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Whose Animal

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chrislm34

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A somewhat hypothetical question.... you shoot a monster deer. Bad circumstances cause a bad shot and the deer is wounded and not recovered. Several days later another hunter comes upon the deer, not dead, but incapacitated as in it is too sick to run off. The other hunter puts it out of its misery.

Who is considered the hunter who 'harvested' the deer and who should lay claim to the animal?

I don't want to start a debate about the importance of "who" shot the deer as I do realize the hunt is more than that. I am just curious on everyone's opinion.
 
Not sure, but 1st blood will win out most of the time. Not saying I believe in that rule for every situation, but I know of more than 1 case in court that was decided that way.
 
in the case of several days passing as opposed to the same day, legally (if that word even applies here)--I'd be more inclined to think the second guy would get it.... but, I don't know..

If I was the second guy, I'd put the animal down for sure and happily give it to the initial shooter. But we all know not everyone operates that way.
 
IMO it is the 2nd hunter's deer. If he wants to claim it as his, then it is his. If he wants to let you know and give it to you to tag, that is his choice. Once the 2nd hunter shoots that deer he is obligated to tag it if you don't want to. After all, he made the lethal shot, not you. In a none shotgun season scenario I would say the 2nd hunter has to tag it if you are going by the books, since there is no party hunting allowed(although I wouldn't have a problem if someone did do this during bow/muzzy season since it is the ethical thing to do for the suffering animal)......... If you don't want to be obligated to tag a wounded deer that another hunter shot, you better not shoot it.
 
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I will add some more context.... this is not a hypothetical, but a real life situation. The animal was not a deer, but a bear and it just happened to me. While there is not a debate as to who gets the bear as we are family members and the right thing will be done. I just don't want to lay claim to an animal that I may or may not have harvested. Both hunters did have a tag in this situation.

Interesting responses.
 
My vote goes to hunter #2. If you stick a deer Oct 6 and don't recover it and it makes all the way until Jan 8 before some one else puts it down, would it even be a question as to who owns it? And if that's the case the real issue is time and not the order of shooting. How much time should pass before a shooter relinquishes responsibility/ownership? The law says if you shoot an animal you must make EVERY reasonable effort to recover it. That raises the question: if you shoot an antlered deer and can not find it, do you continue to hunt or do you consider your season over? Since this is not the original question/thread topic I will pose this question on its own.
 
Unfortunately in a case like this if it is during any season not allowing party hunting it would be illegal for hunter #2 to allow Hunter #1 to tag the deer, no matter how any one feels about it. During bow season, early ML season, and late ML season you MUST shoot and tag your own deer. I am not sure what every one feels is the right thing to do but my vote would still be for hunter #2 because other wise this animal would have gone to waste laying in the woods, and quite possibly hunter #1 would have moved on after no recovery and killed and tagged another animal. Even if that didn't happen in this case I would still vote for #2.
 
Considering the responses and where they land, it just proves to me why I am so conflicted. Here is how it went down. I was the shooter. Took a quartering to shot as the bear knew something was up. Skipped off the shoulder and gut punched him. I backed out and the next day we bumped him. I had to leave as it happened the last day of the hunt. My uncle lives up there and was told a sick bear was in the river. This was 2 days after I initially shot it. He walked up to within 15 yards of the bear and it could hardly move. He shot the bear and tagged it with his own tag.

This was the first bear I have ever seen or shot....needless to say I was very disappointed. That disappointment turned to joy but interal conflict after the bear was recovered. I was happy the bear was recovered and put out of his misery. But I am conflicted to whether I get some type of taxidermiy and claim the bear as my first when I didn't finish the deal and it was alive two days later.

Not sure what to do.
 
Second guy gets it.. or thats what happened last year during shotgun season, first blood didnt matter as long as second guy does nothing illegal, then its just up to the persons ethics..
 
chrislm34 said:
Considering the responses and where they land, it just proves to me why I am so conflicted. Here is how it went down. I was the shooter. Took a quartering to shot as the bear knew something was up. Skipped off the shoulder and gut punched him. I backed out and the next day we bumped him. I had to leave as it happened the last day of the hunt. My uncle lives up there and was told a sick bear was in the river. This was 2 days after I initially shot it. He walked up to within 15 yards of the bear and it could hardly move. He shot the bear and tagged it with his own tag.

This was the first bear I have ever seen or shot....needless to say I was very disappointed. That disappointment turned to joy but interal conflict after the bear was recovered. I was happy the bear was recovered and put out of his misery. But I am conflicted to whether I get some type of taxidermiy and claim the bear as my first when I didn't finish the deal and it was alive two days later.

Not sure what to do.
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I would say that is your call. Technically it is your uncle's kill but if you want to get it mounted and tell the story, i dont see anything wrong with that. Sounds to me you will probably have another opportunity to bear hunt again(considering your uncle lives "up there")so I would probably wait if I were you. You will make a good clean kill the next time and feel much better about it. If you dont think you will ever bear hunt again, then I would go ahead and take it to the taxi.
 
gundog870 said:
I for one wouldnt want it. But thats just my thought.
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Unfortunately, this is kind of what I feel also. It just seems kind of stupid to let a pretty damn cool animal go to waste because of how the harvest concluded.

I don't want to debate others opinions, because I asked for them, but....

For those saying it is the 2nd guys killl... if you were the 2nd guy, would you really feel any accomplishment from shooting an animal that was basically dead? I am guessing no.

I guess this is just a bad deal. I just struggle with claiming the bear, but I also struggle with just tossing it out also. seems like a big waste and doesn't sit well.

My worst experience hunting as I have never had to deal with this before.
 
I belive its the person who drew first blood. Or if i was hunting with a friend and I shoot a deer that doest get recovered, then the next yr my friend shoota the deer, then it would be his. But within the same year or season, i belive its first blood
 
So, it sounds like your uncle does not want the skin and skull for himself? If that is the case I would claim them.

On one hand, one year I was tracking a gut shot buck for a guy. I jumped him, but was able to get an arrow in him to put him down. The guy that originally shot him was very happy to be able to finally get his tag on him.

But on the other hand, another guy shot an old buck high in the shoulder with a mloader. I helped him track untill we lost blood. Well, he went right back out and shot another buck that afternoon, not cool. Two days later I saw the buck, put a stalk on him and shot him with my bow. I had no problem putting my tag on him.

In your case, definately your bear.
 
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I would say 1st guys deer without a doubt, if he had not made the shot bad/good, the 2nd guy would not have come upon it. IMO it would be like a guy hitting a monster with his vehicle, then telling his buddies he shot it, kind of douche. Stuff like this happens among the shotgun community a lot, and has personally happened to me and it sucks. I understand if you are on public odds of finding out whose it is, is dang near impossible. Under those circumstances I would call a game warden and get a salvage tag. If later down the road you found out whose it was, I'd gladly give it to them. But we all know there aren't too many good people left out there. If you're bow hunting and you share the farm or you own farm, odds are good you know whose bow hunting with you or around you, (neighbors, friends, other hunters, etc.) and you could easily find out whose buck it is. I'm a firm believer in Karma, you will get whats coming to you 10x around whether that's bad or good.
 
With your situation with the bear. If the bear was in a position that it could not move, it was going to die therefore making your shot a killshot. A couple scenarios: 1. You shoot the bear just as you described. It WAS NOT you last day and you searched for two days and finally found it in the river (where it was likely going to die anyway). You'd be super excited about having the bear in this circumstance right?
2. You shoot the bear. Again, not on your last day. You and your uncle are both searching for it. After two days, you are looking for it in one place and your uncle is looking in another. He walks up on it and sees that it clearly needs put out of misery and so shoots it then comes and tells you he found it and put it down. You'd still be happy with it in this scenario right? I would be. However, with your situation of not being there makes it difficult but I still see it as being your bear. It would still be alive had it not been for your initial shot.
 
How does your uncle feel about it? If he doesn't want the skull and hide, then he could just give it to you. If he does want it, I would just let him have it and politely ask him to invite you again next year. No reason to spoil a relationship over a bear or deer or anything else for that matter.
 
As my uncle said...I scored the touchdown, he just kicked the extra point. He really wanted to see me get a bear and he believes I did. I guess maybe I am just caught up in what others think instead of whether this was important to me. I appreciat everyones opinion but lyons post really resonates with me. He is right, I think what is tripping me up is the fact I wasn't there. In my heart I think I harvested my first black bear. Maybe not the perfect hunt but I got to experience a moment few get to.

I still appreciate more feedback... it is an interesting topic.
 
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