whitetail fanatic
Member
quote: "With all the tree/shrub area you already have planted, I think I would still plant switch in that field. 
"
Thanks DT, I will put CIR SG in there.
Quote: "Any chance you could plant corn down the center of that field and switch all the way around it? That would be awesome if possible!!"
Actually, just to the left of where I was standing when I took that picture, we have 5.1 acres of standing corn right now. We will always have our best winter food plots (corn and rape) in this area of the property so the switchgrass should be a good addtion here. To the right of where I'm standing we have the switchgrass that we planted this past year (pictures were posted in August I think). The deer are using the SG as "loafing areas" when they come and go to the food plots. Should be some sheds around later this winter! Pheasants love to use the SG and corn, it's great for them having the SG cover right next to the corn. I will try to get some picutres to show what it looks like now.
" Thanks DT, I will put CIR SG in there.
Quote: "Any chance you could plant corn down the center of that field and switch all the way around it? That would be awesome if possible!!"
Actually, just to the left of where I was standing when I took that picture, we have 5.1 acres of standing corn right now. We will always have our best winter food plots (corn and rape) in this area of the property so the switchgrass should be a good addtion here. To the right of where I'm standing we have the switchgrass that we planted this past year (pictures were posted in August I think). The deer are using the SG as "loafing areas" when they come and go to the food plots. Should be some sheds around later this winter! Pheasants love to use the SG and corn, it's great for them having the SG cover right next to the corn. I will try to get some picutres to show what it looks like now.
BIGJEEPMAN
New Member
Hi I am new to this site. I have a few questions? I am clear cutting an acre or two,I will cut the stumps off tight to the ground and burn all leafs and brush. I have a small tractor with a digger for the back to ruff up the dirt. Do you think that I will be able to get switch grass started. I need the switch grass for bedding cover, my woods is to open. I like the idea that you can't see through it very good. Hard woods on high ground is hard to keep deer in. My land was logged back in the 80's and has thined out, and when it was first done it still was to open. I would like to seed this summer and frost seed over it the next spring will this work. I need bedding cover fast. Thank you
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Daver
PMA Member
First things first, welcome to the site! Then I would read back through this whole thread, there is a ton of good info already written.
But from the sounds of your situation, I would probably go this way...
Go ahead and do your clear cut this winter/early spring and clear the debris(leaves, etc), but I would not rough up the ground. I would let nature take it's own course and once that ground sees some sunlight this summer things will sprout like crazy on their own.
Be ready to mow the wild brush back two or three times this summer and follow each mowing with a spraying of 24DB and/or Roundup. You basically want to nuke the new growth real good and send it into the fall dead. Then, about the middle of February to early March next year you can frost seed switch. You may even want to buy the switch this year and keep it well stored for a year, I am told that it germinates better that way. You may also want to think about using Atrazine next year too.
Others can and will add to this and/or correct it as necessary, but I think this basic outline will give you a really good, clear stand of switch by next summer. This is not the only way you could go, but it is one way.
letemgrow
PMA Member
I would go with frost seeding switch after you have the area cleared and sprayed a time or two. You may have to treat the stumps with something to keep them from re-sprouting, since spraying with a 2% roundup solution is usually not enough to kill the stump sprouts unless they are small trees. Spray after you burn to kill any regrowth, but I would see what you have already growing there after you clear and burn before you spray cause you may have a lot of NWSG there already.
whitetail fanatic
Member
BIGJEEPMAN, what species of trees are mainly growing in the area that you are clearcutting? If it was my place here in WI, I would just let nature take it's course and don't do anything after you clear cut the woods. Within 2 or 3 years, the brush and saplings that sprout plus the shoots that resprout from the cut stumps will make some of the best deer bedding and browsing you could ever ask for. If you really want the switchgrass, follow the advice already given, but I would plant any open fields with switchgrass and let the clear cut woods grow into excellent bedding themselves.
Also, if your woods hasn't been logged since the 80's I would definitely have it logged ASAP or thin a lot of the trees that don't have high lumber value yourself to open the canopy and thicken up your woods. That is the easiest way I know of to create excellent deer bedding areas. Good luck!
Also, if your woods hasn't been logged since the 80's I would definitely have it logged ASAP or thin a lot of the trees that don't have high lumber value yourself to open the canopy and thicken up your woods. That is the easiest way I know of to create excellent deer bedding areas. Good luck!
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BIGJEEPMAN
New Member
Whitetail fanatic I own a 40 and most of it is a hill, and it is mostly hard wood. I have cut bedding spots for the deer to bed,hinge cut trees,cut stumps high. I have land owners next to my land that have slash and clear cuts, and you can see in them good,deer do use them a little and this helps, but it is still to open. I have 1 small swamp on my land and it is brushey next to it. I just need something differant to help keep deer on my land. When we get snow you can see through my woods. I do cut wood to heat our home and try to make more bedding as I go. I have a few food plots,and 3 small water holes for the deer. I have been a member of the QDM for 9 years and have 4 nice bucks to show for it(and missed a few), just want to make it better. I will read more. Thanks guys
whitetail fanatic
Member
If my pictures for this post aren't up yet, please check back later. I'm hoping dbltree can post them for me. Thanks dbltree!
Our first year switchgrass was very thick and at least 5 feet tall until we got a heavy snow on December 9. Now about half of the grass is laying down under the snow. I checked on a field of SG a day or two ago that is only a few miles from ours and it is all standing tall and thick. That field has been around for many years, so I'm wondering if it makes a big difference that ours was only in its first growing season and that is why it got knocked down so bad? It seems to me like maybe when the SG is more fully develeoped (after 3 years) it will have bigger clumps and this would improve the "standability" in heavier snows? What do you think? Will ours stand up better after it's second or third growing season? The other difference between our first year SG and the other field that is still standing is that the standing SG field was not as tall or thick as ours. The clumps and stalks were more spread out. It seems like that allowed the snow to "sift" down through the stalks better without knocking it over, but on ours it was so thick the snow just collected on the upper parts of the stalks and knocked it right over. Has anyone noticed any difference in standability between SG fields that are seeded very thick vs. less thickly seeded? Ours was planted very thick, about 10 pounds PLS per acre. Makes me wonder if 6 pounds is better for this reason? The standing SG field is on DNR land and it looks great now, if a deer was bedded 15 yards away you could not see it in that SG field. Sorry I don't have pictures of the other field that is standing, but the switchgrass in that field is all up and thick. I'm not sure what variety the SG is on the DNR land.
Here is our first year CIR SG in August:
Here is our first year CIR SG now:
Our first year switchgrass was very thick and at least 5 feet tall until we got a heavy snow on December 9. Now about half of the grass is laying down under the snow. I checked on a field of SG a day or two ago that is only a few miles from ours and it is all standing tall and thick. That field has been around for many years, so I'm wondering if it makes a big difference that ours was only in its first growing season and that is why it got knocked down so bad? It seems to me like maybe when the SG is more fully develeoped (after 3 years) it will have bigger clumps and this would improve the "standability" in heavier snows? What do you think? Will ours stand up better after it's second or third growing season? The other difference between our first year SG and the other field that is still standing is that the standing SG field was not as tall or thick as ours. The clumps and stalks were more spread out. It seems like that allowed the snow to "sift" down through the stalks better without knocking it over, but on ours it was so thick the snow just collected on the upper parts of the stalks and knocked it right over. Has anyone noticed any difference in standability between SG fields that are seeded very thick vs. less thickly seeded? Ours was planted very thick, about 10 pounds PLS per acre. Makes me wonder if 6 pounds is better for this reason? The standing SG field is on DNR land and it looks great now, if a deer was bedded 15 yards away you could not see it in that SG field. Sorry I don't have pictures of the other field that is standing, but the switchgrass in that field is all up and thick. I'm not sure what variety the SG is on the DNR land.
Here is our first year CIR SG in August:
Here is our first year CIR SG now:
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Hi, I was gonnna frost seed some cir switch in a existing 1 yr old stand to try and get it a little "fuller". There's prob about 10" of crusty snow on the area now. Question is should I go ahead and broadcast it now or hold off awhile? Also what would you seed it at? 3-4# ac?
Thanks...
Thanks...
dbltree
Super Moderator
A little snow is all right but that much snow can "move" seed around if it melts suddenly. I would wait until you have a thaw and most of the snow is gone.
I think you'll find that your stand will thicken up anyway the second year but adding a few pounds per acre this winter won't hurt anything...
whitetail fanatic
Member
quote: "Also the area I have it planted in floods every spring from the snow runoff.
I probably should wait till after that? I suppose that close to spring it wouldn't benifit anyways??"
Last spring, before I knew about frost seeding, I tilled our soil (big no-no) and planted our CIR SG around April 1st here in SW WI. It must have had enough cold/chill to stratify and bring it out of dormancy because it germinated very well and it ended up very thick, as you can see in the pictures taken in August in the previous postings. We always get lots of freezing nights until mid April, so I would think if you could get it in by mid March, or as soon as the snow melt floods go away, you should get it to germinate if the seed makes good enough soil contact. Of course you will miss some of the best freeze/thaw action if it's done after mid March, but it might still be enough to get the seed into the top layer of soil and stratify it. Did you have good weed control in that field last year? When does the flood water usually go down in that area? Your snow situation sounds like it is here. What part of WI are you in? I have some fields prepared for frost seeding CIR SG whenever we lose most of this snow. It could be awhile before that happens.
I probably should wait till after that? I suppose that close to spring it wouldn't benifit anyways??"
Last spring, before I knew about frost seeding, I tilled our soil (big no-no) and planted our CIR SG around April 1st here in SW WI. It must have had enough cold/chill to stratify and bring it out of dormancy because it germinated very well and it ended up very thick, as you can see in the pictures taken in August in the previous postings. We always get lots of freezing nights until mid April, so I would think if you could get it in by mid March, or as soon as the snow melt floods go away, you should get it to germinate if the seed makes good enough soil contact. Of course you will miss some of the best freeze/thaw action if it's done after mid March, but it might still be enough to get the seed into the top layer of soil and stratify it. Did you have good weed control in that field last year? When does the flood water usually go down in that area? Your snow situation sounds like it is here. What part of WI are you in? I have some fields prepared for frost seeding CIR SG whenever we lose most of this snow. It could be awhile before that happens.
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I'm in Nw WI, I did the Atrazine last summer and mowed it a bunch of times. I started to see some plants here with seed heads on them late in the fall. The are floods but there is no "run off" it just pools there till it soaks in the ground, so it might work doing it before the spring melts come?
Thanks
Thanks
Dbl Tree,
I thought I read that you were going to trial using OUST as a preemergent for you new switchgrass stands. I was wondering if you had an opinion on that. I can probably get some atrizine but not as easily as oust. If you think oust would be as effective at what rate would you apply it? I believe I used 5 ounces per acre for some tree plantings I am having done.
I thought I read that you were going to trial using OUST as a preemergent for you new switchgrass stands. I was wondering if you had an opinion on that. I can probably get some atrizine but not as easily as oust. If you think oust would be as effective at what rate would you apply it? I believe I used 5 ounces per acre for some tree plantings I am having done.
dbltree
Super Moderator
I have used Oust on my fall spraying but it will be spring before I can test it compared to atrazine. I have applied Oust to established switch and big blue and it didn't phase it but the label says allow 3 months after applying 2 ounces of Oust before switch emerges.
I need to test that to see what really happens but in the meantime you can use simazine instead of atrazine...
whitetail fanatic
Member
dbltree, what is the latest time of year that you have seen switchgrass frost seeded and gotten a good germination and stand?
dbltree
Super Moderator
Very late March and sometimes early April if it's a cold wet spring but earlier in the winter is better to insure a long enough period of cold wet chill.
Remember dormancy varies widely and depends on the age of the seed as well, some switch may have low dormancy while others it is extremely high.
Someone sent me a seed tag that had 86% dormant switch seed! Not a problem though if dormant planted in winter.
bigbuckingdeer
New Member
Atrazine VS Simazine
Which have you guys had better luck with when using these herbicides? I have a leftover jug of Simazine in the barn so was wanting to use that. Is there a LIMIT on how much Simazine can be used on CIR before it hurts/kills it?
Learning lots about Switch and looking forward to my first planting of it this winter.
Which have you guys had better luck with when using these herbicides? I have a leftover jug of Simazine in the barn so was wanting to use that. Is there a LIMIT on how much Simazine can be used on CIR before it hurts/kills it?
Learning lots about Switch and looking forward to my first planting of it this winter.