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Brassicas

We just started puttting in our brasssica strips in this week. We are now in our 2nd year of Pauls (dbltree) rotation and the red clover/rye plowdown was great. Spread 200 lbs of 6-20-30 and 200 lbs of urea ( per acre) ,tilled in the green manure, packed the plot, seeded at 7 pounds per acre and repacked the plot. With rain falling the next day, the plot was up within 48 hours. I have always way over seeded brassica, but this year seems likes its prettty close. I actually measured out each plot and weighed the seed. Taking the few extra steps makes a big difference.
 
Grass weed control. Any way to control grass weeds in this mix with out killing the rest.

Have used Paul rotation for about 4 years now and have seen over the years the grasses are coming through more and more. Always planting about the same week every year.
 
iowathumper said:
Grass weed control. Any way to control grass weeds in this mix with out killing the rest.

Have used Paul rotation for about 4 years now and have seen over the years the grasses are coming through more and more. Always planting about the same week every year.
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Absolutely. Hit it with about 16 oz/acre of Clethodim. I have found it cheapest at Rural King.
 
iowathumper said:
Grass weed control. Any way to control grass weeds in this mix with out killing the rest.

Have used Paul rotation for about 4 years now and have seen over the years the grasses are coming through more and more. Always planting about the same week every year.
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As IowaBow said, use clethodim to control now. But from what you wrote, are you putting brassicas in the same spot every year? I can't tell for sure from your question.

Something I have done in a couple of areas where there seems to be a great amount of foxtail seed waiting to come up when given a chance is to mow, spray and then till to get to bare dirt...wait about 2 weeks and then nuke the new growth with gly AND then fertilize, till and plant brassicas about a week later. This has seemed to reduce the "grass factor" for me.
 
Daver said:
As IowaBow said, use clethodim to control now. But from what you wrote, are you putting brassicas in the same spot every year? I can't tell for sure from your question.

Something I have done in a couple of areas where there seems to be a great amount of foxtail seed waiting to come up when given a chance is to mow, spray and then till to get to bare dirt...wait about 2 weeks and then nuke the new growth with gly AND then fertilize, till and plant brassicas about a week later. This has seemed to reduce the "grass factor" for me.
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Best idea for sure. helps so much to wait for as many weeds to emerge and drop the bomb on em before you seed.
GRASS is thankfully an easy problem to address, I wish that were the worst case in any farming application. Clethodim & crop oil, bam, done. Easy as pie.
You should be having less grass pressure each year on your rotation if you are good about all elements.... mowing your clover, not letting rye go to seed, spraying clover and also later brassicas with Clethodim & crop oil, etc. Yes, to also piggy back on Daver's thoughts, you do want to rotate brassica location, ideally each year, back and fourth. Just like a corn bean rotation - same thing with your brassicas next to your mix - swap em each year. Lot of reasons why. Good luck
 
Thanks! I am rotating each year with the Dbltree mix.

This year I did this.
I mowed the winter rye at seed forming stage on 5/20/16, then letting clover come back and mowing again 7-20/16 then tilling & planting on 7/27/16 this year.

I was always told to till the Urea in the ground.
 
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iowathumper said:
Thanks! I am rotating each year with the Dbltree mix.

This year I did this.
I mowed the winter rye at seed forming stage on 5/20/16, then letting clover come back and mowing again 7-20/16 then tilling & planting on 7/27/16 this year.

I was always told to till the Urea in the ground.
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Good plan. Disc or till Urea is a must unless it's treated or you're certain you're right in front of a big rain (which I never wanna gamble on that one). It'll evaporate if you don't. Unique to Urea or N as it's an encapsulated GAS (Nitrogen) that will evaporate if not covered or treated. P&K are totally different & a complete non-issue with evaporation. I simply just always get treated Urea whether I cover or not but that's me. Lot more room for No-till options and simply keeps urea stable far longer and doesn't cost much to have coop treat it. Just a thought if you get Urea at coop & coop is going to be your cheaper route as well.
 
Sligh1 said:
Good plan. Disc or till Urea is a must unless it's treated or you're certain you're right in front of a big rain (which I never wanna gamble on that one). It'll evaporate if you don't. Unique to Urea or N as it's an encapsulated GAS (Nitrogen) that will evaporate if not covered or treated. P&K are totally different & a complete non-issue with evaporation. I simply just always get treated Urea whether I cover or not but that's me. Lot more room for No-till options and simply keeps urea stable far longer and doesn't cost much to have coop treat it. Just a thought if you get Urea at coop & coop is going to be your cheaper route as well.
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Regarding urea evaporating...how long does that take to happen? Last weekend I spread urea, and other fertilizer, on Saturday with the intent to till it that afternoon. BUT...I had a tractor problem and was not able to get it done until the next day. Let's say that the urea was on the ground for 18 hours or so before it was tilled in.

How much, as a rough percentage, did I lose in that situation?
 
Hot & blazing - 24 hours and most b gone. Over night with dew & possibly cooler temps- 18 hours & most that was Overnight.... I bet u didn't lose more than 15- 40% if I had to guess. Maybe lower. Hot blazing sun will fry it pretty fast but I think u r fine in that example.
 
I know this rotation says to plant brassicas mid-late July. I have never really had the deer eating brassicas ever...even radishes...Tried for 3 years. Well this year I planted winter peas with radishes August 14 and they have been hammering the radishes. Has anyone else noticed that a later planting could result in better deer usage? Just curious, thanks.
 
I swung by to check a camera at one of my plots yesterday before the cubbies game- and I couldnt believe the late season growth- look at these suckers! and these arent the biggest ones either

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Deer either got a taste for em over your years of planting them (probably part of it, almost certainly) - it usually does take 3-4 years on some farms. Others - 1st year, bam, they get smashed. 2nd thing - if you mix in other desirables - it can get them eating them. 3rd - yes, it sure is possible the later planting had the impact of growing a smaller but more tender plant. Think of it like this for example..... I grow green beans in my garden, if I pick them "mid growth" they are firm but tender & crisp & easy to chew with great flavor. If I miss them - they get huge, they get fibrous and hard to chew and don't taste as good. Kinda the same way, to some extent, with Brassicas. I don't mind big bulbs, I kinda would go for "Baseball to softball size", yet I'm fine with golfball (barebones minimum) all the way to mini basketball - deer on me don't care now. But, i do think the "sweet spot" is likely what you found, which would be a bit smaller but more tender & desirable plant to eat that hasn't turned into a fiberous, woody tasteless plant that's mature. If folks could control it, I'd like to have baseballs & bananas IMO but I'm happy if my pics look like above as well, very nice!!!
 
I've changed my brassica mix the last 2 years. I'm planting purple top and barkant forage turnips and adding forage chicory for a backup in dry weather. This chicory is being hit hard right now but will soon be tilled under for soybeans. Another field of brassicas will be planted again in late July. For some reason the last two years the bucks have really hit the barkant turnips after rut right before Christmas. Whether it is cold or not.
chicory field.jpg

chicory deer.jpg
 
Jbohn said:
I put down 400LBS of Nitrogen and 200LBS PNK even after red clover. Always have a great stand.. Just planted Saturday grounds looks good.
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Paul suggests from 150 to 200 lbs urea plus a little more from a fert mix. Which is well shy of your 400lbs of actual nitrogen. Do you get that much more result from twice the nitrogen? I'm just trying to see what I can get away with to make plots a little cheaper. Thanks
 
arm said:
Paul suggests from 150 to 200 lbs urea plus a little more from a fert mix. Which is well shy of your 400lbs of actual nitrogen. Do you get that much more result from twice the nitrogen? I'm just trying to see what I can get away with to make plots a little cheaper. Thanks
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If u truly have great clover that u will kill off- there's a good chance u need little or even no added N. good clover, vetch, alfalfa, etc can fix 100-200 lbs If done right.

I would probably play it safe, on average, and add some N - as I'm sure their are situations with less N makers in the ground or maybe you are just dealing with rough soil additionally. Adding N can't hurt & often helps insure there's ample N for brassicas. But yes, following legumes, etc- if they were a huge success- cut back on supplemented N & save some $!
 
What Sligh 1 said. One year it was so wet never could get in the field to till for turnips. This was a clover field I had sprayed twice with gly. So I broadcast seed anyway. No fertilizer and had a fantastic crop of turnips.
 
I have always just added the 400 lbs. of Urea which to my understanding is close to 200lbs. of actual nitrogen. and well add the P&K never had a problems maybe its over kill I don't know.. I just follow those instruction to what I understood.. I do follow the clover and Rye mix. Never had an issue..
 
DeerHunter3 said:
Could a guy round up a plot and broad cast seed shortly after? Or would I want to let the kill off set in before broad cast?
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There are a variety of methods that will work, and yes, some work better than others. :) But I have had fair to good success broadcasting brassica seed into standing vegetation and then mowing it down and spraying to kill what remained. It is not the very best method, but it is definitely workable.

Your #1 thing to do is to schedule some rain for your field, preferably right after you plant! :)
 
What moisture does it take to germinate brassicas? Say on exposed soil. Is there a target measured amount of rain or can dew get it going?
 
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