booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Is the floating LOT in your scenario included in the 2 buck max?
OFFENSE!! 2 Bills to support!! SF 293 & SF 247 EMAIL IN!!! What a great change!!!!
It’s going to be- well now non resident landowners with 40 acres get a tag, but everyone 39.9 and under don’t. It’s an opening due to-“you just got rid of x amount of tags and we need to keep deer numbers down”
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Yep!! I just can’t ever support taking tags away from residents and allowing more to be open for non residents. Might not be the intent but unfortunately it is usually what happens
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
This isn’t that complicated. If the “rich guy” wants things to be better for all he will sacrifice the same things as everyone. If not it will be seen as a rigged system to benefit the elite and will lead to the masses begging for liberalization of other regs to “catch up” or “make things fair”. Those of us that have it good right now have an awesome opportunity to make things across the board better for all and all this bill does on paper is give us another advantage that we do not need.
Windlooker
Well-Known Member
How many times you gonna say the same thing. Be a lobbyist, visit the state capitol, we get your position. Horse meet stick.
Daver
PMA Member
Very much agree. ^^ The only people happy about the deer populations then were...deer hunters!
I am more in the neutral territory here on what should be done, but there is no way on earth that we will ever see the very high overall deer populations that we had in the early 2000's, no way. Hans1 is correct, those high numbers are what led to all of the additional harvest "opportunities". The FB, insurance companies, general population, etc, just did not want that many deer on the landscape and they will flip if we approach anything like it again.
Now then, are there areas within the state that are well below where they "should" be...it sure seems like it, yes. But the "let's get the population back to the good ol' days" approach is a non-starter, it just will not be tolerated and would likely lead to more regulations than any of us would prefer to solve it.
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
How many times are you going to say you’d enjoy others giving up something while you give up nothing???
Yes, two bucks max for everyone plus the urban tags. Floating LOT tag as a bone to RLO but if you fill two statewide tags with antlered deer then you are done and the floating LOT gets thrown in trash or used on antlerless deer on your farm unit (s).
Windlooker
Well-Known Member
The current system of 2 acres is abused. It needs fixed. How much property do you own, what do you do? You say life has treated you well. What’s that mean.
You refer to stats with no reference and speak in generalities . Of course older folks own more land. As one lives they tend to make more money with the ability to buy more in time. I worked as a LEO for 13 years before I could buy my first piece. At that time was the price considered expensive, absolutely.
Your entire argument reeks with equity based positions. There are some folks who own more, sacrifice more, provide more to the habitat than others etc. I believe the landowner who owns 300, 500, 1000 ac should be treated differently than the 20 ac owner. All day. They have larger issues and conservation responsibilities than others. There’s no catch all remedy here but it’s a start.
1983 asked you a bunch of posts ago for examples of who in the older generation wants to keep you down. Couldn’t provide any. You ramble and ramble.
Again, horse meet stick.
You refer to stats with no reference and speak in generalities . Of course older folks own more land. As one lives they tend to make more money with the ability to buy more in time. I worked as a LEO for 13 years before I could buy my first piece. At that time was the price considered expensive, absolutely.
Your entire argument reeks with equity based positions. There are some folks who own more, sacrifice more, provide more to the habitat than others etc. I believe the landowner who owns 300, 500, 1000 ac should be treated differently than the 20 ac owner. All day. They have larger issues and conservation responsibilities than others. There’s no catch all remedy here but it’s a start.
1983 asked you a bunch of posts ago for examples of who in the older generation wants to keep you down. Couldn’t provide any. You ramble and ramble.
Again, horse meet stick.
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booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Haha!! Just because you are ignorant of the facts does not mean that they are not facts!! Spend the time like I have and look them up!! There is no doubt what age class owns the majority of land. I really do not doubt that when I am that age I will be in the same boat and my current age class will own the most land too! The results of this bill are the same. It gives the older age class a huge advantage!! Compounding interest is awesome!! Those currently invested in land or nearly anything will without a doubt always have a financial advantage over the younger generations! Even I have a HUGE advantage over those younger than me! Long term what will that do for deer hunting?? History has proven that as the general population sees real wealth and large land ownership unattainable they beg for and eventually get liberalization of regulations. I don’t want to leave my kids that will probably own less than me(hopefully not, bust statistically likely) with less. I don’t want them competing in bow season with crossbows, or more non residents, or november gun seasons. This has happened in every other state. If we make it so obvious that we have a leg up on everybody here it will without a doubt happen here too! We already have a huge advantage!!! We don’t need to amplify it anymore and deal with the bs regs that will result from it.
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
If you want the facts and can’t look them up roughly 2/3rds of Iowa landowners are 65 or older even tho they represent only a little over 18% of the population.
Windlooker
Well-Known Member
Another ramble with zero facts, calling people ignorant and answering nobody’s questions.
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JNRBRONC
Well-Known Member
How many of those are farmers, not recreational landowners? You going to buy their thousand acres of holdings? Statistics can be presented in different ways to advance an agenda.
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Haha. You can disregard facts all you want it does not change them. My opinions are based on fact. Go ahead and base yours on whatever you want them to be. When you get a chance let me let me know how many midwestern states have LOT tags for those that own over 40 acres or have no crossbows or no november gun seasons etc.. Very interested in this
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booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Totally agree!!!!! That is actually kind of my point. And i think the original intent of LOT tags should be looked into if that’s what we wan’t to do…. Does a rec ground owner deserve any??? Does your 20 acres of crp or 50 acres of crop out of the 500 you own really mean anything?? You are actually hitting on exactly what I am getting at!! Why do we have these tags???? Some say deer management… what does that really mean??? Trophy management or population??? Do the deer “habitat” owners deserve them or true “crop producers”?? So many opinions. How the heck do we ever sort it all out??? Even if you own 1000 acres but your income is not dependent on the crops you produce do you deserve anything??? I honestly do not have the answer and there seems to be a lot of differing opinions on who the tags are actually for.
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
The facts are not hard to look up. Go ahead and just keep ignoring them and pass the buck once again while you sit back and fail to pass meaningful regulation change
Windlooker
Well-Known Member
You’re combining rec farm and ag ownership. Can’t do it. . The average age in Iowa of today’s farmer is 57 according to Farm Bureau. ISU has the age a bit higher.
But, ISU does not separate rec farm owners and ag farm ownership. Two different markets. Do you want to farm or hunt?
92% of Iowa land is ag. The average age of the rec farm owner is missing or not calculated; which is an important variable in this statistic. It’s apples and oranges.
Btw, the reason for the state wide age of Iowas farmers has nothing to do with land affordability. It’s mostly, according to ISU, older farmers not willing to retire and start up cost for new farmers. Yes, start up can include land, however equipment, structures etc also play in. Again, this pertains to ag ownership primarily.
Your numbers and reasoning are skewed
But, ISU does not separate rec farm owners and ag farm ownership. Two different markets. Do you want to farm or hunt?
92% of Iowa land is ag. The average age of the rec farm owner is missing or not calculated; which is an important variable in this statistic. It’s apples and oranges.
Btw, the reason for the state wide age of Iowas farmers has nothing to do with land affordability. It’s mostly, according to ISU, older farmers not willing to retire and start up cost for new farmers. Yes, start up can include land, however equipment, structures etc also play in. Again, this pertains to ag ownership primarily.
Your numbers and reasoning are skewed
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booneriverbucks
PMA Member
Cherry pick more regs/stats while you are at it!!! Is saying this bill helps 57 year olds vs 65 year olds really any bettter?? The facts are the same. This bill without a doubt helps an older generation of landowners/producers. Who are LOT tags really for?? Do you want your non LOT elegible kids grandkids stuck with BS regs while you are isolated from them???
booneriverbucks
PMA Member
92% of ground is ag!! Perfect!!! U are teaming up with pro farm bureau and the kill everything group now?? Am i right??? Your proposed regs affect all landowners. Not blaming you!! Just another problem with this bill. It totally helps big ag while crippling the habitat minded small landowners
Windlooker
Well-Known Member
Dude. You’re all over the place.. I mentioned ag ownership because the average age of Iowa’s farmers is based only on ag land; without calculating the avg age of the rec owner. That’s all.