them totally both with money and volunteer help, HUNTERS.

If the DNR truly want to reduce the deer herd to 1990 levels, can't they see and survive the resulting loss of revenue? In past posts I have pointed out a lot of numbers on licenses sold, deer harvested, success ratios, and some other things which I took directly form the DNR website going clear back into the 1980's. I just spent an hour combing that website and all that info is gone, why? If my memory serves me correctly in 2005 we harvested 211,000 deer for all seasons, and sold right at 400,000 licenses. In 2006 we killed less than 160,000 deer and still sold almost 400,000 licenses and then in 2007 we killed a little over 140,000 deer and still sold over 350,000 licenses. The success ratio fell from 60% down to 34% in just three years. How many of the more casual hunters will continue to buy licenses with a falling deer population and success ratio if they blank out for a year or two? Also this 2007 harvest was made up of over 60% antlerless deer. How long can that go on?

Again I can't find the info any longer but I believe the harvest for 1990 was about 80,000 deer and a success ratio of around 70% which means about 115,000 licenses sold. How will they make up the millions and millions of dollars lost? What will our fees raise to and how many NR licenses will that take? How much will the Farm Bureau, Insurance companies, suburban home owners, and the Iowa Restaurant Association contribute to the DNR to cover both just this short fall and their increased cost of maintaining this lowered population?

I have seem several comments that say hunter efforts are working and we are near our goals but we still need to kill more does. I have asked here and on other sites and at at least one meeting what those mysterious goals really are and have never gotten a straight answer, mostly just double talk and platitudes if any thing at all. I believe that Mr. Suchy is a good guy and a good biologist and is caught in a thankless job for right now and is doing the best he can under the guide lines and pressures put on him. I will ask again, what are the goals we are trying to attain, and why as a sportsman should I support a program that reduces my success percentage from 70 plus percent to maybe around a 25% chance of filling my tag and pay more money to do it? What is my end benefit for helping reduce the deer herd? More deer hunting or maybe even better deer hunting or just a regression to a lottery license system that will further restrict my hunting? If you were in Las Vegas and you were asked to make a bet with a 70% chance of winning or making a bet with a 25% chance of winning with both having the very same payoff where would you put your money?

I know that this is a continuous debate but I can't see that we as hunters are winning anything. Yes we have more seasons, longer seasons, a rifle season, and more doe tags available than we want to buy, but if we have 75% fewer deer what good is any of it. Not only that but if there is 75% fewer places to hunt and more NR hunters to compete for the remaining access what have we gained by killing thousands of does? Maybe I am just getting to be an old man and over think this subject too much. I have been hunting deer one way or another since 1976 and have seen a lot of changes over those years. In 1980 we could go almost any place in Davis, Wapello, or Van Buren county and get permission to hunt deer. Now I own 140 acres and my brother in law owns 300 acres and with the addition of a couple of neighbors lands that is what we have to hunt, good or bad. In 1980 there were maybe 100,000 deer hunters to compete with for access, now there are maybe 400,000 to compete with for fewer acres every year. I have 10 or maybe 15 more years to worry about hunting, but a lot of you guys who are 20 or 30 years old need to really get involved because you are the ones who will suffer the most from many of these issues that aren't being addressed right now.

Same old story, when I get started I usually over do it, and if you all think I am full of crap just tell me so but be prepared to show me why and how I have error ed in my assessments. Thanks for listening.
 
Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">if you all think I am full of crap just tell me </div></div>

if you are then that makes two of us... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

With so much land now in "recreational use" some of the deer reduction thoughts seem like a moot point?

I doubt if any of us are going to attempt to slaughter deer down to 70% of what it is now...so how do they propose to even attempt such a thing?? /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif

All thoughts are operating on theory that landowners will cooperate and that's simply not going to happen. No one can force access...if someone owns 200 acres of timber and allows no hunting theres not a doggone thing anyone can do about it.

I see it everyday...deer pour out of places like that into crop fields at night but NOTHING in all the proposed changes will have any affect on those situations...nothing!!

Giving NR landowners a tag every year only exacerbates the problem but yet it keeps "popping" up. I have nothing against them and wish no hard feelings but there are very very few NR landowners who allow public (or any) access...and heck...I don't blame them!

I've said all along...you can have all the seasons you want, open a "bazooka" season...whatever, but if there is no access then no deer will be harvested....end of story.

Most of us do more then our part to harvest antlerless deer but allowing public access to our farms or hunting land..."aint gonna happen"....

I'm glad however to see that some farmers who are doing the complaining are indeed giving access to those that need a place to hunt and they themselves can place restrictions such as "earn a buck" on thier own property. I think those ideas need to be encouraged thru organizations like Farm Bureau rather then trying to cram more regulations down our throat. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

I know I know...preaching to the choir here... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif
 
Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

Just like Real Estate is all about "location, location, location" so is deer herd management all about "access, access, access".

More NR --&gt; less access --&gt; more deer. There is no way to get around this slippery slope. If you add more NR tags you get more deer, which is completely contrary to the DNR's reduction goal.
 
Re: Open Meeting/Deer Mangement

Every time this subject comes up I am reminded,,and then have to print once more,,the experience I had up in MI. You could not get a doe permit in my area for yrs. I asked the local biologist every year why. He always said their deer studies showed the pop was not big enough. No crops up there, just twigs. Suddenly, one season, you could buy a doe permit a day. I thot you said the pop was low, I said,,. He told me "Higher", powers had over rode him. Higher powers,,meaning, Insurance,Farm Bureau,etc,,etc.
 
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