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Native Warm Season Grass

Re: NWSG Herbicide

THANKS!!!
Sorry for the additional question I forgot earlier...
I am frost seeding CIR alone into killed (mowed then killed) brome grass.

Would I also use the Bicep II Magnum in this instance OR would you go for the Atrazine (and maybe round-up too) only here?

Timing of the spraying???? THANKS!!!
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide

i have a 2 acre plot killed dead and dead over again in aug and sep and will frost seed straight cir in late feb, early march. My question is that dbltree mentioned thatch will absorb some of the atrazine. I have a somewhat heavy layer of that in spots so with my first shot of atrazine should I go more than 4 qts per acre???
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide

Is your plot in Michigan or Iowa? As I understand the Atrazine laws in Iowa 4 quarts to the acre would be against the rules, but it may be OK in Michigan. I can't answer the "will it help" aspect of your question, I'm just trying to keep you outta trouble and Atrazine outta my well water.

The 'Bonker
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide

I would suggest adding Dual Magnum or using Bicep Magnum as a way to lower atrazine to legal levels and take advantage of Dual's ability to control foxtail.

I think 2 quarts per acre of Atrazine is the legal federal maximum for switchgrass.

Bonker has valid concerns about atrazine as we all do and should so I shouldn't be advocating higher then legal levels.

I know that one time applications applied on sod will never end up in our waterways and establishing stands of prariegrass ensures that herbicides applied year after year on neighboring fields will be absorbed by my switchgrass.

If the switch seeding fails then a means of slowing the runoff fails with it, hence my reasoning... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Follow the legal federal suggested rates for any herbicides to be safe... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

Seems that "hard to get" Plateau herbicde now has a generic alternative!

Panoramic 2SL is imazapic just like Plateau and safe for Plateau tolerant native grasses and forbs.

I'm sure it can be ordered thru any ag supply outlet that sells herbicides but I did locate this source as well.

Panoramic 2SL herbicide source

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">PANORAMIC 2SL REGISTERED FOR WEED
CONTROL IN PASTURES

A new herbicide for pasture weed control was registered for
use in Kentucky. Panoramic 2SL contains the active ingredient
imazapic.

Panoramic 2SL can be used in pastures, rangeland,non-crop areas, and establishment of native prairie sites.

The active ingredient, imazapic, is also sold as <u>Plateau.</u>

Wording on the Panoramic 2SL and Plateau label are similar
but read and follow directions on the specific product.

Panoramic 2SL and Plateau are formulated as ammonium salt and contain 2.0 lbs of the free imazapic acid per gallon. </div></div>

All through this thread I have talked about how awesome Plateau is for establishing Native Grasses Mixes but then it was taken off the market except through certain places like through Pheasants Forever.

Imazapic at higher rates will severely injure new switchgrass seedlings, so I like to frost seed switch into a native mix the following winter. Once established I have found imazapic will release switchgrass and it seems impervious to this herbicide.

It's expensive but so is native grass seed and herbicide will allow it to thrive the seeding year! /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

i was going to frost seed native grass & forbs into some corn that i brushhoged down. will i get good soil to seed contact or am i better off working the ground,and then plant.
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

can you rake and bale the corn 1st? If its a smaller area maybe you could rake it into piles and burn it ?
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 12 point</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i was going to frost seed native grass & forbs into some corn that i brushhoged down. will i get good soil to seed contact or am i better off working the ground,and then plant. </div></div>

It will work that way because corn stubble is pretty coarse and winter snow/spring rains will push seed off the stalks and stubble to the soil below.

If you have any that is quite heavy you can burn it as hillrunner noted or have someone with a big roundbaler bale it up for you but...I think I would just seed it as is..... /forum/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

Give me a few weeks I have applied for my dealer licence Thru the State of iowa for herbicides and could carry Panoramic Ill keep you all posted Thanks
 
Re: NWSG Herbicide - Generic Plateau

Anyone know what a really good price on Bicep II Magnum would be per gallon or 2&1/2 gallon?????
Atrazine???

Where are you all seeing the best prices on stuff like that IF you did find some great prices?
 
I posted these pics several years ago and just bringing them back up to show that warm season grasses can be burned or sprayed early in the spring because they are still dormant:



Big Bluestem on April 19th:

04-17BigBluestem.jpg


Little Bluestem:

04-17LittleBluestem.jpg


Switchgrass:

04-17Switchgrass.jpg


This is an area at the edge of my prairie along a lane...so you can see that cool seasons are the only thing green at this point:

Aprilsodcomparison.jpg


Everyone is tempted to burn in March or early April but that defeats the purpose as it encouurages cool seasons to explode long beofore the native grass has woke up from it's winter nap.

Wait until very late April through late May to burn native grass stands because doing so will set back cool season invasive grasses and then allow natives to dominate.

If you are spraying any type of grass herbicide including roundup, check the bases of the clumps carefully for growth before doing so. I prefer no later then late April and usually shoot for mid April to be safe.

Established stands are likely to "wake" up before newly planted or first year seedings but established stands usually can be better managed by timely burning every 3-5 years with a late spring burn...:way:
 
New Planting in central Wi

Planning on planting around 10 acres of the cp-25 mix next spring. The darn NCRS won't let me plant just switchgrass as I would prefer. They were very nice about it, they just have to go by the rules as it is going into CREP.
These fields were chiseled plowed about 10 years ago, enrolled in crp, and no maintenance done what so ever. I recently bought this land which now attaches to my other land. This ground is unbelievably rough !!!!!!!
Any help with my plan would be appreciated,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I'm cutting the brush now with chainsaw and brushog. Plan on spraying with roundup as the grasses green up. Then will dig and disc till level. As wet as it is here, I don't think I'll have enough time to plant soybeans. This is very low and damp ground by the way!
Once level or done, I would plan on spraying with roundup probably 2 more times or so with the last one in fall as any cool season grasses emerge again.
I would probably drill in mid-November or so before the snows come. Would do in March, but time window is so iffy from snowmelt to too wet to get into this area next spring. Would try to spray in spring with roundup again at first green-up (mid- April or so) killing any grasses that survived, well before the planted grasses started.
I'm guessing there is no spring herbicide (i.e. atrazine ) to use as too many grasses and flowers in mix they want me to use ?????????
Would include pics, but can't figure out how to attach.
Thanks for any advice,
Tom
 
I doubt if you'll have to spray roundup next spring if you kill it all summer and fall. Panoramic, Plateau or Journey can all be used on native warm season grass mixes but they are very expensive and hard on switchgrass.

Check the herbicide thread for labels and if you decide you want some most ag supply/farm elevators can order it for you.

I prefer to leave the switchgrass out and seed it the following winter if Panoramic or Plateau is used so that it's not harmed by the herbicide.

email me pics if you like dbltree2000@yahoo.com and I'll post them for you.:)
 
Here's a link to a smaller size of Panoramic NWSG herbicide (like Plateau), still very expensive but for smaller areas it at least offers an affordable solution. ;)

Panoramic 1 qt

PANORAMIC™ 2SL Label

I used 10-12 ounces of Plateau per acre and Panoramic is along the same lines as far as doage.

One quart will only do roughly 3 acres depending on how much one decides to apply which means cost would run nearly $50 an acre.

For most killing the sod the fall before and clipping the weeds 8-12" high the first few years will be more cost effective...:)
 
Good points Paul,

Mid to late April is a great time to burn to stimulate NWSG and set back cool seasons. For the fortunate people that have great forbes in with NWSG I would not recommend burning at that time every year or some of those forbes may be phased out. I would also add some august-september burns to the mix to stimulate the beneficial forbes.
 
Wet Spring

I have plans to replace 7 acres of brome and weeds with CP-25 along the north edge of my wetlands. The area is typically high and dry but has wanted to stay wet all this Spring. I burned in early April and it was the 2nd week of May before I could get my tractor in to spray with roundup. The rains have not cooperated and the area has been wetter than we would have liked to drill the seed.

With the forecast for more rain this weekend, I am leaning towards planting in the Fall. The plan now is to let whatever wants to grow this summer grow, mow mid-August, roundup early September and drill the CP-25 in November.

Does this sound like the correct thing to do? The other option is to plant beans and drill into the beans so I get something out of the area, but it will most ilkely push my food plot per acre over the CRP limit.

Thoughts?

Thanks
 
I am sure Dbltree will have a response and a far better one BUT if it were ME: if you were going to plant in the fall- I'd wait to put all the stuff in during FEBRUARY. I'd make sure if I had switchgrass in the mix, I got it in when things were thawing and freezing still. I'd kill the heck out of it several times after I mowed it, I'd hit it late summer and again as late in the fall as you can while it's still growing so as few weeds come up as possible (2 times really isn't required BUT I would rather overkill things than have a bunch of re-growth which is all to common. Some extra Round-up spraying isn't that big of expense on 7 acres anyways and will insure excellent kill) .

Kill like a mad-man this fall (RR beans will make that area AWESOME for planting)- get stuff in the ground in February (drill or frost seed) IMO. *If you could do beans there- can't beat that!!!! I'd do that for sure if you can!!

Now, since you are adding FORBS to the mix (cp-25) it will change things, you can't add atrazine to the mix of plans. You'll be mowing next summer, just means it'll take longer. Dbltree will have a far better response too.... :)
 
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if you were going to plant in the fall- I'd wait to put all the stuff in during FEBRUARY
Click to expand...

I have drilled in late November but results were mediocre compared to frost seeding mid winter (late Jan thru early March)

Use the same drill to plant right into frozen killed sod and you'll have better results.

Just don't tell the the NRCS guys because they have rules to follow that don't always line up with the best method. ;)
 
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