Native Warm Season Grass

Discussion in 'Dbltree's corner' started by dbltree, Jan 12, 2006.

  1. Jbohn

    Jbohn Active Member

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    Just remember to mow no lower than 12-18 inches .. Id hit it with Platuea / Panoramic if it's a tolerant mix and don't worry about mowing it. Just my 2 cents..
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2015
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  3. streitl

    streitl New Member

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    I wish I had got a plateau tolerant mix. I don't believe mine is however. The farmer who mowed it for me has put in CRP for years, and he has a new planting this year as well. This is mowed at probably 6" or so. I know it's a little shorter than what Paul recommended (8-12" if I recall). I trusted my neighbor mostly because I didn't have much other choice, and because of his experience. Probably a couple more mowings this year and maybe one early next year, and if I'm lucky, it'll come in fairly well. I figure if I'm a little sparse in a few areas, maybe dormant seed some forbes in a few years.
     
  4. DannyBoy

    DannyBoy Well-Known Member

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    Shouldn't be a problem mowing low or having bare spots Landon. Some of the DNR seedings in NW Iowa we mowed low like your yard 3 times the first year and they are some of the best seedings around. Most of the seed thAt has germinated is working on establishing roots right now, not so much reaching for sunlight. Different case next year, mow it twice a little higher.
     
  5. IowaBowHunter1983

    IowaBowHunter1983 Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Need some opinions.

    My planting is doing so-so. Field was super clean brome. It's all gone, but grab-grass has invaded and is everywhere.

    Option 1: Spray with something to wipe out crabgrass that wont affect the "good stuff". Planting was Big Blue, Indiangrass, CIR Switch, Slender wheat, Virginia wild-rye.

    Option 2: Wait a few months for NWSG dormancy (Mid-October?) and just smoke with roundup.

    Just mowed it yesterday to hit some foxtail and weeds. I set mower just above the height of the tallest good-stuff.

    Thanks.

    [​IMG]
     
  6. Barrett's Dad

    Barrett's Dad Member

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    With option 1, sounds like quinclorac might work for you. Dbltree stated this in his Herbicide sticky post:

    "DriveĀ® XLR8 (quinclorac) same as Paramount and safe for foxtail control in switchgrass and big bluestem"

    You would need to check the other items in your planting to see if they can be safely sprayed with this stuff....if not, sounds like you are looking at option 2.

    I use quinclorac in my yard to control crabgrass and foxtail....and it sounds like those are your two worst weed culprits at this point. Both can be a bear to deal with....

    Good luck with whatever you choose.
     
  7. Sligh1

    Sligh1 Administrator Staff Member

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    Quinclorac is "so so" in my experience on both foxtail and crabgrass. Worth a shot and like anything I'm sure it's more effective on smaller/younger weeds. If it's smothering things obviously ur mowing is the ticket. Both are not real aggressive second yr. u could likely mow this summer and not have much of either next yr even if u don't spray. Very well could spray when dormant and/or spray a spring residual & round up early next year before ur desirables are up. If u have any cool season grasses in ur mix- I'd avoid ur fall or spring spraying though. I'd hit with quinclorac and keep mowed for this year and I think ur prob is solved is bottom line and pry what I'd do.
     
  8. Jbohn

    Jbohn Active Member

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    Will Canadian Rye come back each year have a bit of it in a first year seeding ? Choked me out a bit.
     
  9. HorseDoctor

    HorseDoctor PMA Member

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    Seeded some Canadian wild rye in a native warm season planting 6 or 7 years ago & there is still some there. Holding it's own.
     
  10. Jbohn

    Jbohn Active Member

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    ANybody know if Oust sprayed in the fall will keep it from coming back ? or Platuea/ Panoramic to clean it up and get rid of the canadian rye.
     
  11. HorseDoctor

    HorseDoctor PMA Member

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    You certain it's Canadian wild rye? I've not found it to be very aggressive????
     
  12. jerad

    jerad Member

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    From what I have seen the Canad Wild Rye tends to come in thick the first year and then less and less each year when more of the other natives come in
     
  13. Jbohn

    Jbohn Active Member

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    I think I will burn off this spring. Add some Atrazine and try to keep it mowed next year. Should do the trick.
     
  14. Jbohn

    Jbohn Active Member

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    Does anyone burn every year or is that a bad idea, my stand seems Purdy thick so I am thinking I should burn this would be 3rd growing season. Thanks feels like every 3-4 years would really choke out..
     
  15. IowaBowHunter1983

    IowaBowHunter1983 Super Moderator Staff Member

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    Was able to bust out the de-thatcher today on some dead brome. Good tool to have in the barn. :) Burning now for better soil contact later when frost seeding some goodies.


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  16. IowaBowHunter1983

    IowaBowHunter1983 Super Moderator Staff Member

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    ....opinions on timing of 2,4-D application to NWSG plantings.

    What do you think best time to smoke some weeds is?
    Early spring? fall? doesn't matter? I almost destroyed some switch years ago by pushing to envelope on doing it too soon on a new planting. Im looking at year 2 stuff so that is a non issue now.

    Curious what others think.
     
  17. Sligh1

    Sligh1 Administrator Staff Member

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    2,4-d on natives.... Cautious on young plants- you can kill young plants easily. I can't recall technical specifics... Something along the lines of 3+ stems, 6" or something. Now, reality.... 2,4-d is hard on plants, especially young plants and with heat. So.... if it were ME... I'd most likely wait until the grasses are 12" or so. Now, when you're talking dormant sprayings.... I'd skip 2,4-d and run something like Plateau on established grasses. Now, if your goal is Indian and Big Blue - go full steam with Plateau, 12 oz per acre. Established switch, you can run plateau and it will not hurt established but the new seed the switch puts down will not germinate at high Plateau levels.
    I'd look at long lasting Pre-emergents and Plateau is about the best there is. Some use Oust. With success. oust scares me & I've used it many times in past but it makes me nervous for a lot of reasons. 2,4-d would fit into my NWSG when plants are "bigger" and didn't need/want to mow and pressure was from stuff like broadleaves like PW, WH, etc. So, an application, let's say lower temperatures, mid July would be an example.

    If you have specifics on NWSG species, when planted, etc, be great to know.
     
  18. IowaBowHunter1983

    IowaBowHunter1983 Super Moderator Staff Member

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    3 scenarios that need attention (prolly be fine EVENTUALLY doing nothing, but want to help them to best cover ASAP)

    BB, IG, CIR switch, Slender wheat, Virginia WR: Planted spring 2015
    BB, IG, CIR switch: Frost seeded winter 2016
    Straight CIR: frost seeded winter 2016
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2016
  19. Sligh1

    Sligh1 Administrator Staff Member

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    Examples of some methods. Like ANYTHING, there's always multiple methods, tools, circumstances, etc that can be done or needed. EXAMPLES...
    "BB, IG, CIR switch, Slender wheat, Virginia WR: Planted spring 2015"....
    2,4-d on a cooler day. You have all grasses there. If you have broadleaf issues, 2,4-D would be great on established grasses. If you have stuff like Foxtail (not as likely on a 2nd year stand), quinclorac. Another option is Plateau using it post emergent (label) in addition or alone to others. Mowing is yet another option. Now, 2nd year, if it's not thick, it could need some interseeding again either dormant or spring. I could go on and on with this. Interseeding especially, a lot of options and herbicides depending on situation.

    BB, IG, CIR switch: Frost seeded winter 2016
    Mow. Herbicide front: 2,4-d and possibly Quinclorac when plants are well established and clearly growing well. I'm ok with Plateau on new switchgrass up to 2 oz per acre on non germinated but usually avoid it period. Established, you could add some as well. If it were me, I'd probably just mow higher periodically.

    Straight CIR: frost seeded winter 2016
    Mow. Herbicides post emergent.... Additional atrazine. 2,4-d same situation, very cautiously. Quinclorac.

    All of these have other herbicides that are varying in effectiveness. They are "tools", not solutions or guarantees. flexibility & follow up is always needed obviously. back up plans as far as complete failures are always on my list. But, you planted early and I think if you simply keep canopy open, you're likely fine (herbicides or mowing). Planting early is smart! Well done. This dry time right now is making me nervous on some stuff I finished up with that got in late. We'll see.

    Reminder for folks, just Native grasses..... If I want a solid stand of grasses, I try to put into 3 or 4 categories as treating them is much easier. I have all types of grasses but I break them up so they are easier to manage or establish....

    Straight Switchgrass - I do some of this. Frost seeded & IDEAL is in clean bean stubble that had premium weed control the prior year in beans (low weed seed bed) - High rates of atrazine & I usually mix gly or Liberty herbicide and often I spray 2 times in spring. Watch for foxtail, pigweed, waterhemp, grabgrass, etc (solution for all).

    Switch & Big Blue mix - same as above EXCEPT BB will germinate slightly earlier/more easily (no stratification needed). Both are lovers of Atrazine. Atrazine, again, needs CLEAN SOIL with as little residue as possible, soil contact with atrazine critical and your weed seed bank is going to define how difficult management will be.

    Indian & Big Blue mix - possibly my favorite for EASE of planting. I purposely leave out Switch because not Plateau Tolerant at high rates. Love Plateua.... 12-14 oz per acre with complete kill with round-up or Liberty. Weed control is sick with high rates of Plateau, probably one of the best residual pre-emergents I've ever seen. All season control with very few weeds if used at high rates. Now, there's only about 4-5 native grasses that can tolerate 12+ oz of Plateau so that's why I do BB & Indian. Only 2-3 forbs can tolerate it as well (off top of my head, IL bundleflower, Partridge pea, etc). But, if I just want a thick stand of natives, fast, last minute or I just like them OR if I'm planting into "poor quality soil" - Indian & BB with heavy Plateau is my go-to.

    I'll do some mixes that are Plateau tolerant & lower the rates BUT I plan on mowing.

    Last, mix of ANY kind, you name it, throw it in & just make sure you have blasted your fields to kill weeds, several times if needed..... Plan on mowing as needed, to keep canopy open. This year, my fields with no pre-emergents, I hit these fields once with round-up, crop oil, AMS & 2,4-d knowing it would be a couple weeks before planting. Before planting, I again hit freshly emerged weeds with Liberty & AMS and then planted. Got the last flush of weeds fried. I'll still be mowing though.

    Good luck to you guys on the plantings.
     
  20. southcentral

    southcentral Member

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    I planted 48 acres into a nwsg mix this spring. It also contained clover and alfalfa. The broad leaves are approximately a foot tall. I sprayed with a heavy dose of gly prior to seeding. I'm concerned if I mowed now the cut trash would smother out the new seedlings. What should I do the rest of this year, and any recommendations for next spring as well? I believe the mix was big blue, little blue, Virginia wild rye, clover and alfalfa.
     
  21. southcentral

    southcentral Member

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    I just looked up my seed plan. It had Indian grass, not little blue if that matters.
     

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