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Honest concern with Youth Hunter bucks shot…

miniwhitetails said:
I agree with the above points. I do want to point out that for every 1 giant you see with a kid behind it, there is likely 100 others who shot the smaller ones but just did not display the photo/send it in. It's the nature of the news outlet you are seeing. I do think maybe it is trending upward though (which is the whole issue), but just wanted to point out that lots are still on our train of thinking (all of the above posts). We just don't always see it on social media.
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Good point. Little Billy with a button buck gets shared on FB and friends and fam give him a pat on the back but not many people see/care. If little Johnny's dad gets his self worth from social media glory (or worse - income and endorsements) for killing big things you best believe little Johnny's bruiser is going to get as many views as his dad can get it and it'll be shared far and wide.

For the casual hunter majority, i imagine most parents just like getting their kids out there. Sit in the same stands they sit in for reg seasons regardless of wind, access, etc, and are happy to shoot whatever shows up.
 
hillrunner said:
Things that come too easy quickly lose their luster.
My early years were painfully unsuccessful. I did pretty much everything wrong, lol. When I finally connected it was the greatest feeling I'd ever had. I've been chasing that feeling ever since.
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This is my persuasion as well. ^^ It's good to work for something and even experience some difficulties and challenges along the way.

We are trying to "build" adults, not just thrill kids...IMO.
 
I share the same concerns. Not just about hunting. Not that I wouldn't have let my kids shoot a bruiser when they were young. Any such chance they would have got would have been pure luck and they understood that. Some of my friends kids do not know or appreciate how good they have it. If they ever loose access to their private access I think it's probable they won't hunt any more.
 
I do agree with some of what has been said but I also think there are situations where it can be a good thing for a youth to be successful on a huge trophy. Let's imagine this situation; the young boy/girl has been helping Dad plant food plots, set up blinds and stands, planting more food plots and checking trail cameras, trimming shooting lanes all spring and summer. He/she has been a big part of getting things ready for the opener. Whether it's the first sit or the 4th sit, they shoot a monster. Now hopefully they understand, or Dad has explained to them that all that hard work they put into this season played a huge role in being successful on that mature deer. The next year they do not have that kind of success because maybe they didn't help out as much or maybe they did but it just didn't work out due to other factors. Does this teach them that mature deer don't come easy? Hard work can pay off? I would like to think so.

I think it shows what can be achieved right off the bat if you put in the time. I know this is not the case for every young hunter that shoots a big mature buck, some just get lucky. I try to think of what I would do in that situation where a big one steps out in front of my young hunter and would have a hard time telling them they do not have the option of harvesting that 180" buck standing in front of them @ 30yards. By the time my kids were old enough to hunt, they had seen Dad bring home numerous doe's and smaller bucks. They saw how excited I was about each harvest and listened to the stories that made that harvest such a special one. They have already had many unsuccessful hunts while sitting with Dad in the blind. They understand it's really not that easy. They hear me talk about how nice it would be for a big one to step out and to make a clean kill. It very rarely happens.

There are many different scenarios that play out with youth hunts every year, some good, some bad. We can only hope there were positive learning experiences along the way.
 
If a 180 steps out in front of my young hunters they absolutely have the green light, if it's a close and humane shot.

I just think in some of these cases the kid's parents set them up on monsters and have them pass deer up hoping to get the big boy. That's the difference as I see it anyhow.
 
I agree with a lot of what's been said already. Kids so small that they can't hold or even carry the gun themselves, using a tripod that grips and holds the gun rock solid for them, to kill an animal.... when the same kid will cry when the goldfish they've had for three days dies. How well do they understand life and death at age 5? Maturity just isn't there yet in my opinion. And I say that as a former farm kid that saw death from the beginning. I just think it's important for there to be a firm understanding of the significance of ending life with your own hands.

When I started hunting, it was just during shotgun season. My first several deer were buttons, spikes, and does. I was thrilled with all of them. I certainly had some help from dad on where to setup and he definitely put me in positions to succeed. Dad wasn't a bowhunter so by the time I started that, the strategy and work was all on me. Failure or success (mostly failure early on) was from my decisions. At 15 I somewhat dumb lucked my way into killing a 168. I got pictures of the deer on trail camera, knew roughly where he was living, and ended up in the right place at the right time. 99% luck. This was the first "racked" deer I ever killed and even though I did it myself, it still had a small negative impact on me, I think. In the 3 or 4 years following that I passed TONS of 130s and 140s because they weren't as big as my first big one..... a teenager with less than 10 deer under his belt passing 140s because they weren't big enough..... wtf. So speaking from experience, yes killing a big deer WILL warp the expectations of young minds.

Now take a 5-10 year old that hasn't done a damn thing to prep for season. Dad takes them out, plops them on a nice lush food plot, out steps a huge deer, junior pulls the trigger. Gee, that wasn't very hard. Especially if they didn't see all the food plot and habitat work dad did. The scouting, the treestand/blind placement, etc. When they get older and fail to have that level of success, do you think they will continue hunting? Idk.

I also agree that either they hunt during the regular seasons or their tag should expire after youth season ends. It's good to learn that time is limited and failure will happen.
 
northcedar said:
If a 180 steps out in front of my young hunters they absolutely have the green light, if it's a close and humane shot.

I just think in some of these cases the kid's parents set them up on monsters and have them pass deer up hoping to get the big boy. That's the difference as I see it anyhow.
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I agree, if a big Ole buck steps out my kids are shooting!!! But we are not hunting that deer only, the first deer that steps out will most likely get it if they want to!!! My oldest daughter was lucky enough to get a doe and 2 bucks that made it up on the "wall" during youth seasons, not because we passed deer waiting on that, but they stepped out at the right time (for us lol).. my middle daughter has killed a big doe and a small basket 8 because that's the deer that stepped out in front of her and she wanted to shoot, I tell them if they want to then go ahead! My son will be going for the first time this yr and most likely will shoot the first adult deer that steps out n he will be just as excited if it's a monster buck or small doe.. we don't shoot one with spots but other than that if "they" want to shoot it they can try.. hopefully they catch the hunting bug and stick with it!!
As far as having all the seasons for youth to hunt, I like it.. I'm busy and can't take 3 of my 4 children out hunting during the youth season, so having the opportunity to get one out youth, one shotgun n one late season is the only way it works for me.. we may go spur of the moment because I get a day off or something and having a tag that can float all the seasons is the only way it would work for me personally..

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I have a slightly different perspective.
Why is it NESSESARY that my kids hunt? Just because I hunt? I don't buy that, and if it's just hanging out with dad, great! We can hang out and do things other than just pulling the trigger and killing deer. For me, I needed to see a valid passion before I took the boys hunting. My oldest son first developed his passion for hunting when he saw me come home with pheasants. He "helped" with the cleaning of the birds, and "helped" with the cooking of some very tasty nuggets. Now he was ready to go shoot (at) some birds with the right frame of mind. He understood exactly why we were shooting birds, and having a great time doing it. As he grew older he spent more and more time in the woods, by himself, and his passion and understanding of wildlife exploded. This "kid" never ceases to amaze me, He's always catching a "bigger fish" and is constantly teaching me new ways of doing things. He can cook anything, even commonly discarded items like goose legs. Melt in your mouth friekin delicious!

Bottom line....he hung his own stands (under my supervision), in the locations of his choosing, from his own understanding of the timber and how he observed the deer using it. He was in 7th grade when he shot his first doe during youth season.

My other son? He loves to eat the goodies with us but never developed that passion. I couldn't be more proud of him. He's a CNC machinist and he's all man, but he doesn't hunt and that's OK!!!!!

So yes, I feel it's a little disingenuous when a 5 year old caps a beast.
 
^^ this. My bro in law takes my niece and she has ZERO interest in hunting. But he wants her to hunt so bad.
I’ve got two girls- one I think will hunt, who knows on the other. I absolutely am not pushing them into it.
I think the youth tags, since they float, somehow need to be monitored a lot closer. I know the regs are pretty clear- but I know people who used to use guns all year because it was “youth tag”. And then they also used it during shotgun party hunting. So many loopholes by floating Is my concern. I know a lot of people say it’s to spend time with their kids, but again, hunting is a CHOICE. I’m sure I will get backlash on it, but you still need to teach season length since it is a choice. You need to teach that they might not get anything in the time allowed. We’re teaching generations that if you don get one during the allotted time, it’s ok, we can extend that. The people who will be making laws before long (time flies).
But again- you can only keep honest people honest right with how tags are used. (Kind of went on a tangent and not intended to ruffle feathers)
 
Work in the offseason and shoot a doe first. Passed 4 bucks on first day of youth. 2 nice 8pt and one 150 inch ten that we have pics of. They weren’t happy about that. Lol. shot the first nice doe that presented a good shot and he was shaking just as much as if it was a 180. No clamp on rest was shot free handed. Seeing pics of kids standing behind deer that aren’t even close to strong enough to hold a gun up drive me nuts. A few buddies call me a big jack$$$ for not letting them shoot that buck but that’s ok. Helps keep the fire burning to hunt more. Guarantee if one of them shot that buck their interest in hunting throughout the season would be greatly diminished. I also believe A little failure drives motivation and the keeps the fire burning.
 
Wapsi Tree Rat said:
I have a slightly different perspective.
Why is it NESSESARY that my kids hunt? Just because I hunt? I don't buy that, and if it's just hanging out with dad, great! We can hang out and do things other than just pulling the trigger and killing deer. For me, I needed to see a valid passion before I took the boys hunting. My oldest son first developed his passion for hunting when he saw me come home with pheasants. He "helped" with the cleaning of the birds, and "helped" with the cooking of some very tasty nuggets. Now he was ready to go shoot (at) some birds with the right frame of mind. He understood exactly why we were shooting birds, and having a great time doing it. As he grew older he spent more and more time in the woods, by himself, and his passion and understanding of wildlife exploded. This "kid" never ceases to amaze me, He's always catching a "bigger fish" and is constantly teaching me new ways of doing things. He can cook anything, even commonly discarded items like goose legs. Melt in your mouth friekin delicious!

Bottom line....he hung his own stands (under my supervision), in the locations of his choosing, from his own understanding of the timber and how he observed the deer using it. He was in 7th grade when he shot his first doe during youth season.

My other son? He loves to eat the goodies with us but never developed that passion. I couldn't be more proud of him. He's a CNC machinist and he's all man, but he doesn't hunt and that's OK!!!!!

So yes, I feel it's a little disingenuous when a 5 year old caps a beast.
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Good perspective. FWIW, my oldest was ready to go out with me fishing and hunting at a very early age and we had wonderful times together doing so. I remember carrying him in on turkey hunts on my shoulders. He still hunts, but it is not the highest priority in his life at this time and that is OK. He is very committed to his family, church and friends, etc. We still go during the shotgun season for a couple of days and we both look forward to getting his sons involved here in a few years.

My youngest was not that interested in hunting and certainly not in getting up early to do so when he was young...so I didn't push it. We did other things together and enjoyed those times immensely. But, I did tell him that he had to go hunting with me twice per year, since it was something that I enjoyed. On one of those trips when he was about 8 or 9 I may have pulled a trick on him. :) I let him run the rattling antlers that night and he called in two separate bucks, one of which put on a heck of show at 5 yards in front of us. (I did not shoot either one, as I had already tagged one buck that fall and would only have shot a real giant on my 2nd tag.) But...it didn't matter, he was captivated. I'll never forget his words when we climbed down at the end of that evening..."That was FUN...can I go again?".

Thus began his hunting career and he is still very hard at it 20 years later. I think there is real value in letting the kids choose their own path...and I think it is awesome when the kids go hunting with dad too. But care should be taken not to "force" them to like what dad likes or else...IMO. Kids take different paths, kids sometimes change their paths along the way and that's OK.

If a kid gets a big one...great. But if dad is just living vicariously through the young "trigger puller" then don't be surprised if eventually Mom has to have a talk with Dad to explain why Jr. doesn't really want to go hunting this year... Otherwise...enjoy taking your kids out and have fun with it. This need not be serious at a very young age IMO.
 
I REALLY wanted my boys to love hunting like I do. Took them out when they were young to expose them. They enjoyed it, but they never really developed a passion for it. Life gets busy and it just hasn't been a priority for them. I still ask if they want to go, but I don't push them. Am I disappointed, sure, but we find other things to do together and enjoy.

I still hope that after college and life is maybe a little more settled for them they will get more interested, but I won't be holding my breath.

I don't know what the right answer is, but if you can get them out and enjoy the time with them, do it. I do agree though, have fun and don't make it a high pressure stressful experience. If a big one comes out, great, but don't make it about that. Save that for your own hunts.
 
I like having the season, here in Indiana it is 2 days and is the last fully weekend in Sept.

Gives me a couple of days before season really starts to focus 100% on quality hunts.

That being said, last year was my sons first year hunting deer, he has joined me many times on hunts but he was finally big enough to handle the gun on his own. I put us in a spot where I was seeing deer but nothing big. I wanted it to be enjoyable but wanted him to pull the trigger on a doe or little buck. No success and he learned some good lessons as we had deer come out late and never get into is shooting range. I actually sort of liked that he was not successful. The entire year he has been talking about the upcoming season and how he was going to get a shot this year.

Yesterday was our opener here and my goal was, year 2, let’s get him on any deer. He told me he was pulling the trigger on the first deer he saw and I was good with that. Hunted over a plot he helped me plant and had been checkin cams on the last few weeks. Sure enough 1.5 year old steps out and he made all the shooting practice pay off with a perfect heart shot!!

He was so excited about the whole hunt and the track job (made him do the blood trailing and he was the one to find him). To me that is what it is all about.
 
Sligh1 said:
I am NOT trying to be critical or overly negative. & before I say this…. This is NOT a huge deal. It’s a tiny amount of hunters, bucks & this is not a battle we need to have in any regards. & I’m sure not dead set in my thoughts here. Maybe I need to adjust my own thinking??? BUT….

The amount of very young kids shooting absolute bombers this year…. Eah…. It kinda concerns me…. I’m talking like 6-10 year olds shooting 170”+ bucks. I am NOT saying it’s wrong. I am happy for them. I love the smiles. BUT….

1) I’m worried these kids are not understanding the bucks they shooting & will spoil them for later down the road. What they are shooting are bucks many grown men in normal seasons never get.
2) I am concerned these kids won’t get captivated by the challenge & difficulty of hunting mature Whitetail’s. It concerns me that this may be too early & over the long run, this is not a productive way to get them hooked on sport. Maybe I’m wrong.
3) I don’t know if their minds are developed enough to understand the hunt & dynamics of fully mature, high scoring giants. It’s at a far different level, IMO than a doe, a basic “8 point” or a squirrel.

I am NOT saying my way is right!!!!!!! My son is 12. He’s on his 4th season or maybe 5th. He got nothing year 1. He got a doe year 2. He got older low scoring bucks seasons after. I still limit him to non-high scoring bucks. (Think like <145” & mature). (I personally started at 14 & got a 1.5 year old and it was amazing!!). The deer my son can shoot- plenty for what HE WANTS. He’s hunted countless times & got nothing. I’ll be honest - all by design. Lots of “non-kill hunts” due to dad making it work out that way. ;). Still had a blast!! We could shoot a big buck first night if I wanted to allow that. I won’t allow it. That’s me. He’s put major time in. When he’s in late teens & i feel he EARNED the chance at a giant - ABSOLUTELY. He needs to EARN IT!!!! Much like when he buys his first car- he’s gonna buy a used decent vehicle he worked for. VS dad buying him a brand new truck.

I do understand this topic angers 2 sides & I don’t want that…. I get it… some dudes get pissed because there’s times when kids are USED to pick a competitive giant off before adults can go. YES- that’s very distasteful IMO. & yes, there’s other side that’s angry from other side “let the kids shoot what makes them happy!!!” “Don’t be a heartless SOB!!” I get it. & I get “let ‘em shoot first deer they see” (all good there). I get it- we know this creates some passionate positions & there’s some problems with it. Understood.



Overall- kids hunting - it’s a NET WIN. I wouldn’t change the season. It’s great, even if some questionable things happen. NET WIN. But- there’s some troubles with little kids shooting giants IMO. & yes, I am sure some on here have done it. Or will take kids to do it. I mean NO DISRESPECT!!!!! I will applaud u when u do!!! & please post em up & be proud!! Please don’t take this as a jab!! It’s honest mature dialogue!!


am I off base? Anyone else have these concerns? What’s your thoughts on what kids should shoot (& yes, it’s the adults that ultimately decide this). Kids are along for the ride & i want the best for these kids!!! What’s best for these kids in your opinion? Hot topic & i am open minded here. Sorry on long rant. U probably get where my head is at. Very open minded here!!! Thoughts?
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I have two boys- 20 & 16. The 20 year old never was able to youth hunt much on a good farm due to us not owning one when he was of age- the 16 year old was more fortunate & has hunted 3-4 youth seasons.

The older is much more appreciative of hunting in general & the whole idea of hunting & habitat in general. He enjoys spending time working on farm, foodplots, etc.
He passes many younger bucks & is looking for at least a 4 year old even tho he has not shot that many bucks.

The younger is more about the kill & reaping the rewards- due to time, & sports, travel, school etc. Which is fine too

Who knows if the youth season had anything to do with that but I think maybe it did a little.

I think to each his own, but I do agree with & like the idea of sitting in places where the chances are slim of getting a buck.
Shooting an older lower scoring buck is good too.
Bottom line is each kid & situation is different so do what’s best for your situation. I love to see the pictures of the bucks so keep ‘em coming!!
 
Definitely agree with letting the kids show the interest on their own. I don't have kids yet but I see ALL. THE. TIME. where it is SOOOO obvious that the kid is living their parent's dream (usually dad's). Dad was a good football player, he wants junior to be a good football player. But junior doesn't like getting hit and likes soccer better anyway but dad INSISTS his kid is gonna be Dan Marino. Or dad was 2 time state champion wrestler, by God his kids are gonna wrestle and he's gonna teach them everything he knows. But his kid likes playing basketball and can't stand rolling around on a mat with other sweaty dudes. Or maybe they like band and don't like sports at all. Doesn't matter.

Let your kid pursue what they are interested in, not what you want them to be interested in. There's other ways you can spend quality time with your kid. And if hunting is the only way to spend time with them, might be time to re-evaluate priorities.
 
Admittedly, I haven't read through ALL of the responses. Here's my 2 cents.

If you can put your kid on a giant, and they're excited about it, it would be silly not to try. That buck doesn't have any guarantees of living another day, and neither do you or your kid. There's a good possibility that may be the ONLY giant your kid ever has a crack at.

Whatever blows your hair back...

My oldest harvested a big one when he was 13, that I'd never laid eyes on until that day. Today my oldest is nearly 17 and an asshole to be around like 90% to 95% of the time. I'm glad we were able to make that memory together, because I don't know how many more we've got ahead of us, God willing.
 
Sligh1 said:
We could shoot a big buck first night if I wanted to allow that. I won’t allow it. That’s me. He’s put major time in. When he’s in late teens & i feel he EARNED the chance at a giant - ABSOLUTELY. He needs to EARN IT!!!!

am I off base?
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I agree with not buying my kid a brand new car, but what exactly does 'EARNED IT' mean when it comes to hunting / fishing? Most of it's about being in the right place at the right time. I've tagged out early some years and ground out seasons other years. Doesn't mean that I 'earned' one deer more than any other, or that I was 'lucky' the years I tagged out early. The only deer I had one of my kids pass on was a little fawn that still had a few spots. I just couldn't allow that deer to be shot for the small amount of meat we would have gotten out of it. I'd never deny a youth the opportunity to harvest a monster buck, if it legally presented. Never.

It's kind of like telling a kid that they can't catch a big fish until they've earned it, and only taking them to places where you think there aren't any big fish.

Or telling a young person that they can't date a hot girl / guy when they first start dating, because it will ruin them, and turn them off of dating or relationships all together.

Just seems silly to me.

Want to get kids hooked on hunting / fishing? Put good quantity and / or quality deer in front of them, with ample shooting opportunities. Put them on the fish, especially BIG fish!

Want to turn kids off of hunting / fishing? Avoid the best spots and sit / walk for hours upon hours with little to no action or success. (This is the exact reason ice fishing does not appeal to me as an avid sportsman. Too many boring hours freezing my ass off as a kid, with very little action.)

Just my opinion guys / gals.
 
Not just kids.... I have seen a lot of guys shoot a giant and never have much passion to hunt after that. They know they will never get a bigger one.
There are also plenty of stories of guys killing a true giant the first day they went hunting.

As far as who sticks with it, and who doesn't, is probably not tied to actually killing a monster. Many people have fads in their lives. Many are encouraged to do certain things
as they grow up. In many many cases people move on to "new" things as they change phases in life. Others have a passion for things.

My niece dropped a 209 net when she was 7 yrs old. She shot a few good ones after that. She now rodeos and dates more than hunts. Will she come back with a passion? Time will tell. I do know her and her daddy have a lifetime memory of walking out the back door and killing a true monster..... and truck after truck showing up to see the deer she shot. Most were happy for her, many were jealous losers. Some of those losers even lost their hunting spots due to their uncontrollable jealousy.
I do know that her and her daddy have a story from that day that brings tears to my eyes.(I have 4 hunting daughters so I know the feeling)

As a teacher/coach/father of 6, my advice would be to NEVER push a kid to the point of burn out. Whether it be band, football, or hunting. If they don't want to hunt one year that has to be fine. Many I have seen, take a year or two off, come back on their own, and stick with it. Those who are pushed/forced now have a bad taste for it.
 
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