Cereal Grains and cover crops

[whitetail fanatic]

Note: see previous post for a description of these pics.
June 25th

Deer have been heavily browsing the red clover all spring, summer, and fall

 

[whitetail fanatic]

I planted several plots with the rye and red clover, and did not mow any of them until July 10th, by which time the rye had all seeded out and turned brown. This was about 100# rye and 12# red clover per acre, and the rye did not crowd it out at all. I never dreamed I could grow such a nice weed free clover plot. I had always spring planted it and ended up with lots of weeds. Planting clover with rye in late summer like Lickcreek suggests is the perfect way to get clover started. The only reason I mowed it was to freshen the clover up and to keep it from getting overly mature.
The pics below (taken 10-9-11 last weekend) was one of the plots planted August 2010 and was mowed once on July 10 and never again all year. The deer have kept it clipped to 4" all year!! It probably would have needed mowing a couple more times if it had not been for the heavy browsing from the deer. They kept it mowed for me.
thanks to late August seeding with rye not a single weed to be found! You might notice in a few spots, there is actually rye that reseeded itself after I mowed it in July and the seed layed there until we got enough rain to germinate it. The only spots where that happeded was where the thatch from mowing was so thick that it actuallly killed the clover out, allowing a spot for the rye to reseed. Otherwise, the clover just drowned everything out.

 

[whitetail fanatic]

Now for some pics of this year's seeding of rye/radish/clover. Planted 100# rye, 7# radish, and 12# of Mammoth red OR 12# of Crimson clover per acre.
Did about 30% of the total acreage with the crimson, and the rest got mammoth red for comparison. According to Sagitarius who posts on here, the Crimson should survive our winter.
All of the following pics were the mix noted above and planted the same day, August 16, 2011. The soil was bone dry from the drought we had this summer, so the seed sat there until we finally got the first good rain in 2 months or more, on August 23rd. The seed was germinating within a day or 2after that.
Soils quality varies greatly across the areas that I planted. Everything was seeded at the same rates with a grain drill, and same amount of chicken litter plus urea/potash/DAP on everything. Where the soil was loose with good amounts of organic matter, the radishes are growing much faster, like this:

and getting some nice sized roots already

Where the soil is compacted and low in organic matter, the difference is day and night. Notice the difference in the left to right side of this pic. The radishes will hardly even grow in some spots, which leaves only rye and clover

Working on improving some really poor soils in places like this. Now I know where to go heavier on the chicken litter next year. Notice how the clover does much better than the radish, or even the rye in these spots

 

[whitetail fanatic]

another pic showing healthy soils on the bottom, poor soil on the top

7 Foot tall 3rd year stand of CIR Swithgrass behind this plot! It was burned May 20, 2011, going into it's 3rd growth season.

Notice the 7 foot tall 3rd year CIR Switchgrass towering over the top of these deer!

 

[whitetail fanatic]

Hey guys just wondering if any of you got much for snow? We have got pry 4-5 inches and it is still snowing. Just wondering if the rye mix gets covered up how well the deer dig for it? I am adding it to my plot next year just wondering how well it attracts them after snow?

We had 10" of snow over our rye, clover, radish plot and this weekend it was all torn up by deer feeding in it. The only thing left for them to eat in those plots of ours now is the rye because the radish have been devoured by now and the clover is tiny at best (until spring when it explodes with growth). I'll try to get some pictures this coming weekend. I've seen them dig through almost 2 feet of snow to get at radish, rye, turnips, alfalfa, etc. Like Paul says, if you have good cover nearby, and have the deer trained to feed in your plots by providing year round food sources, they will eat whatever is there, even rye that is only a couple inches tall and buried under deep snow.

 

[dbltree]

Thanks so much for the great pics and updates Wes! Very helpful to everyone following this thread! :way:

 

[Sligh1]

No kidding, that is text book/magazine quality stuff right there, looking awesome. You must have some amazing hunting up there on your farm!! how has the hunting changed on your managed piece over the years? a ton better than when you got it I would imagine? A lot better than most avg WI pieces I would assume as well? Looking good!

 

[whitetail fanatic]

No kidding, that is text book/magazine quality stuff right there, looking awesome. You must have some amazing hunting up there on your farm!! how has the hunting changed on your managed piece over the years? a ton better than when you got it I would imagine? A lot better than most avg WI pieces I would assume as well? Looking good!

Thanks guys! The changes have been very dramatic since we started intense habitat improvements and food plots 15 years ago. Before we started, our 195 acres did not hold many deer because the cover was not as good, and we didn't have food plots, and we are surrounded by professional farmers who grow some awesome alfalfa, corn and beans. Now we can't keep the deer away. Far better than the average WI hunting. Most areas of our state has very low deer numbers now because of over 15 years of heavy doe kills. We have taken quite a few 4.5 and 5.5 year old bucks the past 7 years on this farm, all of them with the bow and arrow. We have to take a good number of does every year to keep from getting overrun with them because our habitat has become so attractive. As Paul stresses, great cover and centrally located year round food sources is the key. We also make sure there is very little human disturbance from late August until after deer hunting seasons close each year on the farm. Basically the only disturbance during that time is walking in and out from bowhunting.

 

[plainjim]

SucraSeed (Oregon) Sweet Spot-Northern Mix question

I have 30 acres of partially logged private forest land located in the Colville National forest of NE Washington State. It borders Nat forest and is at elev 3,600'. Summers are hot & dry with very cold winters, precip is less than 18"/year. This is not farmland, no crops in the area so Whitetail deer density is lower than you have in the midwest but still a decent population in the area. I am an Avid bowhunter and only hunt this property during the Nov rut hunt. I would like to plant a fall attractant crop on the small openings and logging skid trails on the property. What is your opinion of the SucraSeed Sweet Spot mix for this purpose? I know that you advise using Winter rye (grain crop) over Ryegrass and I do like the mix that you recomend but my situation might be different than most. There is abundant natural browse during Spring and Summer months so am looking for something to attract and hold deer during Nov/Dec when natural browse is dying out. Need something to withstand dry and cold conditions. Soil PH is in the good range and not much in the way of fertilizer is needed. Some of these skid trails are shaded and some in more open areas. Looking for advice.

 

[plainjim]

More information to above post

Information and ingredients for the Sucraseed-Sweet Spot-Northern Mix can be found at http://www.outsidepride.com/seed/deer-food-plots/sweet-spot-northern-mix.html. Instead of winter rye it has AberDart and AberAvon High Sugar Perennial Ryegrass seed along with other things. Will this Ryegrass be as desirable to the deer in November as winter rye? Would it work better on my logging skid trails? BTW my property is located in USDA plant hardiness zone 5 at 3,600' elev.

 

[dbltree]

My brother lived in your area of WA for a while before moving to Idaho so I am familiar with the soils and lack of rainfall. He has to irrigate even in Idaho to grow anything at all so I have doubts that either the SucraSeed mix or winter rye will grow.

That said winter rye is far more drought resistant then the high sugar ryegrass but you may need to experiment with both and see if either might survive? We had severe drought here in Iowa this summer....and almost nothing survived.

Keep us posted whatever you try...I'd love to hear what you come up with?

 

[plainjim]

another option

Thanks for replying. I know what you are saying. It is difficult conditions but I will try different options untill I find something that works but relying on September rain for germination has poor odds of happening. Another thing I have considered is to plant the Whitetail Institute Imperial Extreme mix (http://www.whitetailinstitute.com/products/extreme.html) in the Spring after the snowmelt when soils are wet and we do get Spring rain in April/May. They claim that it will survive with 15" or more of rain, is heat resistant and cold tolerant. However I don't know if this is just hype and it is not clear what seeds are in the mix. I also don't know if it would be a good Fall attractant or freeze out before late hunting season? Do you have any opinion or knowledge about this option? Thanks.

 

[dbltree]

Thanks for replying. I know what you are saying. It is difficult conditions but I will try different options untill I find something that works but relying on September rain for germination has poor odds of happening. Another thing I have considered is to plant the Whitetail Institute Imperial Extreme mix (http://www.whitetailinstitute.com/products/extreme.html) in the Spring after the snowmelt when soils are wet and we do get Spring rain in April/May. They claim that it will survive with 15" or more of rain, is heat resistant and cold tolerant. However I don't know if this is just hype and it is not clear what seeds are in the mix. I also don't know if it would be a good Fall attractant or freeze out before late hunting season? Do you have any opinion or knowledge about this option? Thanks.

Sorry I have no experience with that product but perhaps someone else may have? Most of us are fortunate to have enough rainfall to not need something like that so probably not a lot of use in the Midwest

 

[SWBUCKHNTR]

Just thought I would let everyone know gurneys has winter rye on sale right now!!!!!! It is marked down to the special price of $14.99/lb and will cover an amazing 5,000 sq feet. Don't hesitate order today. I can't believe what some people will buy.

 

[Nontypcl1]

Another season gone and the same outcome as years past.

2 acres of soybeans.... Gone (fenced until gun 1)
3 acres of turnips and radishes... devoured.
1 acre of chicory/clover... dormant and not feeding much
2 acres of rye mix... mowed short but still feeding plenty of deer :way:

once again it's almost February and the rye is pretty much the only food source left around my place. Well, that and whatever native browse that is still within reach

 

[dbltree]

Another season gone and the same outcome as years past.

2 acres of soybeans.... Gone (fenced until gun 1)
3 acres of turnips and radishes... devoured.
1 acre of chicory/clover... dormant and not feeding much
2 acres of rye mix... mowed short but still feeding plenty of deer :way:

once again it's almost February and the rye is pretty much the only food source left around my place. Well, that and whatever native browse that is still within reach

Gotta love that report! That's news we can use right there...thanks! :way:

 

[whitetail fanatic]

Here are some pictures showing how much the deer have been digging through the snow to get at our rye. These plots were a mix of 12# red clover, 100# rye, and 7# GHFR. The deer have pretty much clean up all the radishes by now, so the rye is all that's left. I know I didn't get any pictures that show it clearly, but the rye is nice and green under all that snow.

 

[IQDM]

I took a walk today in the strip plots in search of sheds... No Luck, but the plots look good yet and there is still plenty of food!

Soybeans:

The Brassicas have been stripped, but there is still plenty available under the snow:

Corn/Soybeans... Still looking good:

Cereal grain mix looks rough from a distance, but if you get close you can see that there is plenty of green left in there! :

I feel that I have a deer herd that is lower than the carrying capacity of my area. Add that to the fact that this winter has been very easy on the local deer herd, leaves me set for food until spring green up :way:

 

[SEIowaDeerslayer]

Very nice! Your deer sure don't have to worry about going hungry. Every cornfield near our farm is picked clean.

 

[dbltree]

Thanks for the great pics fellas! :way:

February 12, 2012

The strip plots have been pounded relentlessly and those not quite large enough to keep up with the grazing pressure seem to have little left to offer

The once lush brassicas are grazed to the dirt as have the rye/oats/peas/radish combo

Yet...closer inspection reveals the still green winter rye

and remnants of the Groundhog forage radish

along with the rye keep them coming back

and the baby red clover is waiting silently for spring to arrive

in the brassica strips what at first appears to be nothing more then dirt...still holds prizes

as the turnip and radish roots continue to feed deer

the combination of crops is holding deer at a time when most food sources are long ago...gone

but are the deer really still feeding in our plots? The rye is grazed to the dirt....are you sure they are still coming???

You betcha I'm sure...

Note the dates....snow or shine...they keep coming back

The right combination of crops all planted within each feeding area will insure that your whitetails done' end up finding the neighbors place more attractive. Year around food sources are a hedge against them getting killed on the road, by poachers or hung in a fence if they have to travel to find food to survive.

Keep them home and adapt them to very predictable patterns by utilizing the following example....

Plant ALL in one plot in strips or blocks

Alice (or comparable) white clover 10% of plot, sow at 6#'s per acre with the rye combination in the fall or in the spring with oats and berseem clover. Correct Ph and P&K with soil tests

Brassicas in 45% of plot

Purple Top Turnips 3#
Dwarf Essex Rape 2#
GroundHog Forage radish 5#

Plant in mid to late July in most Midwest states, or 60-90 days before your first killing frost, Use 200#'s of 46-0-0 urea and 400#'s of 6-28-28 per acre. Follow the dead brassicas with oats and berseem or crimson clover in mid spring at 60#'s oats and 12-15#'s berseem clover and/or 50#'s of chickling vetch)

Cereal Grain combo in 45% of plot

Winter rye 50-80#'s per acre (56#'s = a bushel)
Spring oats 80-120#'s per acre (32#'s = a bushel)
Austrian Winter Peas or 4010/6040 Forage peas 20-80#'s per acre
Red Clover 8-12#'s per acre or white clover at 6#'s per acre (or 20-40 pounds hairy vetch and 20-30#'s crimson clover on sandy soils)
Groundhog Forage Radish 5#'s per acre

Plant in late August to early September, if following well fertilized brassicas use 100 - 200#'s of urea, if starting a new plot add 400#'s of 6-28-28

Rotate the brassicas and rye combo each year