Brassicas

[northcedar]

Haha that's cool. I had a nice thin acre of sugarbeets growing early this summer and the deer ate all the plants weeks ago! As planned, PTT and GFR got spread into the plot later summer and now are looking OK, with cereal rye spread heavy 2 weeks ago to fill in the gaps. I'd be surprised if there will be any beets left though.

 

[GO 1]

A couple of brassica questions.

1. I’ve heard people say that you should rotate brassicas every other year with green cereal grains like rye and oats. Why is this? What is the science behind this logic

2. I’ve also heard people say that you shouldn’t mix brassicas with rye and oats because the two plants compete with one another competing for nutrients. Then there are a ton of seed mixes that have all of these mixed together? What’s the truth on this? What’s the science tell us on this?

 

[Sligh1]

A couple of brassica questions.

1. I’ve heard people say that you should rotate brassicas every other year with green cereal grains like rye and oats. Why is this? What is the science behind this logic

2. I’ve also heard people say that you shouldn’t mix brassicas with rye and oats because the two plants compete with one another competing for nutrients. Then there are a ton of seed mixes that have all of these mixed together? What’s the truth on this? What’s the science tell us on this?

1) true. You can do brassicas 2 years max & id rotate. Disease & pests. & the nutrient & fertility cycling we are trying to do…… much like corn & beans rotated…. Too much of both in a row- lots of problems. One fixes a bit of Nitrogen (beans) & one eats a lot (corn). Brassicas eat nitrogen. They also scavenge & store it. Rye scavenges for N but peas &
Clover fix/create it. Could go on but rotate them.

2) IF we are growing brassicas to produce a proper brassica specific destination (which is legit & a great goal) - u do NOT want to mix in things like brassicas with rye or oats. They will compete for limited nitrogen & brassicas will lose. & they shouldn’t be planted at same time of year. So, aug 1 for example on Brassicsas…. Far too early for rye & oats & they will get rank & woody. Plant into September & it’s fine for rye & oats but too late for brassicas. They are incompatible for time of planting, competition & nutrients. ON ANOTHER SPIN: brassicas (radish) can be added to a rye, oat, clover, etc plot in mix but this is only for a bit of extra desirable browse. It will be a small radish with a bit of leafy top

WHY DO SEED COMPANIES DO THIS?….. in short: they don’t know what their doing . Or would appear so. The better reason - it’s a broad mix that will keep a “mediocre plot” guy happy. More variety so at least there’s a blend even though it’s far less than ideal. To 90% of folks - that’s better than nothing!!! & they do see results. It’s just not what it should or could be. Long story long ….. 90% of mixes I see are not formulated correctly IMO. Make ur own or go to a few pre mix companies that do it right. Very few. Mixing own is cheaper but far more importantly…. Gets right blend at right seeding time for right reasons.

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

2. I’ve also heard people say that you shouldn’t mix brassicas with rye and oats because the two plants compete with one another competing for nutrients. Then there are a ton of seed mixes that have all of these mixed together? What’s the truth on this? What’s the science tell us on this?

The main thing on this is they have two very different planting dates. Brassicas: end of July/beginning of August. Rye: ~Labor day or after.

There are a lot of "buck-on-a-bag" foodplot mixes that throw these together and one of the main reasons is rye is nearly fool proof. People see the plot becoming a sea of green from the rye and they are happy.

Here is the one that really kills me... you sometimes see RYE GRASS in these "Foodplot" mixes. That is borderline criminal IMO. Deer don't eat rye grass! (but it greens up quick)

 

[Mrc]

First time planting brassicas here in Ohio. Planted way to thick. Planted July 17th because we were going to get rain.Will these not get bulbs because they’re so thick?View attachment 123022

This is how they finished. Lots of bulbs but the deer didn’t eat them.

 

[Jbohn]

Deer crushed my Brassica plots this year every bulb was eaten into .. They where in them all year ..

 

[Sligh1]

This is how they finished. Lots of bulbs but the deer didn’t eat them.View attachment 124509

Very common. I’ve seen one farm take 5 years before they ate them. That’s rare but sometimes it’s 2-3 years….
“Well why would u plant them?!?” Because: they will eat them & it does become a dynamite food source for deer. It’s also building that soil, pulling/capturing nitrogen & breaking up compaction to a crazy degree. When those plants rot…. It’s literally holes in the ground. Water passes through. Earth worms ravage them & aerate the soil further. Builds organic matter, on & on. Fantastic soil building cover crop.

KEEP AT IT!!!! The one thing that helps get them eating “quicker”…. Go slightly heavier in radish. It’s going to be the first one they will start to like. They will start on the leafy top. & plant another food source right next to it (clovers, rye mix, grain, whatever) so they graze with heads down next to brassicas all the time & constantly have faces next to them while eating. After couple years- they will be ravaging bulbs & hammering purple top turnips. They literally will destroy a plot ripping them out of the ground. Patience & stick with it.

 

[IowaBowHunter1983]

100% agree with skip. It's unexplainable to me but brassicas seems to be an acquired taste. I guess like beer and coffee to some peeps.

 

[Mrc]

They ate the tops pretty well but not the bulbs. Until the end of December I had corn in the feeder and they were hitting that. I thought when the corn emptied they would hit the bulbs. Spot sprayed any weeds with roundup today and am going to frost seed clover in the next couple weeks.

 

[Sligh1]

They ate the tops pretty well but not the bulbs. Until the end of December I had corn in the feeder and they were hitting that. I thought when the corn emptied they would hit the bulbs. Spot sprayed any weeds with roundup today and am going to frost seed clover in the next couple weeks.

Frost seed as heavy as u able. Just a $ issue. I’ve doubled rates on clover for maybe an extra $30-40 an acre (whatever) & worth it imo. Brassicas are gonna have allopathic effect that keeps other plants from growing. They really do slow the weeds way down. My work around is to go with a high rate on clover. & when I do- turns out ok. The weed suppression is a big bonus as well & it can go from dead brassicas to lush Clover with far less weeds if u seed it heavily.
*probably don’t need gly in future… but won’t hurt that u did it. Too cold - unless you’re down south. No harm with it - just not going to do much unless u way further south & weeds actively growing.

 

[cybball]

I'm planning on burning down my clover this year and planting brassicas (been 3 years of clover now). When doing this, I saw skip's vid showing you used 24D and Gly. What ratiio? Also, looks like a lot of people do brassica in mid summer. I want to do brassica and some plot screen on the same 3/4 acre plot. Suggestions on timnig for all of this? Leave clover until summer? Or burn it with spraying in spring and plant? Thanks! ( I did brassica year one and they grew great, but I haven't rotated from clover to brassica yet).

 

[Mrc]

Frost seed as heavy as u able. Just a $ issue. I’ve doubled rates on clover for maybe an extra $30-40 an acre (whatever) & worth it imo. Brassicas are gonna have allopathic effect that keeps other plants from growing. They really do slow the weeds way down. My work around is to go with a high rate on clover. & when I do- turns out ok. The weed suppression is a big bonus as well & it can go from dead brassicas to lush Clover with far less weeds if u seed it heavily.
*probably don’t need gly in future… but won’t hurt that u did it. Too cold - unless you’re down south. No harm with it - just not going to do much unless u way further south & weeds actively growing.

I’m in northeast Ohio but the temperature was 60 yesterday.The roundup will work if the temperatures over 50 and the plants are green when you spray. The only difference is it will take a long time to kill. I did it a few years ago in December during a warm spell.By spring everything is yellow. It’s a great time to spray perennial beds around the house.You don’t have to worry about the dormant plants but anything green will be killed before summer. If you don’t think it will work try spraying you’re yard on a warm day in the winter.

 

[Sligh1]

I'm planning on burning down my clover this year and planting brassicas (been 3 years of clover now). When doing this, I saw skip's vid showing you used 24D and Gly. What ratiio? Also, looks like a lot of people do brassica in mid summer. I want to do brassica and some plot screen on the same 3/4 acre plot. Suggestions on timnig for all of this? Leave clover until summer? Or burn it with spraying in spring and plant? Thanks! ( I did brassica year one and they grew great, but I haven't rotated from clover to brassica yet).

Read label on 2,4-d. Different esters are more potent than others. It’ll have a rate. I personally run gly heavy, maybe 64 oz per acre + ammonium sulfate. Wait a week or bit more before seeding. I spray about mid July & seed a week or 10 days after that.


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[Tmayer13]

I'm planning on burning down my clover this year and planting brassicas (been 3 years of clover now). When doing this, I saw skip's vid showing you used 24D and Gly. What ratiio? Also, looks like a lot of people do brassica in mid summer. I want to do brassica and some plot screen on the same 3/4 acre plot. Suggestions on timnig for all of this? Leave clover until summer? Or burn it with spraying in spring and plant? Thanks! ( I did brassica year one and they grew great, but I haven't rotated from clover to brassica yet).

If you dont want to use 24D, you can get 52 or 52% gly and it will work just as well. I sprayed some really thick clover with in last year and smoked it. 1-2 qts per acre with AMS. I would rather use gly when I can as I find 24d to just be nasty stuff, although I do use it in some applications.

Just another option.

 

[Tmayer13]

This is how they finished. Lots of bulbs but the deer didn’t eat them.View attachment 124509

Last year the deer did not hardly touch my brassicas, this year totally different story, nearly all are eaten.

 

[Daver]

Last year the deer did not hardly touch my brassicas, this year totally different story, nearly all are eaten.

The deers have always fully consumed ANY crop we have out for them, brassicas included. But I have heard from many different people over the years that it can a year or two to get them going on brassicas. Apparently those deers are either otherwise more well fed or perhaps snootier than the beasts that live on our place.

 

[Mrc]

I’m in northeast Ohio but the temperature was 60 yesterday.The roundup will work if the temperatures over 50 and the plants are green when you spray. The only difference is it will take a long time to kill. I did it a few years ago in December during a warm spell.By spring everything is yellow. It’s a great time to spray perennial beds around the house.You don’t have to worry about the dormant plants but anything green will be killed before summer. If you don’t think it will work try spraying you’re yard on a warm day in the winter.

For those that think roundup won’t work in the winter this is the edge I sprayed in February. You can see it starting to yellow. I frost seeded clover into my brassicas today. I sprayed any grasses or other green weeds in the brassicas in February so now the clover will have a head start.

 

[Sligh1]

For those that think roundup won’t work in the winter this is the edge I sprayed in February. You can see it starting to yellow. I frost seeded clover into my brassicas today. I sprayed any grasses or other green weeds in the brassicas in February so now the clover will have a head start.View attachment 124616

Ya- u are right. If things are “green” it will work. Most things are green by me. All it needs is any bit of active photosynthesis & any active growing to kill. Good point though & interesting the results!!!!

 

[Jbohn]

Question , been planting beans which get crushed and then drilling turnips into it each year for last 2 years , since I am rotating with the beans am I safe to continue this ? I know your not suppose to plant turnips on top of turnips but since I am planting beans for a few months . You guys feel like that's safe.. ?

 

[Tmayer13]

Question , been planting beans which get crushed and then drilling turnips into it each year for last 2 years , since I am rotating with the beans am I safe to continue this ? I know your not suppose to plant turnips on top of turnips but since I am planting beans for a few months . You guys feel like that's safe.. ?

I believe disease cycle takes 6 months of a GROWING crop to break