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HR 43 and 44

I said it before and will say it again. The reason for this bill has nothing to do with whats best for the youth. It really shouldn't even be part of the discussion. The special interest groups and the the writer of this bill are the ones who will benefit and it all comes down to $$$. The early season bill is the same way. Who really benefits from this? So we have a couple people on this thread who say it would be nice because of time restraints but I really doubt those are the people who wrote the bill or the reason the bill was written in the first place. Sligh is right. why don't we see these bills or discussions for pheasants or turkeys? Pretty simple, thats not where the money is. Just my 2 cents.
 
Hawk32 said:
I said it before and will say it again. The reason for this bill has nothing to do with whats best for the youth. It really shouldn't even be part of the discussion. The special interest groups and the the writer of this bill are the ones who will benefit and it all comes down to $$$. The early season bill is the same way. Who really benefits from this? So we have a couple people on this thread who say it would be nice because of time restraints but I really doubt those are the people who wrote the bill or the reason the bill was written in the first place. Sligh is right. why don't we see these bills or discussions for pheasants or turkeys? Pretty simple, thats not where the money is. Just my 2 cents.
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I wonder about the NR/outfitter angle on this proposed legislation.
 
bradley said:
I want to know if everyones concern is Iowa's deer herd then what is worse for the herd?Shooting a buck in an early season or shooting a doe in the regular season?If it is the herd then I would have to say shooting a doe in the regular season.If you shoot a doe you are potentionally taking out 2-3 deer per harvest.Taking a buck is only taking 1 deer.So it is hard for me to believe that most of you are using the population of the herd to make your judgement on an early buck season.
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You are missing a major point here..... AGE STRUCTURE. This is a huge thing that separates Iowa from everyone else.
 
IowaBowHunter1983 said:
You are missing a major point here..... AGE STRUCTURE. This is a huge thing that separates Iowa from everyone else.
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While I MAYBE agree, why should maintaining that be a priority for us? Also, if we change things, how much of that will really be lost? If hunter "A" is happy with a 1.5 year old buck but hunter "B" is mature bucks only, is it really wrong for hunter "A" to harvest what he or she is happy with?
 
150 Class said:
While I MAYBE agree, why should maintaining that be a priority for us? Also, if we change things, how much of that will really be lost? If hunter "A" is happy with a 1.5 year old buck but hunter "B" is mature bucks only, is it really wrong for hunter "A" to harvest what he or she is happy with?
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Maybe it isn't a priority to you, but if it isn't a major consideration on regulation decisions you will end of like a state like Michigan.

If hunter "A" is happy to shoot a 1.5 year old he/she certainly doesn't need a 3 week season in September to do it. Meanwhile, a September season would have a major LONGTERM impact on hunter "B". Hunter "B" would actually realize a short-term "benefit" from a September season. However, the long term conservation should never be sacrificed for the short term gain.

If the DNR started having antler restriction regulations you would have a much better argument as it relates to hunters choice on what can and cannot be shot. Your argument as it relates to these regulations is really a square peg in a round hole.
 
150 Class said:
While I MAYBE agree, why should maintaining that be a priority for us? Also, if we change things, how much of that will really be lost? If hunter "A" is happy with a 1.5 year old buck but hunter "B" is mature bucks only, is it really wrong for hunter "A" to harvest what he or she is happy with?
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Then we may as well move our gun season into the rut and be like every other state around us.
Is it wrong- in answer to ur question- BIOLOGICALLY - yes. Yes, it is better for a variety of reasons to have a balanced age structure. For "let's blast what makes me happy" - no, doesn't make any difference. I came from a state where everyone killed every 1.5 yr old they saw. The amount of folks who complained how crappy the hunting is was staggering. Most those folks left to hunt better regulated states. Folks wanna put regs in place that will allow our age structure to be destroyed- that's a disaster for our herd and young bucks. What a shame we have to defend such a well managed, regulated and balanced system. We r lucky how incredible it is considering we have 4 months already to kill bucks with little habitat vs other states. And folks with agendas just cant leave it alone.
 
Hawk32 said:
I said it before and will say it again. The reason for this bill has nothing to do with whats best for the youth. It really shouldn't even be part of the discussion. The special interest groups and the the writer of this bill are the ones who will benefit and it all comes down to $$$. The early season bill is the same way. Who really benefits from this? So we have a couple people on this thread who say it would be nice because of time restraints but I really doubt those are the people who wrote the bill or the reason the bill was written in the first place. Sligh is right. why don't we see these bills or discussions for pheasants or turkeys? Pretty simple, thats not where the money is. Just my 2 cents.
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I agree, the x bow for youth is obviously nothing more than a stepping stone towards allowing them in regular bow season. After all, it's for the kids, who is going to say no to that? Heaven forbid my son or daughter have to over come any challenges while learning to hunt. Why not allow them to use a 223, 22/250 or 243? Low recoil, very accurate, very deadly on a deer with a properly placed shot. It's for the kids, right?

As far as the early bow season, I'm not as clear on who's agenda that is but it smells fishy to me. IMO we already have an extremely generous bow season, adding to it is simply ridiculous. If you cannot find time to hunt now, you never will. My biggest fear at this point with this season is something that has been mentioned earlier in this thread, could this be a stepping stone to moving shotgun season into November, maybe giving a couple extra weeks to those seasons as well? After all, how fair would it be to give bow hunters a 3 month head start and then allow the gun hunters only a weekend or two?
 
The vast majority of deer killed every year are young immature deer. It's very apparent at meat lockers during the gun seasons. So if a bow hunter is lucky enough to shoot a mature deer during an early bow season. I don't see how that hurts the age structure. Old gets replaced by young. Does shooting mature deer hurt the age structure? I'm not sure it does, but I may be wrong?
 
1) Iowa ranks much higher (statistics, happy to supply) for less immature bucks shot and more mature bucks shot than vast majority of states (unless from my recollection you get into the vast states with few hunters like Wyoming for example).

2) Folks who want to shoot 1.5 year olds, by definition, will never be hindered by guys wanting to go after more mature bucks. Actually to the contrary- they will be helped by all the bucks passed by others. By definition, more 1.5 year olds killed does impact the guys wanting to hunt more mature animals.

3) Almost FOUR MONTHS of buck hunting in Iowa, 6 seasons and 4 weapons. LET ME ASK YOU THIS TO ANYONE WHO WANTS MORE SEASONS, MORE WEAPONS, etc - A LOGICAL QUESTION/ANALOGY I WANT SOME THOUGHT PUT INTO PLEASE....

Why do you think we are not ever hearing of any "early pheasant season" being proposed each year??? We have DRASTICALLY LOST PHEASANT HUNTERS. Why do we see almost no regulation suggestions at any time on pheasants but deer is messed with with multiple bills each year? Deer #'s have declined greatly, along with pheasants. But, we've lost most our pheasant hunters while anywhere I see - bowhunters have been on the rise. Would you support an "early pheasant season" (or a special crossbow, hawk hunting, bow & arrow, etc. pheasant season) AND why don't you think we see those types of things being proposed every year???????
 
JNRBRONC said:
I wonder about the NR/outfitter angle on this proposed legislation.
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The only angle I can see is Rep. Windschitl has introduced legislation in the past that was about NR hunting. HF 390 in 2009 (and carried over to 2010) and HF 2238 in 2010. Both died in Committee.

I'm not ready to say there is an NR angle but based on past bills he has sponsored it is a possibility.

On the outfitter side more seasons mean more possibilities of putting johns in trees. Having said that, if you increase the seasons (bow) you decrease the pressure (same amount of resident hunters and the same number of NR tags over more days of season). Decreased pressure means why not issue more NR tags that can go into the early season? Huh, I guess there is an NR connection. Not this year but who thinks in one year increments?

On a personal note, I have absolutely no desire to kill a velvet buck that an early season would afford me. To me shooting a velvet buck is like opening a barrel of good bourbon before it has finished aging or picking fruit and vegetables before they are ripe. Again, personally I put velvet bucks in the same category as shed and button bucks.
 
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150 Class said:
Please do supply these stats. Specifically, the less immature bucks piece.
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Ok, I am not finding the Iowa source, out of all the states, it's one that isn't recorded even though I believe I've seen stats on that before. So, sorry, I stand corrected there BUT - see attached, which uniquely blanks out Iowa (why I can't find the stats)....
http://www.qdma.com/uploads/pdf/WR2013.pdf

MIDWEST STATES (let's talk similar and not places like way out west and way down south. Areas with ag/timber mix in similar climates to Iowa)....
% bucks killed in each state (I kinda averaged it out from stats above)-
ILLINOIS, about 40%
INDIANA, about 38%
MICHIGAN, about 57%
MINNESOTA, 41%
MISSOURI (Antler point restriction areas): about 20%
MISSOURI (No APR areas): about 48%
(look what a little more wiggle room on what you're allowed to shoot, one regulation can do to harvest stats, wow. Not saying we need APR's here but pretty crazy impact regs can have).
NEBRASKA, about 26%
OHIO, 48%
WISCONSIN, about 51%.

IOWA???? I can't find them, if I recalled right, I thought I remember seeing something in the 25% ballpark but yes, I could be wrong on that & that's a guess from what I thought I recall seeing. Fully admit, I cannot find it though and I could be wrong there. I think most of us simply believe Iowa has way fewer 1.5's killed than most midwestern states but I'll leave that up to each person to form their thoughts there. If you came from a state like Michigan and hunted places like mentioned above and then spent many years in Iowa - I think those folks could chime in pretty quick on what they've seen here vs those other places. You win on the ability of me to find the Iowa stats alone, I stand corrected on that thus far (I'll keep digging ;) )


So, that's my reply. How about you get back to me on your opinion about my anology on pheasants, the regulation changes for pheasant seasons and why you think we only get bombarded with the deer stuff. My last question, please reply to that if you would after giving some thought to it.
 
I bet 40-50% of bucks killed in Iowa are 1.5 years old or less. About 20% alone are button bucks. I could believe another 20-30% out of the remaining bucks are 1.5 or less.
 
I absolutely wish less little bucks got killed, no doubt. I sure don't want to enact new regs, seasons, etc that will allow even more to be killed.
*OPINION part, 2 cents that wasn't asked for ;) .... I shot some as a KID, a NEW HUNTER, it was great and will welcome my son to do it someday- for me, this changed after about the 3rd season, even in MICHIGAN I would pass them (where almost everyone shot the 1st one they saw). Grown men shooting year old bucks year after year after year - just kinda drives me insane. Especially in a state like Iowa where no matter where I go or what area, I see multiple 2-3 year olds every time I hunt. But, whatever, I won't stir that pot anymore.

Keep the frigin regs the same and let's JOIN HANDS ACROSS IOWA TO PUSH A NEW "EARLY PHEASANT SEASON"!!!! ARE YOU GUYS WITH ME!!!?!?! I am just stumped why these politicians aren't flooding us with new Pheasant and Turkey Bills all the time?!?!?!? :rolleyes::confused:;)
 
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This is one of the responses I got from my email. It is almost predictable. Special Interest (insurance) groups make for bad policies. Anybody have some hard data about contributions made by insurance companies? This was a response from a Democrat.

I am writing on behalf of Representative Liz Bennett HD-65 (Linn) in response to your letter of outreach. Rep. Bennett thanks you for your interest and support of what she and other members of the Natural Resource Committee are discussing as ways forward concerning one of Iowa’s most precious natural resources: wildlife. As an Eagle Scout from Cedar Rapids who was the youngest ever in our BSA district to earn the William T. Hornaday Award for Conservation, I myself and concerned with the future of Iowa’s natural resources and ways in which our state can protect them. However, as you may be aware, bow hunting in Iowa is not only a treasured pastime for many sportsmen but has also been consistently utilized by cities, including in and around Cedar Rapids and Iowa City to maintain herd numbers as a means to reducing deer-car accidents. Rep. Bennett is looking forward to discussing how best to encourage more natural resource conservation measures while working with local cities and the state to find ways to reduce deer-automobile accidents, a serious concern for her district which has not seen significantly decreased numbers of deer-car collisions over the past decades.
We will keep in touch as the legislative session continues and as changes to current bills are made after much needed public imput like yours. Thank you for making Iowa your new home!

All the best,

Evan D. Anderson, Clerk
Writing on Behalf of Representative Liz Bennett
Liz.bennett@legis.iowa.gov
(515)281-3221
 
The urban bow hunts already start earlier than Oct 1 - generally when the youth season starts. If this is about urban hunts, where there are some very overpopulated areas, this bill should focus only on those hunts.
 
Oh ya, URBAN HUNTS. And a Holiday Deer Season, I think for NR's I think I saw? I stand corrected.... Iowa does not have 6 deer seasons, it has 8!!! Really not enough opportunities in Iowa for deer for the guy/gal wants to make it happen. Year round hunting really is the only fair system. Let's just keep adding Bills each year to eventually bridge that gap with the part of the year that's closed. We're close, let's keep our politicians going, we'll get to year round after a few more rounds of legislation if we keep pushing.
 
IowaBowHunter1983 said:
This is one of the responses I got from my email. It is almost predictable. Special Interest (insurance) groups make for bad policies. Anybody have some hard data about contributions made by insurance companies? This was a response from a Democrat.

I am writing on behalf of Representative Liz Bennett HD-65 (Linn) in response to your letter of outreach. Rep. Bennett thanks you for your interest and support of what she and other members of the Natural Resource Committee are discussing as ways forward concerning one of Iowa’s most precious natural resources: wildlife. As an Eagle Scout from Cedar Rapids who was the youngest ever in our BSA district to earn the William T. Hornaday Award for Conservation, I myself and concerned with the future of Iowa’s natural resources and ways in which our state can protect them. However, as you may be aware, bow hunting in Iowa is not only a treasured pastime for many sportsmen but has also been consistently utilized by cities, including in and around Cedar Rapids and Iowa City to maintain herd numbers as a means to reducing deer-car accidents. Rep. Bennett is looking forward to discussing how best to encourage more natural resource conservation measures while working with local cities and the state to find ways to reduce deer-automobile accidents, a serious concern for her district which has not seen significantly decreased numbers of deer-car collisions over the past decades.
We will keep in touch as the legislative session continues and as changes to current bills are made after much needed public imput like yours. Thank you for making Iowa your new home!

All the best,

Evan D. Anderson, Clerk
Writing on Behalf of Representative Liz Bennett
Liz.bennett@legis.iowa.gov
(515)281-3221
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Evan needs to check his facts! Iowa City is ANTI-urban hunt, hires White Buffalo to shoot them in the head with HP over bait in the middle of the night so the tree huggers can pull the pillows up over their heads so as not to hear it.

I'll let the typos in his brief message slide, more interest in it being factual.

Coralville does have an urban hunt.
 
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