Roundup Ready Corn & Soybean Food Plot

[dbltree]

Being some what of a "food plot junkie" I'm always looking for the edge...the perfect combination that most certainly will draw every deer in the area to MY place

Recently I came across an old idea with a little different twist and that is planting RR corn and soybeans together. I've seen plots where they planted 2 rows of corn, 2 rows of beans but the deer just walked the rows and ate the beans off right to the ground.

Now they are drilling the soys and then row planting corn into the drilled beans. The drilled beans are much thicker of course and serve to help fix N for the corn as well as shade out weeds when hit the second time with RU.
I'm thinking I will give it a shot and broadcast rye in also in early September.

Heck...the deer should be in there so thick, I may have to beat em off with a stick!! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><span style='font-size: 14pt'><span style="color: #FF0000">This thread contains all the basic planting requirments for both corn and soybeans, together, seperate and both Roundup Ready and conventional</span> </span></div></div>

 

[JNRBRONC]

Corn really hates early competition and this is the time when yield (ear size, number of rows of kernals per ear, etc.) is determined. Maybe the corn will jump off to a great start and get above the soybeans. Lord knows I hoed a lot of voluteer corn out of soybean fields as a youth, but thinking back, it usually didn't have the best ears.
The nitrogen soybeans fix is locked in the root nodules, only to be released the following year as the root breaks down. I'm not trying to shoot down your plans, just adding what I think to be correct. How about a foodplot with corn around the edges and a chunk of beans in the middle? That way if your foodplot can be seen from the road, it might make it harder for people to see deer in it (with the spotlight).

One year I had sorghum planted with the corn. I'm not sure how big deer are on sorghum, but the pheasants, quail and turkey will make use of it. There is some special sorghum one needs to plant so that it doesn't take over and reseed itself. It's been so long I have forgotten.

 

[dbltree]

Corn hates competition for nitrogen more then anything so beans help by shading out weeds that do compete for N. I have been planting corn on corn for over 10 years now, so by adding soybeans I can save or add about 25-30# N each year by having the soybeans in the mix also.
I have such a high deer density that they currently eat the corn plant itself on a third of the field before it ever gets a chance to make an ear. I'm hoping that they will work on the soys (and a new clover plot) and give the corn a chance. My goal is just to produce more feed per acre for not only deer but all wildlife.

 

[dbltree]

Some pics from my own corn only plots:
This one shows what happens if you don't use herbicide! Missed a corner

Shoulder high by the 4th of July!

Early fall it's providing great wildlife cover and feed.

By December they are starting to strip the field bare as by that time it is the only feed left in the area.

Late winter is is stripped bare but still full of wildlife searching for every last "crumb"

Chopping the stalks in March making ready to put on fertlizer and spring planting of the next years plot.

I normally no-till plant my plot but I may disc and broadcast RR soybeans and then row plant my RR corn into that. Hope to have pics like the QDMA post this summer!

 

[strutnrut]

I see where The durry? brothers are advertising BIO-MAX. I think that was the name of it. Corn and Bean mix. I dont know if that would work real well or not. I think I'll keep planting seperate plots.

 

[dbltree]

If I had unlimited acres, I would plant seperate plots, but because it's in CRP I'm limited. That leaves only one option for me (I know many others are in the same boat) and that is to get as much food mass produced per acre as possible.

 

[dbltree]

For those with a farming background many of my update posts on this subject will be old news, but for those that dont....

Today I put on 500# per acre of triple 19 fertilizer, meaning I put on nearly a 100#'s actual of each, NPK (nitrogen, phosphorus and potassium)

The spreader wouldn't put on that much, so it was set to 250# and I went over it twice and some of it three times. Normally there are cheaper forms of nitrogen such as anhydrous ammonia but in a food plot situation it's not feasable for most.

Urea is the most common dry form of nitrogen but it is somewhat volatile (begins to vaporize) and is best put on before a good rain or tilled in. I'm hoping for a good rain in the next 24 hours. I also try to get mine put on before farmers get going in the fields or it's difficult to get a spreader.

The other option is to buy it in bags and use a 3 pt spreader. I have had liquid nitrogen and herbicide put on by the fertilizer dealer but it's often very difficult to get them to come out for 5-6 acres.

Soil nutrient levels can be built up over time, especially P and K. These elements can be applied even the fall before. Nitrogen is more easliy lost and if possible a split application can be done, with part at planting and the rest after the corn has emerged and able to absorb the N.

Building up high levels of organic matter by rotating your corn crop to a "spent" clover plot or plowing down buckwheat or rye will also help.

This link will provide you with more detailed info onsoil testing and using fertilizer and lime:

Soil Testing and fertilizers

Because I'm adding soybeans to my corn plot I need to wait for much warmer weather and hopefully no more frosts before planting... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

 

[dbltree]

I planted my RR corn/soybean combo yesterday. I disced it several times and then went over it with a harigator (just because I had use of the tractor and equipment )

Then I mounted a 3 point spreader on the tractor and broadcast the <span style="color: #33CC00">soybeans</span>. Little by guess and by gosh, trial and error and all that. Anywhere between 100,000 to 200,000 seeds per acre, so at least I can compare which is better...thick or thin!

I went back over it with the harigator to cover the seed and then used my JD no-till 4 row corn planter to plant the RR <span style="color: #3366FF">corn</span>. I planted some at <span style="color: #CC0000">25,000 per acre and some at 32,000. </span>

Seed corn is ususally sold in 80,000 count bags which means a bag will plant roughly 2 1/2 to 3 acres.

My planter is set up for planting wide rows (34-38") while many newer planters plant 28" to 32" rows, all of which can affect planting populations. Planters have a book which will show how to adjust chains to change the seeds per acre.

Check with local seed dealers for left over/broken bags for big discounts and with local Pheasants Forever Chapters for <span style="color: #FF0000">FREE</span> seed.

If not for the use of any equipment I needed I would have no-till planted both the corn and soybeans. I have been no-tilling for over 10 years now with fantastic results!

Just planted April 21, 2006

Now I will watch the weed/plant growth and try to nuke the weeds the first time before they start sucking up nitrogen.
Stay tuned! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

[dbltree]

It's been almost 30 days since planting and most of that period has been cold and wet. Corn is yellow in many areas across the state this spring.
The first soys were just starting to pop up when they got nipped by a late frost on May 6th. They are still coming up and at this point it looks like I could have planted them a little thicker but time will tell.
Nice crop of foxtail coming up as well /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

With no pre-emergence herbicicde, I have to watch closely and nuke it before the weeds start sucking up nitrogen.

View of field...

Closeup of beans, corn and...weeds!

 

[Shredder]

What was your total bill on that?...all roundup ready of course. You know, for a mere $65 an acre, you could have put that Biologic Biomaxx down with Monsanto's blessing (quote from one of the Drury's). /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif

Looks good and I will be interested to see how the beans do from a broadcast state.

 

[dbltree]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What was your total bill on that?...all roundup ready of course. You know, for a mere $65 an acre, you could have put that Biologic Biomaxx down with Monsanto's blessing (quote from one of the Drury's). /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif

Looks good and I will be interested to see how the beans do from a broadcast state. </div></div>

I'm a Pheasants Forever member so I was able to get the RR seed corn free (if you don't count the banquet tickets /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif) and I bought the RR soybeans from a dealer who had them left over from last year for $15 a bag.

If the deer don't hammer the beans to the ground in the next few weeks...it will be a small miracle! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

 

[Shedhuntermd]

Very cool!

I just put in 3 ac of RR corn and 1.5 ac of soy beans. Unfortunately we had to just till the ground and broadcast the seeds, then we used the drug the tiller without the teeth spinning over the seed, well see if it works. I put in 4 ac of Whitetail Institute clover, 1 ac of Max attract 1 ac of Alfalfa, .5 ac of kale/rape, 1 ac of chicory. I sprayed all of the clover yesterday with Butarak. Just pray for rain

 

[dbltree]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well, how is the plot looking now dbltree?
I ended up with about 110,000 RR soys I'm saving for next year and a buddy checking on some RR corn also. Just waiting to see how your plot turns out. </div></div>

I just sprayed it a little over a week ago TP...the foxtail had went wild and we hadn't had any rain. Since then it's had a 3/4" rain so I'll check on it in a few days and post some pics. A week ago...after 3 weeks with no rain it looked terrible but that had nothing to do with the corn/bean combo. The beans are not even close to competing with the corn yet...the foxtail sure was though /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

I may need to side dress some urea yet also...stay tuned /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

[dbltree]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With no pre-emergence herbicide, I have to watch closely and nuke it before the weeds start sucking up nitrogen.
</div></div>



You would think I would at least heed my own advice! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/blush.gif

Hard to believe how fast foxtail can grow when it's got plenty of fertilizer to work with &lt; /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

This is what Bronc was talking about when he said "corn hates competition" /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

got er kilt though! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif

Hard to see the beans...but they are there...barely...dang deer /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

At this point because of the constant "grazing" by both deer and turkeys...I could have planted the beans a lot heavier. /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif

I varied between 100,000 to 200,000 seeds per acre...but it's still to early to see what will be left by fall.

Couple things I'm thinking of doing next year:

1) No-till BOTH corn and beans. I would plant the beans first in a kitercorner fashion going over it twice to plant 15" rows.

2) Use Dual Magnum pre-emergence herbicide. It's approved for both corn and beans and will help control the foxtail until I spray with Roundup.

Dual II MAGNUM®

At this point I have found NOTHING negative about the corn/bean combo. The foxtail problem is just a spray/timing thing that one needs to be on top of when planting RR crops using no pre-emergence herbicide.

Lack of rain could be a huge problem...RR or not... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

 

[TimberPig]

Yikes Dble, you did get alot of foxtail in that plot! My neighbor planted my Liberty Link corn plot 4 days after yours, and I would say its about twice the height of yours right now. I dont know if that is due to moisture or your competition from grass. I did have some broadleaves coming in and I sprayed around June 2nd with Liberty ATZ, which wiped out the BL's and volunteer corn. I never really did get any grass (yet), the plot was not no-tilled.
I am interested in how your plot does because I only have 1 acre for annuals so the double crop sounds good. I know thats not much acreage but next year there should be 75 acres of corn and 20 acres of beans within 100 yards or so of this plot and I dont have the deer population you do. So, I am not really worried about browse pressure so much as how the beans effect your corn yeild. In other words, its not going to be a big deal to put in the beans but I probably wouldnt sacrifice the corn to do it.

Btw, I put down about 300#'s of 46-0-0 and 40# of 0-0-60 on the 1 acre prior to discing. I mentioned broadcasting some additional urea later on but my farmer neighbor warned that if I did it after the plants split leaves (whorled??) I would risk burning the corn with the urea. Has that been a problem for you?

 

[JNRBRONC]

Urea needs to be disced or "rained in" or one risks loss to evaporation. incorporate for maximum benefit

 

[dbltree]

I had hoped to be able to show that the combination of RR corn and beans would...
a) work well together to maximize food plot production
or
b)show that corn would shade out the beans
or
c)that the soybeans would out compete the corn

I hadn't counted on

d) severe drought and severe deer damage /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

The combination of letting the foxtail get to big at the same time as getting hit with severe dry weather set the corn back severely. Because of that the deer took advantage of it and have proceeded to attempt to graze the entire plot to the ground!

Damage to beans:

Damage to corn:

It's hard to walk with out stepping in this...

Some places the beans are doing a little better...

I've never had damage like this in 10 years of corn in this food plot, so I never expected this.

Next year I will be very careful about prompt weed control including the use of Dual Magnum for some residual foxtail control.

I put on a total of 150# of actual nitrogen as well as 100# each of P and K.

Not sure that more would have helped under the circumstances.

I am going to till some headlands and plant brassicas and overseed brassicas and rye into the standing corn and beans (such as they are...)
and try again next year /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

 

[dbltree]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Looks to me by the browse damage and fertilizer being left some arrows/slugs need to fly this season! I'm getting an itchy release finger if you can't tell /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif </div></div>

We killed 4 there last year but 40 might have been better /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

Timberpig...I just noticed your post about urea. I put on 500#'s of triple 19 just ahead of a good soaking rain before planting and then another 100# of 46% several weeks ago. It was supposed to rain of course but we only got a couple tenths, a 1/4" to a 1/2" would have been better. At any rate it didn't "burn" the corn although that is a possible.

Nitrogen is a big problem when planting corn in small plots. Anhydrous ammonia is the cheapest and perhaps best source for corn but most people don't have a tractor big enough to pull an applicator and knife it in.

Normally I use UAN liquid nitrogen which the fertilizer dealer applies. The problem with that is...getting them out there! They want to combine it with someone elses corn and so often the corn is up and the nitrogen "burns" it.

Urea (46%) works fine but as noted in a previous post it needs to be tilled in or a good rain within 24-48 hours or you can lose up to 20%. The stuff is like gold already so one hates to lose any of it, but it is something most food plotters can handle, either by bag or bulk.
Sidedressing generally is not a big problem but again timing is important and this year even a 100% chance of rain wasn't enough.


Effects of UAN or Urea on growing corn

If at all possible I would suggest having nitrogen knifed in or sprayed on when a farmer or applicator is doing thiers, with urea being the next best option.

I prefer to no-till (which I regret not doing this year) because it conserves soil moisture (gee...wouldn't that have come in handy... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif ) and if the soil is not disturbed weeds will be delayed in germinating (and I wouldn't have had such an explosion of foxtail)

Most farmers using RR corn use some residual herbicide along with roundup. I expect to either use Dual for that purpose or perhaps 3 applications of Roundup. I do know that it takes much less Roundup to kill small growing weeds then it does tough grasses like brome.

I bought 2 1/2 gallons of generic roundup for about $60 and I got by with less then a quart per acre each application.

 

[JNRBRONC]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I hadn't counted on

d) severe drought and severe deer damage /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

The combination of letting the foxtail get to big at the same time as getting hit with severe dry weather set the corn back severely. Because of that the deer took advantage of it and have proceeded to attempt to graze the entire plot to the ground!
</div></div>

I took a quick drive along a couple of our fields to look at deer crop damage yesterday. I was too hot and tired from chopping weeds to get out of the truck, so the shot isn't the best, having been taken out of the window. This picture is of one area of damage, I saw three such areas in the 1/3 mile of field edge I drove. It isn't as bad as it has been in the past. Unlike some parts of the state, our fields have been getting timely rains.

Thus, the corn grew FAST and tall. I think this limited the time it was most vulnerable to browsing. The stalks in back are about 8 feet tall, a couple of rows in front are browsed off right above the ear at 4 foot. There should be enough pollen drift to pollinate those ears, but the deer like to eat the silk off the end of the ears. This is more of an ag field than a food plot, but at this point (and up until it is harvested), what's the difference? /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif

We have had foxtail problems in the past, so both corn and beans are RR this year. We also stacked the Bt trait on as much ground as allowed. It looks to be a good crop, there, I just jinxed it! &gt;

Hail and straight line winds are on the way. The deer seem to be focusing more heavily on the soybean fields. I have noticed that about every ragweed plant has been browsed as well.

 

[dbltree]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

I hadn't counted on

d) severe drought and severe deer damage /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif

The combination of letting the foxtail get to big at the same time as getting hit with severe dry weather set the corn back severely. Because of that the deer took advantage of it and have proceeded to attempt to graze the entire plot to the ground!
</div></div>

Unlike some parts of the state, our fields have been getting timely rains. Thus, the corn grew FAST and tall. I think this limited the time it was most vulnerable to browsing. The stalks in back are about 8 feet tall, a couple of rows in front are browsed off right above the ear at 4 foot. </div></div>

Normally that's pretty much what would happen to my corn Randy. I have to depend on very rapid growth so that it get's beyond the stage that deer will eat the center right out of the stalk. After that they start ripping the ears off even in the silk /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

If anything causes a delay in growth...well, you can see what happens in my case. I have been using the Yieldguard corn the past few years also.

There are literally hundreds of acres of soybeans within a mile of my plot but why walk out in the open when they are safe at my place...eating my "buffet" /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

That last storm did knock some beautiful fields of corn flat /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif