HF716/necked cartridge update
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Fishbonker
Life Member
aimfirst said: ↑
snicker every time I read a Fishbonker post.
I took it as he rewards himself with a candy bar just for making it through one of your posts!
I dunno, I think most folks who reward themselves after making it through a 'Bonker post do it with a good bourbon but you could be right.
Senator Chris Cournoyer
Member
All, Senator Chris Cournoyer here - I spoke to Matt this afternoon briefly and gave him an update on where we are with HF 716 in the Senate. I appreciate those of you that have posted on this thread and those of you who have respectfully emailed me on the issue. I told Matt I would log in this evening and give you an update.
As you know, the bill passed the House on a bi-partisan vote without much fanfare. After that, the NRA sent out an email to members with the information, which must have struck some nerves, because we have been receiving a lot of emails on it all week since that happened. I appreciate your willingness to respectfully email members of the Senate Natural Resources Committee - Chaired by Senator Ken Rozenboom, a man that I admire and respect very much. He is an ethical man that takes his job as the Chair of Natural Resources very seriously and I appreciate his willingness to listen carefully to all sides before moving too quickly on this, or any other, bill that affects Iowa's Natural Resources and the Environment.
The Bill came in this week and Senator Rozenboom assigned it to me to be the Chair of the Sub-Committee. It is now up to me to schedule that sub-committee of 3 Senators that would consist of me, Senator Shipley (Republican) and Senator Celsi (a Democrat and member of Moms Demand Action and staunch anti-gun person, in fact I wouldn't bother trying to educate her on anything related to firearms because she has no idea what you would be talking about, nor does she listen to facts or reason. She only reacts to emotion and seeks to create hysteria). I spoke to Senator Shipley and Senator Rozenboom this afternoon before leaving and we are all well aware of the concerns about this bill and we are not willing to move anything too quickly that would make for bad policy for Iowa, the deer population, safety, fair chase, and growing our numbers of hunters.
With that said, next Friday will be the end of the second "funnel", meaning that any bill that doesn't make it through the funnel will not be considered this year. In order to get this bill through the funnel next week, we would need to hold a sub-committee that has 24 hours public notice (which hasn't happened yet because that is up to me). The earliest that could now happen would be Tuesday. At the sub-committee, which is open to the public, anyone who would want to speak for or against the bill would have the opportunity to do so. That includes any groups that have registered for, against or neutral/monitoring on the bill. So far this week, I have spoken to reps from the DNR, National Wild Turkey Federation, Iowa Firearms Coalition and the NRA ILA. I also spoke to Matt from this forum today. I intend to speak to other firearms experts, hunters and conservationists over the weekend to better understand the issue. I have also met with Rep. Windschitl twice this week to learn more about how the bill was run through the House.
I have come to understand that this bill seeks to ensure that the DNR Commission has language that is up-to-date and consistent with BATFE (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives). It then went on to clarify barrel length, caliber range and minimum muzzle energy. Beyond that, it seeks to address issues that have come up since we made changes 2 years ago that allowed parents to take their minor children shooting; which included kids hunting with pistols and revolvers. The final provision gives guidance to future bills that could address rules for rifles, requiring them to conform to the guidelines stated in this bill.
The additional items seem to have altered the original intent of the bill, which I think is to gain uniformity in standards and clarify / update Iowa Code so it is consistent with definitions and standards adopted by BATFE.
One option would be to amend out the other parts to get to the original point of the bill, which I would be willing to do. Another option would be to table the bill for this year to learn more over the interim so we fully understand the impact on hunting, the herd/biological and safety.
I would encourage you to continue to email us, and your energies would be best focused on the Natural Resources sub-committee (Myself, Senator Shipley, Senator Celsi and the chair of Natural Resources, Senator Rozenboom) . Those emails can be found here: https://www.legis.iowa.gov/committees/committee?ga=88&groupID=699
Even if we decide to hold a sub-committee meeting next week, does not mean we will move the bill, it could just be a way to get everyone in a room together and hear from the various stakeholders interested in the bill to learn more about it, so there would be no need to panic. If that happens, I would be sure to post here the day, time and location so your members could attend or send emails that we could read outloud at the meeting.
Sorry for the length of this post, but I wanted to try to explain exactly where we are in the process. I have only been a Senator for 11 weeks now, so this is new to me, but I have learned quickly and understand that we need to be educated in order to make the best policy for Iowa. Most bills that go through this process can take up to 5 years to work on before we get them right, and even then some are far from perfect Its much easier to get the bill right in the beginning than to go back and fix it later.
Thanks again, Chris
My name is Senator Chris Cournoyer and I have been assigned the chair of the Senate Sub-committee for HF716. We will not act on this bill this week as we are still learning more about it. If you would like to send me information, please email me at: Chris.Cournoyer@legis.iowa.gov. I would like to hear from you. Thanks -
As you know, the bill passed the House on a bi-partisan vote without much fanfare. After that, the NRA sent out an email to members with the information, which must have struck some nerves, because we have been receiving a lot of emails on it all week since that happened. I appreciate your willingness to respectfully email members of the Senate Natural Resources Committee - Chaired by Senator Ken Rozenboom, a man that I admire and respect very much. He is an ethical man that takes his job as the Chair of Natural Resources very seriously and I appreciate his willingness to listen carefully to all sides before moving too quickly on this, or any other, bill that affects Iowa's Natural Resources and the Environment.
The Bill came in this week and Senator Rozenboom assigned it to me to be the Chair of the Sub-Committee. It is now up to me to schedule that sub-committee of 3 Senators that would consist of me, Senator Shipley (Republican) and Senator Celsi (a Democrat and member of Moms Demand Action and staunch anti-gun person, in fact I wouldn't bother trying to educate her on anything related to firearms because she has no idea what you would be talking about, nor does she listen to facts or reason. She only reacts to emotion and seeks to create hysteria). I spoke to Senator Shipley and Senator Rozenboom this afternoon before leaving and we are all well aware of the concerns about this bill and we are not willing to move anything too quickly that would make for bad policy for Iowa, the deer population, safety, fair chase, and growing our numbers of hunters.
With that said, next Friday will be the end of the second "funnel", meaning that any bill that doesn't make it through the funnel will not be considered this year. In order to get this bill through the funnel next week, we would need to hold a sub-committee that has 24 hours public notice (which hasn't happened yet because that is up to me). The earliest that could now happen would be Tuesday. At the sub-committee, which is open to the public, anyone who would want to speak for or against the bill would have the opportunity to do so. That includes any groups that have registered for, against or neutral/monitoring on the bill. So far this week, I have spoken to reps from the DNR, National Wild Turkey Federation, Iowa Firearms Coalition and the NRA ILA. I also spoke to Matt from this forum today. I intend to speak to other firearms experts, hunters and conservationists over the weekend to better understand the issue. I have also met with Rep. Windschitl twice this week to learn more about how the bill was run through the House.
I have come to understand that this bill seeks to ensure that the DNR Commission has language that is up-to-date and consistent with BATFE (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives). It then went on to clarify barrel length, caliber range and minimum muzzle energy. Beyond that, it seeks to address issues that have come up since we made changes 2 years ago that allowed parents to take their minor children shooting; which included kids hunting with pistols and revolvers. The final provision gives guidance to future bills that could address rules for rifles, requiring them to conform to the guidelines stated in this bill.
The additional items seem to have altered the original intent of the bill, which I think is to gain uniformity in standards and clarify / update Iowa Code so it is consistent with definitions and standards adopted by BATFE.
One option would be to amend out the other parts to get to the original point of the bill, which I would be willing to do. Another option would be to table the bill for this year to learn more over the interim so we fully understand the impact on hunting, the herd/biological and safety.
I would encourage you to continue to email us, and your energies would be best focused on the Natural Resources sub-committee (Myself, Senator Shipley, Senator Celsi and the chair of Natural Resources, Senator Rozenboom) . Those emails can be found here: https://www.legis.iowa.gov/committees/committee?ga=88&groupID=699
Even if we decide to hold a sub-committee meeting next week, does not mean we will move the bill, it could just be a way to get everyone in a room together and hear from the various stakeholders interested in the bill to learn more about it, so there would be no need to panic. If that happens, I would be sure to post here the day, time and location so your members could attend or send emails that we could read outloud at the meeting.
Sorry for the length of this post, but I wanted to try to explain exactly where we are in the process. I have only been a Senator for 11 weeks now, so this is new to me, but I have learned quickly and understand that we need to be educated in order to make the best policy for Iowa. Most bills that go through this process can take up to 5 years to work on before we get them right, and even then some are far from perfect
Its much easier to get the bill right in the beginning than to go back and fix it later.Thanks again, Chris
My name is Senator Chris Cournoyer and I have been assigned the chair of the Senate Sub-committee for HF716. We will not act on this bill this week as we are still learning more about it. If you would like to send me information, please email me at: Chris.Cournoyer@legis.iowa.gov. I would like to hear from you. Thanks -
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
Wow, thank you very much for the detailed reply! We appreciate what you’re doing for us and the IA hunters. I’d say to sum up my concerns, and this groups, is this bill has removed the case length limits that were previously written. We believe it is intentionally done to begin opening rifle calibers other than pistol / straight wall cartridge calibers. And we stand firmly against that. Thank you again for taking the time to respond and listen to us.
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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
EastIowaHunt
New Member
Senator Cournoyer, thanks for the detailed explanation and for your support on HF716. This is not a sneaky attempt to redraw some wild lines in our laws, it is needed and should be a non-controversial fix to some overreach from the NRC and at the benefit of expanding hunting to more people. Your work with high school trap teams and record on 2A issues is noteworthy and you'll be an asset to hunters as well as soon as this bill is passed.
I look forward to your support of HF716 and continued success alongside NRA/IFC to benefit Iowans.
Thanks!
If that was the case, then why didn't the bill simply contain the first part as outlined by Senator Cournoyer? That likely would have passed without issue. The "additional" items in the bill are what is being hotly debated. Those items were 100% an attempt to redraw lines and move the needle closer to HPR's.
bigbuckhunter88
PMA Member
Soooooo, eliminating the case length was needed?
The people for this would have a slam dunk if they didnt try bundling so many things in one bill to try to hide the real agenda. I'd support the pistol things and 99 percent of any of 2A issues, but don't try to hide the intentions
Boonervilleusa
Well-Known Member
Some positive news this morning. of the three subcommittee members, I figured Claire Celsi would be the toughest nut to crack...but she emailed me a few minutes ago...this was her response.
Jordan:
I am one of the three Senators who will be on the subcommittee for this bill. I plan to vote no in the subcommittee, in the full committee and on the Senate floor. I have heard from dozens of hunters just like you who are very upset about this bill.
I would concentrate on contacting Senator Shipley and Senator Cournoyer - they are the two others on the subcommittee with me. If you could spread the word with your friends and have everyone email and call them this weekend.
Chris.cournoyer@legis.iowa.gov
Tom.Shipley@legis.iowa.gov
Chris Cournoyer: 563-505-6703
Tom Shipley: 712-785-3583
Thanks,
Senator Claire Celsi
Jordan:
I am one of the three Senators who will be on the subcommittee for this bill. I plan to vote no in the subcommittee, in the full committee and on the Senate floor. I have heard from dozens of hunters just like you who are very upset about this bill.
I would concentrate on contacting Senator Shipley and Senator Cournoyer - they are the two others on the subcommittee with me. If you could spread the word with your friends and have everyone email and call them this weekend.
Chris.cournoyer@legis.iowa.gov
Tom.Shipley@legis.iowa.gov
Chris Cournoyer: 563-505-6703
Tom Shipley: 712-785-3583
Thanks,
Senator Claire Celsi
Last edited:
Ishi
PMA Member
Here we go again
Celsi is a Dem. They are all pretty much against this..... maybe not for the same reasons as us, but that has been the Dem party line on this.
gunrunr
Life Member
Are you admitting this is an intentional bill and not an oversight that is designed to allow all rifle cartridges from .35 to .50 caliber?
- including large long-range rounds like .375 UltraMag, .416 Barrett & 50 BMG and that you indeed do wish to make those cartridges legal for Iowa Deer Hunting?
The .50 BMG is a .510" caliber round
Come on fellas...let the HF716 supporters voice their opinion all they want...thankfully SOME of them were forthright and honest as to what they wanted the end result to be...
To the guys who originated this HF716 bill, and support it...the ends justify the means...this is a Gateway bill to a full blown rifle season in Iowa.
Come on fellas...let the HF716 supporters voice their opinion all they want...thankfully SOME of them were forthright and honest as to what they wanted the end result to be...
To the guys who originated this HF716 bill, and support it...the ends justify the means...this is a Gateway bill to a full blown rifle season in Iowa.
That is why it is very important to keep this a natural resource issue, not a gun issue. A vote against HF716 is not a vote against guns. It is a vote FOR conservation. That needs to be the narrative.
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JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
The conservation point was central in my email to the Resource Committee.
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aimfirst
Member
this is spot on in my opinion (along with what mplane72 said). So many issues are "binary" issues these days and voting against this will be viewed as a vote against guns and may be tough to swallow for some R's. If the legislator reading the bill reads it through the lense of a 2a/freedom issue vs. conservation issue will determine their vote.
I'll admit I am not a gun expert after reading some of the detail some of you have offered up here....I thought I knew guns/calibers but after reading I think maybe I am a 6 or 7 on a 1-10. I was struggling understanding how the wording in the bill would firm up the pistol wording, but when I read the bill https://legiscan.com/IA/text/HF716/2019 it sure seems deliberate with the wording changes/additions where it states "straight wall or other ammunition" and where straight wall is struck out on the second page several times to make it read like any cartridges are now legal. Maybe you all caught that the first time, but it seems very obvious after rereading.