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Giant Landowners- Hunters like you?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> How much land is alot is in the EYES of the person. I think hunting 100 acres is alot! I would be excited if I could double my acreage aand that would be 80.
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Exactly! Most hunters can only imagine having any acres of their own to manage. I bought 40 acres last year, I now have a better chance of going out tomorrow and killing a deer than I did a year ago, and I didn't become that much better of a hunter.
They can do whatever they want on their thousands, I am still enjoying managing my 40.
 
Ok this is my last post on this subject.

Bowmaker thanks for your view on the subject, its good fellow outdoorsmans can agree to disagree sometimes.

To be honest I didn't know about the Drury brothers until after I became interested in hunting Iowa. I just knew that Iowa held big bucks and your DNR had done the best job out of all the midwest states in managing its herd. I won't percieve to have any knowledge on why many of you feel like your private land opportunities are decreasing. It would seem like the fact that Iowa has world record bucks and the lowest hunting pressure of all the midwest states would be the crux of the matter. However, that is a seprate matter to the original question.

To stay on subject, I just did a quick look at this Drury site Drury Brothers inwhich they give advice on managing and huning small tracks. So they do make an effort to inform all types of hunters.

Its just a quick flipent comment to say they are not hunters like me because they have more resources. I still share the same drive to track big bucks, the same appreciation of good sunrise, the same drive to improve my land (if I had any) etc, etc, etc. as they do. Because they have more means to do so really make no difference to me, nor should it. Now what the results of that is a totally different issue which bowmaker talked about, but are they hunters like me, sure.

Its hard, if not impossible, to pattern a buck on small tracks. You thank God if you kill a buck of your dreams on such a small property because he could of been anywhere within his 2 sq. mile range that day. One might only have 1 or 2 decent stands on small parcels. But if you pattern him on large tracks of land and kill him at least you can say you put in your time and hard work and you succeeded.

Again, if I had thier means, I would manage the land in simillar fashion and so would most of us. I am not sure if I would turn it into busines as they or similar groups have done, but who knows.
 
Tom you asked:

what kind of bow do you shoot? I don't
What kind of camo do you wear?? mostly army issue
what kind of truck do you drive??? Chevy, are there others?

do you watch sporting events on TV? nascar only

What does that have to do with the fact that "celebrity hunters" are making life for the average hunter more diffecult? They, along with people with much more $$ then you or I, lease or buy land that you and I will never be able to hunt. And what do most of those "hunters" do to manage the deer there? nothing. They hunt for the monsters and that is it. And no you can't hunt it for does, so don't bother asking.
I have never bought a hunting video, nor will I. I will not support the very people that IMO are making it harder for future hunters to enjoy the sport.
IMO buying hunting video's is alot like buying heroine from afganistan. You might like the product, but were is the $$ going and what is it supporting?

I know, I know, it's harsh. What can I say? to me it's a black and white world.
 
I've now avoided this thread for a day now and I know I should stay away but I cannot stop myself.

First of all...I'd say that myself and the people who have been openly mentioned have at least one thing in common,..we absolutely love hunting whitetailed deer. Does that make them hunters like me? I don't know,...heck I'd lean towards saying, similar to me but they're likely "better"..for they have to opportunity to do it more than I and with time spent comes knowledge and ability.

Now I do indeed realize that I am kind of an outsider looking in with regards to this topic. I own only the 20 acres my house sits on. I don't hunt it though I have deer here but I do indeed have an awful lot of access to good pieces of private property. However, that access is handshake permission granted from people I call friends. I am sure I could in a single day be granted access to a few thousand more acres with a couple knocks on doors but I've come to the realization that a guy can only become intimately familiar with so much land and I'm also a guy who doesn't like to step on others toes if I know they have permission to hunt a property. Seeing as how all of the property I have access to is also accessed by many others I try tell myself that maybe karma will come around and some of those guys will stop hunting where they know I've hunted for yrs before them. It hasn't so far and may never do so but all a guy can do is try to do what he feels is best.

I guess I am straying from the topic a bit so I'll try steer back on course. Like sligh...I'd own 2000 acres in 2 seconds if I could as well. I'll also admit I'm a tad jealous of those that do...but with that jealousy comes no hard feelings. Like I said, I'd be that person in a heartbeat if I could. The fact that the property is there takes nothing away from them as hunters in my eyes. Obviously they all have the same passion as us or they wouldn't be doing it. Would I want to be one of these people??? Not sure.....whitetails 24-7....could be a hoot.......public scrutiny all the time.....would surely be a pain.

To spin a bit of a subtopic of this thread...I for one am sick to death of "management". I'm not trying to point a finger at anyone and I respect everyone's take on the situation but it seems that management is becoming as big of a deal as actually hunting. We as hunters just go hunt mule deer, elk, moose, bears, turkeys, ducks, geese, pheasants, pronhorn and so on..yet with whitetails it's manage this and manage that. What happened to just hunting? If I were able to achieve that dream of owning 2000 acres I wouldn't change my tactics, I'd manage the way I do now..try kill one deer a yr that will make me happy. I am not convinced that management is necessary in the midwest, you have the genetics, the food and so on. It does feel good to do what we see as beneficial to the animals we love to hunt but the management craze has largely been pushed by advertizing and there are indeed many folks benefitting financially from it.

Disclaimer: no offense to anyone who manages their land. Some of my favorite posts are Paul's plot posts. Heck if I had land I'd have 10 acres of standing field peas left behind come mid November and I'd be there..trying to lay the smackdown on one of the many bucks that's be hammering it much like the standing bean fields I see on Wild t.v. (Canada's hunting channel) I'd also have another 80 acres of them left behind for the winter. It'd feel good knowing the deer were healthy but even better knowing there'd be bucketload of sheds on it.

Anyways...I'm rambling all over the place b/c I could write a novel on this thread. I don't believe with 2000+ acres in a prime location you need to "manage" the deer. I also know I'd take 2000 acres in a second. I am not sure if hunters that have it are like me..like I said, we're similar in our passion for whitetails. I'm likely 1000 words into this and basically I've come to this conclusion. Like many things in life this is not something I should worry about. I'm 33 yrs old, I can wish for the day to come where I have a bunch of good whitetail land, I can wish I made a living hunting whitetails, I can wish many things, but I am indeed less of a silly heart and dreamer than I once was. Realistically I'm quite likely to work 21 more yrs as a school teacher until I retire. I'll raise my 2 boys to the best of my ability, hopefully passing to them a love for hunting whitetails and will make sure never to make the people I love take a backseat to whitetailed deer. I'll also likely spend the rest of my days doing what I do now, hunting properties belonging to friends despite having a dream of owning my own piece. I'll spend countless hrs trying to locate and pattern certain deer. I'll spend the entirety of rifle season hoping someone I don't know doesn't whack one of the bucks that I have become intimately familiar with and have high hopes for. I'll spend the better part of January, February and March looking for sheds with the boys when they're not busy with sports etc. I'll be thankful for each opportunity that I have, whether it is seeing another sunset, picking up a beautiful shed, developing lifelong friendships with landowners, or taking a trophy whitetail. I've come to understand that it does us no good to worry about what we don't have nor should we worry about what others do. We should all be happy with what we do have for it is indeed a fact there are other hunters out there with opportunity that pales in comparison to all of us.
 
Man if I had 1,000 acres I'd be happy to be able to just pick up sheds every year. Just think, you and your dog walking around on weekends for 2-3 months just taking mother nature in with no bother from other people, mmmm. Shooting a buck a bonus, but not a necessity. Heck even if you didn't kill it you would still have a great opportunity to find his rack.
By the time I was finished selling all my organs to get the down payment I wouldn't even be able to walk around and enjoy it. I would have to work more than I do now to make the payments, let alone get the time off to hunt it.
I'm with Bowmaker and Bonker on this one. I was hunting quite a while before someone made a video and told me how to do it better...all for $19.95
 
One last thing.

I find it funny that a grown man would buy something b/c a celebrity endorsed it.
 
I agree with saskguy,im just happy to be hunting!i am thankfull for the few spots of private ground im able to hunt, some 80 acres, some 200. i couldnt imagine getting to hunt 1000 or 2000 acres.guys like me have a bigger chance at being busted by a Booner, than the guy on 2000 acres but you know what?i put in just as much time and effort than they do , you just learn to adapt and hunt smarter, change things up and play the wind the best you can.I can tell you this, ( my opinion only) i may not arrow a 170 every yr , but if and when i do, i feel it will be more rewarding because of the smaller parcel of land im hunting which i beleive , makes it alot tougher to do.I see alot of big bucks, passed them up wishing now i hadnt, but they lived to see another day. this yr i passed on a few 140s with my bow and one bigger, and i still have my bow tag to fill, and late muzzy. the next three days brings on a whole new meaning to management, i may or maynot fill out but, my hunts will be as rewarding as the fellow sportsmen that did.My dad says i wait to long, and i should take somthing early, ( DONT ALWAYS WAIT ON THE BIG ONE) but right now , that may be my best management tool.im just thankfull for the opportunity to hunt and i see so many neat things while doing so.those Bucks are getting bigger and so is my memmory scrapbook, with pics to go with it as i never go to my stand without my ipec video cam.My freezer maynot be the fullest, but my memmories are mounting.when you come home at night, ask yourself, did you enjoy yourself?owning 2,000 acres doesnt mean alot because your only hunting the five around you while your there,who knows what happened on the other 1,995!it doesnt matter if you hunt 100 or 10,000 acres, just enjoy doing what we all love and be the best you can be at it. isnt that satisfying enough?Happy hunting.
respectfully,ibowbigbucks
 
ok, truthfully I have watched this thread for a few days and can’t keep from commenting. Me and my two partners own a little over 1000 acres of prime deer habitat. We make payments on this ground, none of it was given to us or inherited, none of us grew up rich. We all had to work hard to get where we are at to be able to try to make a thing like this go. All of us worked and continue to work to pay the bills and take care of our families.

Is it any easier to kill a booner deer because we own land, I really doubt it, I don’t kill any more big deer now then when I didn’t own any land. My passion is still the same but now all the work going into killing one has easily tripled. Do I see a few more deer? yes, do we have a lot better quality of deer? yes, but just because you own some ground doesn’t mean there are 180 inch deer behind every tree.
Have you ever thought of all the work that really goes into owning and maintaining a large piece of ground? I once heard a farmer / neighbor of ours say that he didn’t want to buy anymore land because he didn’t want to buy anymore work. How true that really is.
Then the problems start to change as well...now maybe you have a few deer that you want to make it through, but what about trespassers, road hunters, poachers, how do you keep everyone out when you’re not standing there watching it.(see trespassing thread) Who do I let hunt and who doesn’t get to hunt my property. How the heck am I going to pay for taxes, farm payments, machinery/equipment, and other improvement costs for the property ?
Then the next problem we now have is outfitters selling hunts on three sides of us...all to make a dollar off of our hard work, how do you deal with that. Then last but not least all of sudden the deer start liking your property more because of all the habitat work, sanctuaries, food plots, etc and then people see too many deer on your property and no longer on there’s. What do you say to these folks....you might say...If you don’t chase them with trucks every day maybe the deer would stay? If you didn’t graze your land down to dirt every year the deer might stay, if you didn’t doze down every tree line every small timber patch, or other piece of habitat / cover you might have more deer. If you didn’t hunt them with army’s of people and run them all off you might have more deer. But you can’t say those things without making the situation worse....all you can do is listen to people complain and walk the other way.
All I could think of for almost twenty years was owning my own deer hunting property..let me tell you I had some lean tough years, but if you want it bad enough and work hard enough anyone can own a piece of ground, it just takes time
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One last thing.

I find it funny that a grown man would buy something b/c a celebrity endorsed it. </div></div>

EXACTLY!!

Forget about hunting, I am troubled that our whole culture is so celebrity oriented. I know celebrity endorsements work or there woudn't be so many companies going that route, but sheesh, I can why someone coined the phrase "sheeple".
 
I will say it's FUNNY when someone spends $3,500/acre on a piece of land because some big name in videoing owned it!!!

I guess to shortly summarize, I love the conservation that goes on at these places. I love that these guys are rewarded for their hard work, management practices, millions spent, major conservation, improvement to land and making a deer hunting paradise.

They are FAR FROM the average hunter. That's OK, I just don't like them trying to say they are hunters just like you, in situations just like you. Mentally they might be like average hunter and their ability BUT the land they hunt is NOT like the average hunter. Their advantage is VAST and their situation is infinately better than the guy trying to manage a 60 acre piece with 10 neighboring land-owners who have the same deer crossing on their land. Compare that to 1,400 acres where you manage pressure, BUILD land for whitetails and manage pressure, keep up as much food as you want and choose what gets shot (awesome BUT not typical!!!)

I even think of my days hunting in Michigan- DEAD SERIOUS- you could hunt a WHOLE LIFETIME there and not see the amount of bucks some big land owner folks see on their standing beans in ONE NIGHT in Iowa. (If I'm knocking anyone with that true comparison- it's MI DNR). BUT please don't tell me you're like everyone else in situations like everyone else!

I did see Tecomate bucks- David Morris explain how he's not a better hunter and was blessed enough to be able to own a gigantic chunk of land and that's why he could manage it and do so well. That's AWESOME he said that. I wish the rest would follow!!!!

**I don't watch many videos at all, not just talking bout them above. Do like WKP, some primos guys, etc. Drury videos are just too cheesy for me (most all the guys on them) and they are generally the ones saying they are in situations just like everyone else. I'm sure they are nice guys but I just can't watch those videos. obviously just my opinion.
 
Thebad, read your post, agree with most of it. I give you props for your land and what you bought. I do know that you can make a 1,000 acres a ton better than an 80, I've seen it too many times, I've seen it 1st hand and I know what I am looking at and talking about there. OBVIOUSLY there isn't a 180 behind every tree, everyone probably knows that who hunts Iowa. I know for a fact I can produce many many many more with 1,000 acres compared with 80 or 200 acres, there's just no question AND in my opinion- no debate there.
I don't think many people are knocking you, I am sure some of your neighbors are jealous though. I give you major credit for what you've done. I'm doing the same, on a smaller scale and have seen a huge difference! You will get what you deserve- great deer and deer hunting. I commmend you.

I still believe you are not in near the same situation as the guy with 100 acres of "average land". Your work, management, earnings, etc has likely put you in a wonderful situation. I know it's still tough work!!!! Congrats to you and I wish you the best on your land!

*If someone with 1,500 acres DIDN'T have a ton better piece of hunting land, bigger bucks, far less pressure, high level of control, amazing hunting- I think many of those guys would find better places for millions upon millions of dollars. If anyone thinks those millions aren't getting you in a wildly better situation, a lot of people are wasting a ton of money for the same hunting they could get by knocking on doors (free)! (again, not knocking buying that land!!! Just not comparable or near the same!)
 
I guess what upsets me is the Drury's have become land wh##e by buying up land, making it a deer haven and turning it for a profit and taking advantage of the 10- whatever it is to buy up more and not having to pay taxes, which takes more ground away from the average hunter to have a place to go. This land will probably not be purchased by a resident, but by a NR, which is fine but takes more and more land from residents.

Not picking on you T$, but like Dor said it is hard for you to be bias. The magazine you work for makes it money off of advertising it places in it. I am a subscriber and enjoy the magazine.

I agree with Bowmaker, but think it all boils down to greed, which has gotten this country in the situation it is in now. Hopefully after this country gets back on it's feet land prices will stable and I can purchase a little piece of heaven. But I will be damned if I buy a chunk for $3000.00 to $4000.00 an ac. because somebody with a name put some food plots on it.
 
Two comments, I swore I would stop, but had to make one more.

I read somewhere that celeberties with big tracks don't manage deer............ HA, seriously, you must be joking. Drury's(since that's who we have brought up a lot) kill a ton of does. I think it would shock you how many they take. Far more than anyone I can think of!

And thebad, you are dead on!

Many people complain about the price, me included, but the truth is, you have made HUGE sacrifices to own your land, and many of the people who complain can't understand giving up everything else to have a huge section of ground, or a small on for that matter. Everyone wants what the other guys has, but won't do what it takes to get it! You did, so listen to people complain, and then go sit and relax in the peaceful area you busted hump to get!!! Amen to you my friend! I pray and work to be there someday!

I hear it all the time, I wish I had. I hear how can you afford? Guess what guys, it is called sacrifice, whether you punch a clock, own a business, or do whatever you do, if you want it bad enough, you'll get it. Step up and make it happen. Or sit and dream.

Dreams happen at night boys, Hard work and sacrifices are what bring those dreams into the daylight!

Here is another guy I respect a ton, Bill Winke. He is a celebrity hunter, hell he is a star on this site! No one is complaing about his huge tracks of land, or his show or his articles. No one complains about his huge beautiful house. Why, just cause people here know him? Cause he is a good guy? He is a celebrity just like the others mentioned. I respect the hell out of him for making it happen! Keep it up Bill!

How about the owner of this site. He sacrificed to have this site, and is now finally after many years reaping some rewards from it. Not long ago people complained about the advertising here, and have now let that go. But you all still come here, you keep the post counts up, and more advertisers join.

So don't be cowards, call it for what it is. Whether you know it our not, your daily hits and posts on this site are generating some income for a "celebrity". And Chris I respect you for it and love it! Keep up the good work! YOU HAVE EARNED IT. LIKE MANY OTHERS, You sacrificed yesterday to be rewarded tomorrow. I commend you!!!!!!!!!
 
my opinion will remain the same regardless of my profession. that is a weak arguement and an unfair blanket statement about me, i dont appreciate it at all! turn the tables and all of your opinions are biased as well because you are outside looking in.

oh, and the drury's turning their land around for profit!

thats called business

since you all have spirited opinions on this matter, enlighten me as to how you think the industry should exist.....

should everything be free????
should land ownership be capped at 150 acres??
should professional hunters be restricted on antler size so all of you can feel better about yourselves?

help me out here, cause all im seeing is finger pointing and accusations to greed, but in reality it seems like envy to me
 
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">since you all have spirited opinions on this matter, enlighten me as to how you think the industry should exist..... </div></div>

Thomas - Who are you addressing? It sounds like everyone who doesn't line up with you 100%. Could you clarify who you are intending to reply?

I don't remember where anyone said everything should be free or that there should be a cap on land ownership, etc. The gist of this post, at the start, as I see it is...are the people that own large amounts of land the same as a hunter that doesn't?

IMO, while the large landowners might be fine people and "regular guys" in terms of their personality they do enjoy an advantage in terms of controlling access to large sections of land. That's not right or wrong IMO, it is just a fact. I do not begrudge anyone owning land for hunting, heck, I own land for hunting.

That I am a small landowner myself I know that I enjoy an advantage over someone who may share an even smaller timber with one or more other hunters, etc. If I controlled a section of land that was roughly equal to a buck's normal home range and then could enhance it via foodplots, limited intrusions, etc, then I would have a bigger advantage yet and it would be far easier, but still not easy, to kill mega bucks.

IMO, this thread then morphed into a discussion of celebrities, supporting the "industry" and whatnot, at least in part due to your replies.

To answer your question, I think people should be free to buy land, sell land, make videos, sell them, buy the gear that they want/need, etc. More power to anyone who can legally support themselves via promoting hunting, etc, it is just my choice though not to "buy in" to the whole hunting celebrity thing and I choose not to be influenced by someone "famous" telling me which widget I "need", etc. (Maybe I am self deluded and have fallen under the powers of the celebrity endorsers and I don't know it yet, but I purpose to make informed choices about what I buy and do not allow myself to be influenced by "stars". It does concern me too that so many people in our culture are so influenced by so called celebrities too, so that is a bias of mine. People, think for yourselves.., I often think.)

Lastly, Thomas, I think there is a tone to some of your replies that seems to indicate that your views are superior to others who happen not to agree with you. A case in point... <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">should professional hunters be restricted on antler size so all of you can feel better about yourselves? </div></div> What response did anyone give that caused you to have to say that?

I have noticed that you are quick to reply to a post where someone does not agree with you and then there is often what I perceive as a swipe or two embedded within. (If my perception is not accurate, then I am sincerely sorry, but if the shoe fits...then kindly adjust a bit.) It is OK for people to disagree and have legitimately different opinions.
 
strong statements there Daver, a PM probably would have been best huh?


im not going to back through this post and copy paste then quote each statement that motivated me to say what i said.

you misunderstood my statements, but im not going to bother clarifying, as we will not agree.

thanks for the public correction
im dundo with this thread
 
Sligh,

I it had seemed from your post that you were lumping all giant land owners in with the Drurys, but after your reply to Thebad, I see differently. Personally I have found it hard sometimes to convey actually what I am thinking into writing. I personally have never seen a Drury video, and if they indeed produce more cheese than Kraft Foods then I am with you on this one.

Here's and idea though. Maybe one of you who know the Drurys can get us on the land and after we all have taken a monster buck, maybe then we can see if we are like them or not. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif
 
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