LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
The Dbltree rye mix contains rye, oats, peas, radishes, and clover. You plant those all in the same plot, do not plant them seprately. I think that answers your question?
streitl
Member
From the picture of my plot, you can see I "ringed" my plot this year with the brassica mix (purple top turnips, groundhog forage radish, dwarf essex rape). On the interior, I planted the cereal mix (oats, forage rye, winter peas, clover). Next year, I will plant the cereal mix around the outside and the brassica mix in the interior. This is about a 3 acre field.
This is the plot I did the year before. The side of the plot closest to the camera is the brassica mix, and the further away was the cereal mix. This was about a 2 acre field.
I converted this into the Dbltree mix from grass hay. It wasn't easy, but even with the single gang disc and UTV, I got the job done.
This is the plot I did the year before. The side of the plot closest to the camera is the brassica mix, and the further away was the cereal mix. This was about a 2 acre field.
I converted this into the Dbltree mix from grass hay. It wasn't easy, but even with the single gang disc and UTV, I got the job done.
StickersNKickers
Camo Up!
If I am not mistaken, you would mix the seeds for each mix (rye mix or brassica mix) and spread all at once, or I suppose do each seed type of each mix separately, but in the same section of the plot. All rye mix seeds in one area, all brassica mix seeds in another. This would be done in whatever configuration you choose (blocks, strips, circles/rings, etc), as long as you are separating the rye mix seeds from the brassica mix seeds (also done at different times of the year). He mentions 10% of the plot in just clover, so I guess I'm seeing 3 different types of sections (blocks, strips, etc.). If someone could draw and post up a diagram showing an example of a plot and year to year changes in what's planted in each section, I think it might help a lot of readers.
On a side note, if you chose to do the checker/chess board configuration (mixes, not each square having a different seed), when the big buck comes into the plot and you get your chance to draw, you could stop him to release your arrow by saying "Checkmate!"
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
Here's a few pictures Paul himself drew up to show some variations of how you can divide a plot up with his mixes and clover and how to rotate them from year to year
The first one is a bit easier with having white clover strips and just two main areas to rotate between the rye mix and the brassicas (e-wheat screen is optional)
The first one is a bit easier with having white clover strips and just two main areas to rotate between the rye mix and the brassicas (e-wheat screen is optional)
Paul Knox said:
StickersNKickers
Camo Up!
Thanks! Ok, so generally, your 10% clover only section will be the same year to year, and then just rotate the rye mix sections and brassica mix sections. I was trying to picture it with rotating the three sections (clover only, rye mix, brassica mix), which was confusing me a little.
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
Yes, exactly right Tim.
Yup, that's right. So as Tim said in the summer (late July, early August) plant the brassicas. Then in the fall (late August, early September) plant the Dbltree rye mix. Then in the spring you can leave the Dbltree rye mix to grow until you till it under in July for the brassicas. But in the spring for the former brassica plot you will want to till that up, early May roughly, and plant some sort of cover crop such as berseem or crimson clover and oats. Then in August you till under your cover crop and plant the Dbltree rye mix. The constant rotations help build the soil and control weeds without having to use herbicides or a bunch of extra fertilizers.
Yup, that's right. So as Tim said in the summer (late July, early August) plant the brassicas. Then in the fall (late August, early September) plant the Dbltree rye mix. Then in the spring you can leave the Dbltree rye mix to grow until you till it under in July for the brassicas. But in the spring for the former brassica plot you will want to till that up, early May roughly, and plant some sort of cover crop such as berseem or crimson clover and oats. Then in August you till under your cover crop and plant the Dbltree rye mix. The constant rotations help build the soil and control weeds without having to use herbicides or a bunch of extra fertilizers.
magnus
PMA Member
And those perennial clover strips around the edges and between sections serve an important function of turnaround areas when planting. It's PAINFUL to us wanna-be farmers to have to have to make turns in our growing brassicas when tilling or even no-tilling into the to-be rye mix areas.....!!!
Daver
PMA Member
Just a comment...if you look closely at aerial photos in certain areas of Iowa you can actually see where people are following Paul's rotation advice. The "strips" usually show up well in these pics because they tend to be taken late in the summer.
Because some crafty trespassers also know how to spot probable food plots from space...I have moved away from easy to see "strips" and while I still use the rotation advice, I now use less recognizable patterns.
I know that sounds crazy, but in this day of information you also have to think about who can tell what...
Because some crafty trespassers also know how to spot probable food plots from space...I have moved away from easy to see "strips" and while I still use the rotation advice, I now use less recognizable patterns.
I know that sounds crazy, but in this day of information you also have to think about who can tell what...
MO-APE
Member
Great leadership by our friend Dbltree helped numerous rookie food plotters get off on the right foot. Like he often shared, cereal grains and specifically cereal/winter rye is the workhorse of the "Dbltree mix" and keeps our valued wildlife fed when most of their native browse is long-gone (acorns) or less nutritious (forbs, buds, woody browse, etc.) and ag fields are stripped bare.
Many people think the crucial times for deer in the Midwest is the heart of winter, December & January. I think deer struggle to find meaningful calories more in Feb & early March before the deer buffet that is Spring blooms.
Here is a snapshot of a first year 1.5 acre hidey-hole timber plot that was planted in 50/50 cereal grains & brassicas. It didn't take long for the brassicas to be wiped out, but the cereal portion of the mix kept deer fed (and coming) all winter & early spring long. This plot is less than 50 yards from a 400 acre bean field, deer walk over the bean stubble to make it to the plot. This plot was planted with an ATV (disc & cultipacker) and a bag seeder planted Labor Day weekend 2014...anyone can do this!
Jan 9th, notice the massive amount of green grains available after a brutally cold winter:
Feb 14th
March 27th, notice how the rye greened back up and is drawing 10-15 deer and 20ish turkeys daily:
Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0> <TBODY> <TR> <TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset">Dbltree seed mix and rotation </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks
Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests
Brassicas in 45% of plot
Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#
Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or crimson and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)
Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot...we use 50# each rye, oats and peas along with radish and clover seed all planted in half of each feeding area
Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 50-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Frostmaster Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre
Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28 but for best results soil test and add only what is necessary.
Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Many people think the crucial times for deer in the Midwest is the heart of winter, December & January. I think deer struggle to find meaningful calories more in Feb & early March before the deer buffet that is Spring blooms.
Here is a snapshot of a first year 1.5 acre hidey-hole timber plot that was planted in 50/50 cereal grains & brassicas. It didn't take long for the brassicas to be wiped out, but the cereal portion of the mix kept deer fed (and coming) all winter & early spring long. This plot is less than 50 yards from a 400 acre bean field, deer walk over the bean stubble to make it to the plot. This plot was planted with an ATV (disc & cultipacker) and a bag seeder planted Labor Day weekend 2014...anyone can do this!
Jan 9th, notice the massive amount of green grains available after a brutally cold winter:
Feb 14th
March 27th, notice how the rye greened back up and is drawing 10-15 deer and 20ish turkeys daily:
Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0> <TBODY> <TR> <TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset">Dbltree seed mix and rotation </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote --><!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0> <TBODY> <TR> <TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset">
Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks
Alice, Kopu II, Durana (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests
Brassicas in 45% of plot
Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#
Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or crimson and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)
Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot...we use 50# each rye, oats and peas along with radish and clover seed all planted in half of each feeding area
Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 50-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Frostmaster Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre
Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28 but for best results soil test and add only what is necessary.
Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
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LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
Excellent post!! Paul is smiling seeing stuff like this!
Jbohn
Well-Known Member
Question, so when I plant my oats and clover following my brassica mix, when I go this year to plant my cereal grains, since I will have oats that I will be tilling under. Do I need to add as much oats to the new plot with seed already there how much would you cut the mix or none ?
MO-APE
Member
Are you planting red clover and oats? I personally would follow Paul's exact seed recipe above (listed as per acre values)...some oats will volunteer but probably not enough to throw the ratios out of balance.
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
Our rye is greening up very quickly and the deer are enjoying it as well. Hope to knock down a couple long beards up here soon before we plant it into beans!
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
How is everyone's rye from last fall looking? Ours is starting to send up seed heads. I think we'll lightly disc this plot in and then plant soybeans in the next few weeks.
As Paul always preached, have diversity in your plots. Next to this rye is a mix of alfalfa and clover that helps provide some great year round food for the wildlife.
As Paul always preached, have diversity in your plots. Next to this rye is a mix of alfalfa and clover that helps provide some great year round food for the wildlife.
MO-APE
Member
One of my rye plots seeded out about three weeks ago and now is about 3.5' tall. I feel bad mowing it off now in case there are some nesters in there.
skyleralan
PMA Member
Mine looks similar, I frost seeded clover into it and need to clip the rye. Will probably let it dry out and mow it down.
LoessHillsArcher
PMA Member
It was time to mow the rye plots in preparation for drilling soy beans. They rye was 5ft tall and providing some good cover for the soil during these heavy rains we've had this spring. I wonder if we could've just drilled into the rye without mowing it or just rolled it vs mowing but we opted to mow. We did make sure to drive the fields very well to chase out any fawns that may be laying in the cover.
The shreaded rye thatch and straw will provide great top cover for the soil and young bean plants and the rye roots will hold moisture for them throughout the growing season. Also notice the clover plots next to the mowed rye fields to provide some food source in each plot while the beans are being planted and getting established. Paul preached how it is important to have a diverse food plot and always have something for the deer to eat.
Plot #1
Plot #2
We like to have our food plots tucked up tight against timber is possible to create for some over hanging licking branches. These make great trail cam spots!
On our farm we always plant rye or wheat in the ag fields as a cover crop... just like Paul preaches in his food plot method. Those cover crops are great stuff! Here is what our wheat looked like this spring after having corn drilled into it. We just had it sprayed so it should be dying down any day
The shreaded rye thatch and straw will provide great top cover for the soil and young bean plants and the rye roots will hold moisture for them throughout the growing season. Also notice the clover plots next to the mowed rye fields to provide some food source in each plot while the beans are being planted and getting established. Paul preached how it is important to have a diverse food plot and always have something for the deer to eat.
Plot #1
Plot #2
We like to have our food plots tucked up tight against timber is possible to create for some over hanging licking branches. These make great trail cam spots!
On our farm we always plant rye or wheat in the ag fields as a cover crop... just like Paul preaches in his food plot method. Those cover crops are great stuff! Here is what our wheat looked like this spring after having corn drilled into it. We just had it sprayed so it should be dying down any day
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